GerryAZ
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Re: Replaced Ecopia's with Michelin Defenders

Wed Apr 10, 2013 8:38 pm

I was tired of the excessive road noise and marginal handling of the Ecopias so I took advantage of a Michelin promotion and generous trade-in allowance to replace them even though I had almost 50% of the tread left at 20,600 miles. I now have 23,100 miles and am very happy with the Michelins even though I took a significant range hit (as noted in my earlier post) and 0-60 time has noticeably increased.

Gerry
Gerry
Silver LEAF 2011 SL rear ended (totaled) by in-attentive driver 1/4/2015 at 50,422 miles
Silver LEAF 2015 SL purchased 2/7/2015; traded 8/10/2019 at 82,436 miles
White LEAF 2019 SL+ purchased 8/10/2019

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Stanton
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Leaf Number: 7458
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Re: Replaced Ecopia's with Michelin Defenders

Thu Apr 18, 2013 8:37 am

I'm already seeing an improvement after a few hundred miles: I'm in the mid-4's now for m/kWh (should be high-4's). The weather has warmed a bit, but that can't be all of it. As for ride/handling: I'm very pleased with the Michelin's. I'll update if/when I see further improvement in range.
2011 Blue Ocean SV w/floor mats & window tint
12v LiFePO4 battery & FIAMM 74100 horns
Wet Okole seat covers (front)
Tor's low-power heater mod
2013 sun visor
3G modem upgrade
L2 EVSE Upgrade
Battery Pack replaced (Rev E) @51 months and 41k miles

jfsquires
Posts: 43
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Delivery Date: 09 Apr 2011
Leaf Number: 0847
Location: Lake Oswego

Re: Replaced Ecopia's with Michelin Defenders

Thu Apr 18, 2013 11:04 am

Stanton wrote:Title says it all: I finally got rid of those (crummy) stock tires and replaced them with a good LRR tire with a 90k mile warranty. I wasn't going to make it through my next inspection (or 20k miles), so I "pulled the trigger" while Michelin still had a rebate going. These are expensive tires, but I expect to get MUCH better value out of them than another set of Ecopia's.
Has anyone gone to smaller tires - 195/65R15 for example? I would expect smaller rims and tires would be lighter,
which might have some advantage. How would handling and braking be affected with a smaller tire? And of course, range.

Bassman
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Location: Angels Camp, CA

Re: Replaced Ecopia's with Michelin Defenders

Thu Apr 18, 2013 11:45 am

Put Michelin Defenders on this morning after putting 35000 on the Ecopias. Have been getting mid to low 4s in efficiency (4.2 to 4.5 mi/KWhr) on the wore Ecopias. I'll see how the Defenders perform in about 4000 to 5000 miles. The tire dealer indicated that they definitely need to be broken in before checking the efficiency. ;)
Glenn
Ocean Blue SL w/QC,
Delivered 4/29/2011- VIN# 756
34,800 miles so far (2/20/2013) Still 12 bars @ 100% charge, but range has reduced by about 10 to 12 %
2012 Pearl White (Blizzard) Rav4 EV

zeroco2
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Location: San Diego
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Re: Replaced Ecopia's with Michelin Defenders

Thu Jul 25, 2013 12:03 pm

Well my Ecopia's lasted 25K so I just switched to Michelin Defenders and noticed a 10% range hit. I'm not sure I want to life with that, I had been told that the Defenders had lower rolling resistance. 90K miles and lower rolling resistance seemed to be too good to be true - and it was!
I would be happy getting 40-50K out of a set of tires. I seem to have gone from one extreme to the other.
Has anyone tried any tires that have a better compromise of range/life?
Thanks
Chris
Clipper Creek Installed 12/16/10
Delivered 1/7/11
3.8KW PV 8 yrs old
2.1KW PV for Leaf, makes 3216KWh/yr @ 3.7mi/KW=12K sun miles!
Solar Hot Water, Solar Air Heater, Solar Hot tub
2000 gal rain water
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dhanson865
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Re: Replaced Ecopia's with Michelin Defenders

Thu Jul 25, 2013 12:12 pm

Defenders have proven to hurt MPGs on the Prius so we always recommend the Energy Saver A/S as a replacement for anyone that complains about reduced range with the defenders.

Ironically the range people complain about with the defenders on the Prius forum is getting less than 500 miles to a tank but the same concept applies to the Leaf, just a different unit of measurement.

I do wonder what 15" rims would work with the Leaf and what RPM is needed to keep the speedometer accurate. F8L has documented MPG losses when switching from 15" tires to 17 tires on the same commute.
Blue 2012 Leaf 195/65/15 tires, 15" Rims
Silver 2012 Leaf 16" stock wheels
http://www.mynissanleaf.com/wiki/index. ... acity_Loss
(efficiency 3.x KW vs 6.x KW)
please join Truedelta.com and input your repairs.

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Stanton
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Re: Replaced Ecopia's with Michelin Defenders

Thu Jul 25, 2013 1:13 pm

zeroco2 wrote:Well my Ecopia's lasted 25K so I just switched to Michelin Defenders and noticed a 10% range hit. I'm not sure I want to life with that, I had been told that the Defenders had lower rolling resistance. 90K miles and lower rolling resistance seemed to be too good to be true - and it was!
I would be happy getting 40-50K out of a set of tires. I seem to have gone from one extreme to the other.
Evidence shows that "10% range hit" should come down a bit. The problem is there doesn't seem to be a middle ground: you can either get something like the Ecopia's that just don't last or take a 5-10% range hit (and not buy tires every 2 years). I may be one of the highest mileage Defender guys out there, and I still don't have 5k miles on mine (and my m/kWh has started to improve).
2011 Blue Ocean SV w/floor mats & window tint
12v LiFePO4 battery & FIAMM 74100 horns
Wet Okole seat covers (front)
Tor's low-power heater mod
2013 sun visor
3G modem upgrade
L2 EVSE Upgrade
Battery Pack replaced (Rev E) @51 months and 41k miles

thankyouOB
Posts: 3583
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Leaf Number: 1442
Location: Coastal LA

Re: Replaced Ecopia's with Michelin Defenders

Thu Jul 25, 2013 2:31 pm

Herm wrote:[quote="thankyouOB"
ditto drop in mileage with michelin mxv4s.
and I have had them since October.
break in, shmake in
How many miles do you have on them by now?.. perhaps those long life tires will need a longer break-in[/quote]

bought at 17k, now around 28k.
i think they are broken in.
i still am down about 10%, though some of that could be battery aging.
may reserve/delivery 4/30/11
--
ECOtality/LADWP/ Blink 4/4/11
--
Gardena Nissan, msrp -1k
red SL with etec L3
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DaveEV
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Re: Replaced Ecopia's with Michelin Defenders

Thu Jul 25, 2013 11:11 pm

dhanson865 wrote:I do wonder what 15" rims would work with the Leaf and what RPM is needed to keep the speedometer accurate. F8L has documented MPG losses when switching from 15" tires to 17 tires on the same commute.
The biggest issue with 15" wheels is finding some that will clear the front brakes. As it is, many 16" wheels don't clear the front brakes.

If you do find some 15" wheels that clear the front brakes, the two tire sizes that are closest to the stock diameter are 195/65/15 (0.5% larger than stock) and 205/60/15 (0.8% smaller than stock). 195/65/15 is a very common size and being slightly narrower and taller should be more efficient as well, so I would opt for that if I were going that route. Note that handling will suffer in comparison to the stock tire size - the sidewall is quite a bit taller.

If looking for 15" wheels, your best bet would be dirt rally style wheels as they often are designed for maximum brake clearance.

Example: Team Dynamics Pro Rally Wheels 15x6 e40 5x114.3

Would love to try to test fit some of those...

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Stanton
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Re: Replaced Ecopia's with Michelin Defenders

Sat Jul 27, 2013 7:40 am

thankyouOB wrote: i still am down about 10%, though some of that could be battery aging.
You can't compare absolute range, you have to compare something like "m/kWh".
Doesn't matter if you use CarWings or calculate it yourself, just so long it's a consistent comparison.
Based on "m/kWh", I'm down closer to 6% after ~3000 miles.
2011 Blue Ocean SV w/floor mats & window tint
12v LiFePO4 battery & FIAMM 74100 horns
Wet Okole seat covers (front)
Tor's low-power heater mod
2013 sun visor
3G modem upgrade
L2 EVSE Upgrade
Battery Pack replaced (Rev E) @51 months and 41k miles

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