garsh
Posts: 1173
Joined: Sat Feb 12, 2011 5:27 am
Delivery Date: 05 Apr 2012
Location: Pittsburgh PA

Re: Most Efficient Freeway Speed...Is There One?

Wed May 22, 2019 11:18 am

DougWantsALeaf wrote:Any feel for where Nissan is lagging in drive train consumption?
Tesla has created a more efficient motor and inverter. I haven't seen how it compares to other companies, but the new motor/gearbox/inverter combination resulted in an increase in range of a Model S from 335 miles to 370 miles, with no change to the battery pack. Tesla vehicles are also more aerodynamic, which helps efficiency at highway speeds.

But a Tesla will lose 1-2 miles of range per day regardless of use just from system overhead, whereas I've never noticed my Leaf losing anything when parked.
2012 Black SV, bought 2012-04-04, sold 2019-05-10. 7 bars, 101,850 miles.
Current rides: 2018 Tesla Model 3 Performance, 2018 Chevrolet Volt LT

SageBrush
Posts: 4717
Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2011 2:28 am
Delivery Date: 13 Feb 2017
Location: NM

Re: Most Efficient Freeway Speed...Is There One?

Wed May 22, 2019 12:06 pm

garsh wrote:
DougWantsALeaf wrote:Any feel for where Nissan is lagging in drive train consumption?
Tesla has created a more efficient motor and inverter. I haven't seen how it compares to other companies, but the new motor/gearbox/inverter combination resulted in an increase in range of a Model S from 335 miles to 370 miles, with no change to the battery pack. Tesla vehicles are also more aerodynamic, which helps efficiency at highway speeds.
The improvement in the Model S was due to a swap from the old induction motors that were always less efficient overall than the PM used in the LEAF. The new-fangled SRM motors of Tesla are I think as efficient as PM or perhaps more so but not by a huge margin. I'm not sure about the inverter. You can get a feel for drivetrain efficiency by taking the EPA highway numbers (that approximate 65 mph driving) and subtracting Aero and Wheel resistances. I've forgotten how much the AP functions of the Tesla consume.

Tesla Model 3 LR:
1613 Kg
0.009 Tyre RR (assumption)
Frontal Area: 2.34 m*m
Cd: 0.23

At 65 mph (105 kph) it works out to 117 Wh/km (189 Wh/mile)
EPA is 241 Wh/mile (corrected for presumed 12% charging losses)

So the difference is 52 wh/mile of which the drivetrain is the lion's share
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The Chevy Bolt is 269 Wh/mile EPA of which 232 Wh/mile is Road+Aero
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The e-tron is 405 Wh/mile of which 260 Wh/mile is road+Aero. That car has major drivetrain issues.
---

I leave the LEAF to you
2013 LEAF 'S' Model with QC & rear-view camera
Bought off-lease Jan 2017 from N. California
Two years in Colorado, now in NM
03/2018: 58 Ahr, 28k miles
11/2018: 56.16 Ahr, 30k miles
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2018 Tesla Model 3 LR, Delivered 6/2018

lorenfb
Posts: 2241
Joined: Tue Dec 17, 2013 10:53 pm
Delivery Date: 22 Nov 2013
Leaf Number: 416635
Location: SoCal

Re: Most Efficient Freeway Speed...Is There One?

Wed May 22, 2019 12:46 pm

SageBrush wrote:
lorenfb wrote: And what's in Tesla's gear boxes for lubrication?
If you are looking for petroleum products in a Tesla it is easier to start with the tyres.
You went there.
#1 Leaf SL MY 9/13: 74K miles, 48 Ahrs, 5.2 miles/kWh (average), Hx=70, SOH=78, L2 - 100% > 1000, temp < 95F, (DOD) > 20 Ahrs
#2 Leaf SL MY 12/18: 4.5K miles, 115 Ahrs, 5.5 miles/kWh (average), Hx=98, SOH=99, DOD > 20%, temp < 105F

DougWantsALeaf
Posts: 903
Joined: Fri May 10, 2013 8:21 pm
Delivery Date: 18 May 2013
Leaf Number: 407811
Location: Chicago North Side

Re: Most Efficient Freeway Speed...Is There One?

Fri Aug 09, 2019 9:23 am

Tesla Model 3 LR:
1613 Kg
0.009 Tyre RR (assumption)
Frontal Area: 2.34 m*m
Cd: 0.23

At 65 mph (105 kph) it works out to 117 Wh/km (189 Wh/mile)
EPA is 241 Wh/mile (corrected for presumed 12% charging losses)

Tesla Like was showing 316 miles range on the 75 kWh battery at 65 or 4.21 miles per KW for the LR. Teslanomics has a couple videos suggesting a bit less (mid to upper 200s), but guessing he was using AC or other power sapping aspects.

So on the highway at 65 mph you are seeing north of 5 miles per KW? (not close to other cars, or things that would give improved drag characteristics) That's pretty impressive.
2019 SV Plus Silver
2013 Leaf SV
100 Mile Club Member (Number 87)
Max distance on 13 Leaf: 120 miles
Max distance on 19 Leaf: 242 Highway 4.5 miles/kWh (4.9 KWh remaining)

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