QueenBee
Posts: 1564
Joined: Sun Aug 08, 2010 5:14 pm
Delivery Date: 20 Jun 2011
Leaf Number: 2062
Location: Portland

Re: Early Capacity Losses-Was(Lost a bar...down to 11)

Wed Jul 18, 2012 3:55 pm

TomT wrote:It's significantly different for two reasons:

1) Your ICE gas tank does not have a limited 73 mile (EPA) gas tank capacity so a small decrease in range is not noticeable or problematic like it is on the Leaf...
2) When you return from the harsh environment in your ICE, the range will return to normal. It won't in your Leaf...
OrientExpress wrote: If you operated an ICE car in a harsh environment like the Arizona desert, and complained that the MPGs it got was less than cars operated in less harsh environments, what do you think the response from the manufacturer would be? Especially if they told you up front that its MPG would be less.
And a better analogy is that you buy an ICE car that is expected to last 15 years but instead you have to replace the engine after 7.5 years because you live in a hot area because the manufacturer didn't include a big enough radiator to handle the climate in your state.

shrink
Posts: 360
Joined: Sun Aug 07, 2011 11:21 pm
Delivery Date: 26 Jun 2012
Leaf Number: 21842
Location: Phoenix, AZ

Re: Early Capacity Losses-Was(Lost a bar...down to 11)

Wed Jul 18, 2012 3:56 pm

OrientExpress wrote: It appears that 99+% of LEAF early adopting enthusiasts are having an excellent experience with their cars, and that says that the future for Nissan and other EVs manufacturers is bright. Nissan has done a great job in bolstering the faith of the vast majority of early adopters, But with that said, of the other .0001% of owners that feel that they are not having a good experience, even they feel that overall the car is a very good one.
Tell that to the guy in the news story who lost 3 capacity bars.
OrientExpress wrote: If you operated an ICE car in a harsh environment like the Arizona desert, and complained that the MPGs it got was less than cars operated in less harsh environments, what do you think the response from the manufacturer would be? Especially if they told you up front that its MPG would be less.
My ICE cars did just fine in the "harsh environment like the Arizona desert." Believe it or not, the winters are mild and we have highs in the 80's in March. Any hit to MPG comes back in the non-summer months. I don't think a heat-degraded battery will have as good as a recovery. The only issue was - surprise - changing the accessory battery more often than when I lived back East. And last week my Volt got 54 electric miles in Arizona on a single charge, followed by 41 mpg on the gas range extender.

Your denial is disturbing and bordering on delusional. I'm sure all the other affected AZ owners, especially the owner in the video who can barely make his daily commute, appreciate your support.
2011 LEAF (Sold) | 2012 Volt (Sold) | 2012 LEAF (Lease Ended) | 2010 Tesla Roadster #501 | 2013 Tesla Model S #9001 | 6.827 kW SunPower PV System

HXGuy
Posts: 56
Joined: Wed May 16, 2012 12:44 am
Delivery Date: 16 May 2012
Location: Phoenix, AZ

Re: Early Capacity Losses-Was(Lost a bar...down to 11)

Wed Jul 18, 2012 4:05 pm

shrink wrote: And last week my Volt got 54 electric miles in Arizona on a single charge, followed by 41 mpg on the gas range extender.
I was actually thinking about the Volts earlier today...has anyone experienced or heard of anyone who has that their Volt for 1+ years in Phoenix that their electric range has gone down at all?

shrink
Posts: 360
Joined: Sun Aug 07, 2011 11:21 pm
Delivery Date: 26 Jun 2012
Leaf Number: 21842
Location: Phoenix, AZ

Re: Early Capacity Losses-Was(Lost a bar...down to 11)

Wed Jul 18, 2012 4:10 pm

HXGuy wrote: I was actually thinking about the Volts earlier today...has anyone experienced or heard of anyone who has that their Volt for 1+ years in Phoenix that their electric range has gone down at all?
No

http://www.hybridcars.com/news/gm-tweak ... 46843.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
While GM has milked an incremental gain in energy density, it also reports “tests have revealed less battery degradation,” not that there were known problems before.
2011 LEAF (Sold) | 2012 Volt (Sold) | 2012 LEAF (Lease Ended) | 2010 Tesla Roadster #501 | 2013 Tesla Model S #9001 | 6.827 kW SunPower PV System

jstack6
Posts: 137
Joined: Tue Dec 21, 2010 12:32 pm
Delivery Date: 28 Sep 2012
Location: Chandler Arizona

Re: Early Capacity Losses-Was(Lost a bar...down to 11)

Wed Jul 18, 2012 4:23 pm

Last night 7-17-2012 in Phoenix TV5 was alerted and did a report on the LEAF's that have lost capacity. IT'S EVERY LEAF in the area not just a few. If we all keep reporting it maybe we will get some action. All Nissan needs to do is add a fan. Right now it's all passive with no air flow when parked in a hot parking lot or garage.

All other EVs have at least fan cooling and some have liquid cooling like the TESLA and FORD Focus. Even the CODA has active cooling. Nissan has to work on this problem. A new pack would just go bad again. Other EVs also use a lithium chemistry that is much more tolerant of heat. Nissan has both a low heat battery and NO ACTIVE cooling. Double Trouble.

A prototype SCAN GAUGE I have shows I've lost 17% already in only 13,400 miles and 1 1/2 year. By the end of 5 years I'll be lucky to have 50% and we park in the shade and only charge to 80%. Many have lostr 1 to 2 bars, a few have already lost 3. It's not a linear loss so the first bar is big at about 18% then each one is less but it doesn't help range.

:cry:

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LEAFer
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Re: Early Capacity Losses-Was(Lost a bar...down to 11)

Wed Jul 18, 2012 4:25 pm

opossum wrote:CHANNEL 5 will be at our happy hour tonight to work on the follow-up story! Please attend if you can!
... our HAPPY hour ???!!!? Boy, you AZies have a strange sense of humor !



( Sorry could not resist :lol: )
2011 Silver SL+QC [Mfg: 11/2010] 36mo/15k LEASE
06Jun2013 Status [28.5 months][34,173 miles][11 bars]
Lost CapacityBar 6/6/13 @34,173 miles while in LEAF Battery Monitor: 83.41%, 71.4F (avg); cool overnight;

opossum
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Delivery Date: 21 Mar 2011
Leaf Number: 500
Location: Phoenix, AZ

Re: Early Capacity Losses-Was(Lost a bar...down to 11)

Wed Jul 18, 2012 4:27 pm

vrwl wrote:Give them the URL for the Wiki so they can see HOW MANY people are REALLY affected! (not just 5)
Fear not, my friend! Heather Moore has compiled quite a bit of information for the follow up story. I have also sent her a number of things, including the current list of reported capacity bar losers. She is compiling quite a bit of information that will contradict Mark Perry's statements.
azdre/opossum, Phoenix, 3/21/11 purchase, 10/2/12 lemon law return.
23k miles, 3 bars lost, officially rated "normal" by Nissan

azdre
Posts: 171
Joined: Fri Sep 03, 2010 7:28 am
Location: Phoenix, AZ

Re: Early Capacity Losses-Was(Lost a bar...down to 11)

Wed Jul 18, 2012 4:32 pm

Added a few by their request. I'll get more details from them later and repost.


1. Azdre -
4/26/12, 16,624 miles, 14 months lost 1st Bar.
6/7/2012, Range Test, 5mi/kWh, 100% to LBW: 58.6 miles (NTB: 75-85 miles expected)
6/9/12, 18,822 miles, 76.1% ScanGauge w/ 100% charge.
6/14/12, ~19,000 miles, lost 2nd Bar.
6/30/12, ~19,850 miles, 71.8% ScanGauge w/ 100% charge. Phoenix
2. bturner - May 12, 2012. 13.6K/12 months. Phoenix (2nd bar loss reported 7/7/2012)
3. turbo2ltr - May 18, 2012. 13K/15 months. Phoenix (2nd bar loss reported 6/29/2012)
4. TickTock - May 20, 2012. 14K/12 months Phoenix (2nd bar loss reported 7/10/1012)
5. Volusiano - May 20, 2012. 16.5K/12 months. Phoenix
6. Mark13 - May 22, 2012. 15.7K/12 months. Phoenix (2nd bar loss reported 7/1/2012)
7. Leafkabob - May 26, 2012. 9.5K/12 months. Phoenix
8. Cyellen - June 7, 2012. 10.2K/ 14 months. Phoenix
9. RickS - June 10, 2012. 11.3K/13 months. Phoenix
10. Pipcecil - June 17, 2012. 20.2K/12 months. Dallas, Texas
11. Phxsmiley - June 17, 2012. 13.7K/10 months. Phoenix
12. AZknauer - June 17, 2012. 9.2K/13.5 months. Phoenix
13. Myleaf - June 19, 2012. 13.3K/14 months. Phoenix
14. johndoe74 - June 5, 2012. 13.5K/ 9 months. Phoenix
15. Matt Ferris - June 20, 2012. 15K/ 12 months. Dallas, Texas
16. Shrink - June 21, 2012. 10.2K/ 10.5 months. Phoenix (sold that Leaf, replaced w/leased '12 Leaf)
17. ravi100 - June 24, 2012. 13.1K/ 13.5 months. Southlake, Texas (no longer has Leaf)
18. ev4me - approx. June 1, 2012. 7K/ 15 mos. Phoenix (Dropped 2 bars)
19. jspearman - June 28, 2012, ?/10.5 months. Phoenix
20. Leafwing - July 05, 2012, 13.5K/15 months, Plano, TX.
21. GerryAZ - July 05, 2012, ?/?, Phoenix
22. ecoobsessive - July 6, 2012, 13K/13 months, San Antonio, TX
23. jhm614 - May 15, 2012, 25K/14.5 months, Arlington, TX (2nd bar loss reported on 7/7/2012)
24. DarkDave - June 15, 2012, ~8.5K/14.5 months, Phoenix, AZ
25. JasonT - July 14, 2012 ~25.2K/15 months, Tucson, AZ
26. Kolmstead - July 16,2012, 14.3K/19 months, Ridgecrest, CA
27. rjzastaury - June ? 2012, ?/12 months, Tuscon, AZ
28. LeafLady - July 18, 2012, 12.7K/11 months, Location unknown
29. Scott Yarosh - April ? 2012, 21.5K/10 months, Phoenix, AZ, lost 2nd bar 6/30/2012@25.3K/12 mos, lost 3rd bar 7/12/2-12@29.1K/13 months(from
viewtopic.php?f=30&t=8802&start=990#p210171and viewtopic.php?f=30&t=8802&start=1210#p212356and viewtopic.php?f=30&t=8802&start=1230#p212377
30. NOC8H18 - July, 2012 - 3rd capacity bar lost. http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.p ... 50#p213437" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
31. TC Phoenix, AZ- 1 bar loss
32. DH Phoenix, AZ- 2 bar loss
33. RobR Phoenix, AZ - 2 bar loss
34. GF Phoenix, AZ- 1 bar loss


Not reported by owner, but by others:
1. Leafkabob reported a street encounter with a Leaf owner who stated he lost a bar after about a year.
2. Skywagon approx. May, 2012. Phoenix (supposedly no longer has Leaf)
3. TomT's friend Tim (not on the forum), in Phoenix, lost 1st bar on 7/15/2012/13K miles, had car since August 2011.

leafwing
Posts: 148
Joined: Fri Mar 25, 2011 7:47 pm
Delivery Date: 24 Mar 2011
Leaf Number: 0573
Location: Plano, TX

Re: Early Capacity Losses-Was(Lost a bar...down to 11)

Wed Jul 18, 2012 4:42 pm

I contacted Nissan Leaf support on 7-13-2012. My case number is 8934763.
Lost the first capacity bar on 7/04/2012.
Lost the second bar on 6/26/2013.
Lost the third bar on 6/17/2014.
Lost the Fourth Capacity bar on 6/7/2015.

Stoaty
Posts: 4490
Joined: Fri Jun 18, 2010 9:50 pm
Delivery Date: 12 Jun 2011
Leaf Number: 3871
Location: West Los Angeles

Re: Early Capacity Losses-Was(Lost a bar...down to 11)

Wed Jul 18, 2012 4:43 pm

azdre wrote: ...
30. NOC8H18 - July, 2012 - 3rd capacity bar lost. http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.p ... 50#p213437" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
31. TC Phoenix, AZ- 1 bar loss
32. DH Phoenix, AZ- 2 bar loss
33. RobR Phoenix, AZ - 2 bar loss
34. GF Phoenix, AZ- 1 bar loss

...
I thought Nissan said there were only 5 cases. ;) Perhaps they meant 35? :roll:
2011 Leaf with 62,000 miles given to Nephew
2013 Tesla Model S85 with 251 miles rated range at full charge
Leaf Spy Manual
Battery Aging Model Spreadsheet

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