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Re: Asking for Lemon Law protection on Monday

Posted: Mon Aug 27, 2012 12:26 pm
by RegGuheert
surfingslovak wrote:Sure, the invoice contains this line item:

Code: Select all

B P1274  LEAF VCM TCU REPRO  NTB12-015  PERFORM FACTORY RECALL  29034  W40  14214  REPROGRAMMED VCM & TCU AS PER CAMPAIGN
So, looking at the three campaigns that were done, I conclude that they were likely for three different VIN number ranges:

P1272/NTB12-013: Perhaps for the newest LEAFs. NTB contains 31 pages of instructions.
P1273/NTB12-014: For a group of LEAFs including mine: 5926. NTB contains 52 pages of instructions.
P1274/NTB12-015: Perhaps for older LEAFs, including surfingslovak's. NTB contains 42 pages of instructions. surfingslovak, can you confirm whether your LEAF is older or newer than mine?

Nissan recently told my dealer that sometimes these firmware updates did not "take" and that they should try to reapply it. Looking at the instructions, I can see that it would certainly be possible to miss a step. I'm not saying that is what happened here, but the work is done by humans, so it should be considered a possibility.

Re: Asking for Lemon Law protection on Monday

Posted: Mon Aug 27, 2012 12:32 pm
by surfingslovak
RegGuheert wrote:So, looking at the three campaigns that were done, I conclude that they were likely for three different VIN number ranges:

P1272/NTB12-013: For the newest LEAFs. NTB contains 31 pages of instructions.
P1273/NTB12-014: For next oldest LEAFs, including mine. NTB contains 42 pages of instructions.
P1274/NTB12-015: For the oldest LEAFs, including surfingslovak's. NTB contains 52 pages of instructions.

Nissan recently told my dealer that sometimes these firmware updates did not "take" and that they should try to reapply it. Looking at the instructions, I can see that it would certainly be possible to miss a step. I'm not saying that is what happened here, but the work is done by humans, so it should be considered a possibility.
Very interesting! To corroborate what you said, my Leaf had to stay at the dealership overnight and it was out of my possesion for nearly 24 hours. The software update must have take considerably longer than they originally estimated. I believe the service manager mentioned something about a failed download or the download taking longer than anticipated. Image

Re: Asking for Lemon Law protection on Monday

Posted: Mon Aug 27, 2012 12:41 pm
by RegGuheert
surfingslovak wrote:Very interesting!
I'm sorry, but there are mistakes in my post that you quoted. Please read my edited version and comment. Sorry for any confusion!

Re: Asking for Lemon Law protection on Monday

Posted: Mon Aug 27, 2012 1:50 pm
by surfingslovak
RegGuheert wrote:I'm sorry, but there are mistakes in my post that you quoted. Please read my edited version and comment. Sorry for any confusion!
Manufacture date is 04/2011. I wasn't part of the first wave, but the Leaf is likely one of the older ones in the fleet.

Re: Asking for Lemon Law protection on Monday

Posted: Mon Aug 27, 2012 2:21 pm
by RegGuheert
RegGuheert wrote:

Code: Select all

B P1274  LEAF VCM TCU REPRO  NTB12-015  PERFORM FACTORY RECALL  29034  W40  14214  REPROGRAMMED VCM & TCU AS PER CAMPAIGN
So, looking at the three campaigns that were done, I conclude that they were likely for three different VIN number ranges:

P1272/NTB12-013: Perhaps for the newest LEAFs. NTB contains 31 pages of instructions.
P1273/NTB12-014: For a group of LEAFs including mine: 5926. NTB contains 52 pages of instructions.
P1274/NTB12-015: Perhaps for older LEAFs, including surfingslovak's. NTB contains 42 pages of instructions. surfingslovak, can you confirm whether your LEAF is older or newer than mine?
I've done some more reading and sleuthing on these three campaigns and it seems clear that the campaigns are, at least partially, keyed from the VCU Part Number in the car. You can determine the current Telematics Part Number for your LEAF by following these steps:

1) Go into navigation system diagnostics (turn off radio, press Map three times, Radio Power two times, Map once).
2) Select Confirmation/Adjustment.
3) Select Version Information
4) Record the Part Number entry: XXXXX The next to last X in your VCU part number tells whether or not your LEAF has a battery heater: 0=No Battery Heater, 1=Battery Heater

So here are the VCU Part Numbers that these three campaigns were supposed to have been applied to:

P1272/NTB12-013:
Vehicle configuration ASCD: 273D0-3NA0B, 273D0-3NA0C, 273D0-3NA0D, 273D0-3NA0E
Vehicle configuration ASCD with Battery Heater: 273D0-3NA1A, 273D0-3NA1B, 273D0-3NA1C

P1273/NTB12-014:
Vehicle configuration ASCD: 273D0-3NA0B, 273D0-3NA0C, 273D0-3NA0D, 273D0-3NA0E
Vehicle configuration ALL: 283B0-3NA0A, 283B0-3NA0B, 283B0-3NA0C, 283B0-3EM0A, 283B0-3EM0B
Vehicle configuration ALL: 293A0-3NABA

P1274/NTB12-015:
Vehicle configuration ASCD: 273D0-3NA0B, 273D0-3NA0C, 273D0-3NA0D, 273D0-3NA0E
Vehicle configuration ASCD with Battery Heater: 273D0-3NA1A, 273D0-3NA1B, 273D0-3NA1C
Vehicle configuration ALL: 283B0-3NA0A, 283B0-3NA0B, 283B0-3NA0C, 283B0-3EM0A, 283B0-3EM0B

The prefixes listed seem to be:

273D0: EV/HEV
283B0: Telematics
293A0: HV Battery

So, looking at this, it appears that P1273/NTB12-014 may apply to older LEAFs without the option for a battery heater. P1272/NTB12-013 and P1274/NTB12-015 seem to apply to two later groups of LEAFs, but perhaps they are divided by VIN numbers or SL versus SV since it appears P1274/NTB12-015 gets a telematics update that P1272/NTB12-013 does not get.

Anyway, if we can confirm/correct the decoding of the VCU Part Number, this might be useful information to add to the Wiki.

Edits: Corrected my misunderstanding here.

Re: Asking for Lemon Law protection on Monday

Posted: Mon Aug 27, 2012 2:39 pm
by TomT
Just an FYI that you can not determine the part number rev from the diagnostic screen of the center display as it does not update when firmware updates are done. It will stay at whatever rev the car came with from the factory... I've had two updates done on my car (A/C and then the voluntary) and it is still at A on that screen, as shipped...
RegGuheert wrote:

Code: Select all

B P1274  LEAF VCM TCU REPRO  NTB12-015  PERFORM FACTORY RECALL  29034  W40  14214  REPROGRAMMED VCM & TCU AS PER CAMPAIGN
So, looking at the three campaigns that were done, I conclude that they were likely for three different VIN number ranges:

Re: Asking for Lemon Law protection on Monday

Posted: Mon Aug 27, 2012 2:47 pm
by grommet
Yep, the center diag display info is only useful to look at specific firmware versions of the "infotainment" system. It will not tell you the state of other modules in the car, and what updates you have ("new" GOM/bar behavior, open door warning, "A/C" fix, etc.)

Re: Asking for Lemon Law protection on Monday

Posted: Mon Aug 27, 2012 2:59 pm
by RegGuheert
TomT wrote:Just an FYI that you can not determine the part number rev from the diagnostic screen of the center display as it does not update when firmware updates are done. It will stay at whatever rev the car came with from the factory... I've had two updates done on my car (A/C and then the voluntary) and it is still at A on that screen, as shipped...
O.K., thanks, Tom!

That implies that what the dealer told me was correct: When they applied P1274/NTB12-015 to my car, that it did not take when updating Part Number 283B0-3NA0C to 283B0-3NA0D. I have the sheet showing them doing that more recently.

So, the question becomes: Did they successfully update 273D0-3NA0C to 273D0-3NA0D back on 29 February 12 when P1274/NTB-015 was first applied, or not. In other words, did I have mismatched versions since my 8 Aug 2012 visit or do I have mismatched firmware revisions now?

Re: Asking for Lemon Law protection on Monday

Posted: Mon Aug 27, 2012 3:15 pm
by RegGuheert
grommet wrote:Yep, the center diag display info is only useful to look at specific firmware versions of the "infotainment" system. It will not tell you the state of other modules in the car, and what updates you have ("new" GOM/bar behavior, open door warning, "A/C" fix, etc.)
Thanks! That makes sense, and I have gone back and cleaned up my previous mistakes.

Re: Asking for Lemon Law protection on Monday

Posted: Mon Aug 27, 2012 3:55 pm
by RegGuheert
So, back to the original issue:
surfingslovak wrote:
TonyWilliams wrote:Sure, the invoice contains this line item:

Code: Select all

B P1274  LEAF VCM TCU REPRO  NTB12-015  PERFORM FACTORY RECALL  29034  W40  14214  REPROGRAMMED VCM & TCU AS PER CAMPAIGN
I misspoke before, and our LEAF also got P1274, just like surfingslovak's.

Looking at what is modified, the one that seems most likely to result in a driving issue if there is a problem with the update is P1273/NTB12-014. Why? Because that one modifies BOTH the EV firmware AND the HV battery firmware. The other two ONLY update the EV firmware, so if that step was skipped, no change would occur to the EV drive system. But what if ONLY the EV firmware OR the HV Battery firmware got updated during P1273, but not the other one? In that case, since they are both specified, assumedly updating only one may result in an untested configuration.

According to my dealer, the ONLY way he can find out the part number for the various units in the car is to attempt to update them and IF the system allows the update, then it will show the old and new versions.

While this hypothesis does not apply to surfingslovak, we do not know about OP unless he can tell which of the three updates were applied. Perhaps it was P1273.

It sure would be nice to be able to read the part number from each of the pieces of equipment in the LEAF to confirm that these updates are being applied correctly. Perhaps LEAFscan will provide this functionality.