Bufordleaf
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Location: Buford, GA

Re: pre-release testers wanted - range-extending technology for Leaf

Tue Oct 11, 2016 4:31 am

braineo wrote:Just twisted my ankle yesterday and barely was able to drive home. Keeping my right foot in one position to drive hurt a lot. My only respite was to drive on the highway with cruise control and my hurt foot trying to find a position with the least pain. I'm all game for testing this gadget, more since my 2011 SL range is down to about 40 miles and my commute is 46-52 miles per day. Yes I do have to QC daily. At 43.76 AHr I'm dying to get my battery replaced under warranty (bought 11/2012).
Completely off topic reply, but I noticed you are in Duluth. I am in Buford, and drive a 2015 Leaf S. I am almost 2 years and 20k miles into a 3 year lease, and trying to determine if I will buy it out at the end. A big factor for me is whether the 2015 battery is really much better than the 2011 and 2012 models. Do you use Leaf Spy, and do you happen to know or remember what your battery degredation was like after roughly 2 years? Since you and I are in the same climate your experience is quite interesting to me.

For reference, my last reading showed 280 Gids and SOH of 96% at full charge. So no noticeable degredation from my perspective, although some measurable. Of course that's great, but I wonder if the degredation may accelerate after year 3 or 4, and since you are 4 years into your Leaf experience I'm curious what you have seen. Has your degredation been somewhat linear or was it more (or less) early (or later)?

Any comments you can provide would be helpful. Thanks very much, and I hope your ankle feels better!
2015 Leaf S with QC

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braineo
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Location: Duluth, GA

Re: pre-release testers wanted - range-extending technology for Leaf

Tue Oct 11, 2016 5:33 am

I'm at 66% SOC, use Leaf Spy and posted all battery degradation stats in the EV Club of the South FB page together with all Leaf owners in the Atlanta area. Waiting for my 4th bar to drop to claim my battery warranty any day now. Stop by any weekend morning for a coffee and a chat to answer your questions. PM me.

PedalLogic
Posts: 40
Joined: Tue Aug 09, 2016 9:52 am
Delivery Date: 09 Aug 2011
Leaf Number: 007889

Important information -- including shipping info

Thu Oct 13, 2016 10:35 am

Hi Everyone,

All orders for the prerelease units shipped this morning via USPS Priority Mail. USPS generally commits to 2-3 day service, so there's a good chance you'll receive your unit on Saturday. The confirmation email you received includes a tracking number in case you want to check USPS' estimate for delivery.

What's inside the box:
  • Smartpedal C1. This is a preproduction unit with software specifically tailored for this test.
    Installation Directions. Although it's pretty simple, there are nuances and pro tips I can share, having installed a lot of these. I'll put together a video and include a link on a later post this week.
    License Agreement. There's a lot of IP in this device that we want to protect, having spent the last five years of our careers on its development. The key points: don't open the device or attempt to reverse engineer it.
    Return Shipping Label. We pick up the cost of returning the unit as long as you save this label. Make sure to either keep the original USPS shipping box or (better) pick up a replacement at your local post office.
Other important information:
  • Default Mode. Smartpedal C1 has five built-in driving modes. It ships with mode 3 as the default at boot. You can change the default at any time using the directions on the installation sheet.
    Mode 5 is special. Modes 1-4 are designed to be driven in Eco or D mode for your Leaf, whichever you normally use. However Mode 5 is special and designed specifically for D-mode driving. We are conducting tests to determine if unwanted pedal movement filtering combined with dynamic acceleration optimization may give better results than the built-in “Eco” mode, from performance and driveability points of view. Please use this setting only with your Leaf set to “Drive” (not “Eco”) mode. If you are adventurous, you can try this in “Eco” mode as well, but the driving experience will be significantly impacted.
    Two-Week Cycles. Please drive for two weeks in each of the five modes. Please track your mileage and kWh for each cycle. If you can send start/end pictures for each cycle, that would be great, but an email with a few notes will work too. We'd also like to hear about your experience driving, whether you noticed any changes in vehicle behavior, or whether your driving style changed, etc. Please take a moment to review the official questions on the last section of page 3 of this doc: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B6rEgz ... sp=sharing
Want to know more about how Smartpedal works? The second page of the linked PDF above contains more details on how our system works and the characteristics of the different modes. It's a quick read.

We really appreciate your participation in this prerelease. Thank you for your help.

Marc
Pedal Logic

PedalLogic
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Re: pre-release testers wanted - range-extending technology for Leaf

Thu Oct 13, 2016 6:53 pm

P.S. I amended the language describing Mode 5 is the post immediately above to make it more conservative.

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jlv
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Re: pre-release testers wanted - range-extending technology for Leaf

Sat Oct 15, 2016 8:14 pm

Any hint on how to release the clasp that is holding the factory wire harness to the pedal? I tried for long time and couldn't get it off. If need, tomorrow I'll remove the pedal (but I wanted to try to avoid that).
LEAF '13 SL+Prem (mfg 12/13, leased 4/14, bought 5/17, sold 11/18) 34K mi, AHr 58, SOH 87%
Tesla S 75D (3/17)
Tesla X 100D (12/18)
100K 100% BEV miles since '14
ICE free since '18

PedalLogic
Posts: 40
Joined: Tue Aug 09, 2016 9:52 am
Delivery Date: 09 Aug 2011
Leaf Number: 007889

Re: pre-release testers wanted - range-extending technology for Leaf

Sat Oct 15, 2016 9:21 pm

jlv wrote:Any hint on how to release the clasp that is holding the factory wire harness to the pedal? I tried for long time and couldn't get it off. If need, tomorrow I'll remove the pedal (but I wanted to try to avoid that).
Hi jlv,

It's just thumb pressure at the top, but it's an awkward angle to apply that pressure. If it's really a challenge, apply pressure just with your pointer finger until the snap latch releases, then slide the connector up and off. This doesn't always work, but it's what I usually try next.

Marc

PedalLogic
Posts: 40
Joined: Tue Aug 09, 2016 9:52 am
Delivery Date: 09 Aug 2011
Leaf Number: 007889

Re: pre-release testers wanted - range-extending technology for Leaf

Sat Oct 15, 2016 10:47 pm

Hi Everyone,
As promised, videos to help with installation, calibration, and configuration:

Installation: https://youtu.be/lBBoWcpXoVI
Calibration/Configuration: https://youtu.be/jgrDuwNA11o

I'll welcome any suggestions you have for improving the next-gen of these videos.

Best,
Marc

DaveinOlyWA
Posts: 15050
Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 7:43 pm
Delivery Date: 16 Nov 2019
Leaf Number: 319862
Location: Olympia, WA
Contact: Website

Re: pre-release testers wanted - range-extending technology for Leaf

Sun Oct 16, 2016 7:57 am

LeftieBiker wrote:Driving home on a moderately but not especially smooth road tonight, I used the instant graph display to watch power consumption, and the results may surprise us both, PedalLogic. It appears to me that the device may indeed remedy a problem with power consumption at steady speeds, but... I don't think it's the problem that PedalLogic identifies. I used both a very steady foot and the cruise control, and the constant small jumps and dips in power consumption were virtually the same with both. Since the cruise control doesn't use the accelerator pedal (I'm assuming that this is a fly by wire system!) I believe that the issue is actually that the varying pavement height slightly but significantly increases and decreases power demand, not accelerator pedal deflection. If this device smooths out the power supply response, then it may work as advertised - just not in the exact way advertised.
there is a million different reasons for the constant power fluctuation you saw and you are correct in that none have to do with your foot.

what this device is basically "adjustable Eco" mode. Even if it works exactly as advertised you will still see a wide fluctuation of power. Road and traffic and weather and wind all will insure that.
2011 SL; 44,598 mi, 87% SOH. 2013 S; 44,840 mi, 91% SOH. 2016 S30; 29,413 mi, 99% SOH. 2018 S; 25,185 mi, SOH 92.23%. 2019 S Plus; 13,705 mi, 93.41% SOH
My Blog; http://daveinolywa.blogspot.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

PedalLogic
Posts: 40
Joined: Tue Aug 09, 2016 9:52 am
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Leaf Number: 007889

Re: pre-release testers wanted - range-extending technology for Leaf

Sun Oct 16, 2016 9:58 am

LeftieBiker wrote:Driving home on a moderately but not especially smooth road tonight, I used the instant graph display to watch power consumption, and the results may surprise us both, PedalLogic. It appears to me that the device may indeed remedy a problem with power consumption at steady speeds, but... I don't think it's the problem that PedalLogic identifies. I used both a very steady foot and the cruise control, and the constant small jumps and dips in power consumption were virtually the same with both. Since the cruise control doesn't use the accelerator pedal (I'm assuming that this is a fly by wire system!) I believe that the issue is actually that the varying pavement height slightly but significantly increases and decreases power demand, not accelerator pedal deflection. If this device smooths out the power supply response, then it may work as advertised - just not in the exact way advertised.
Hi LeftieBiker,
You are seeing two related effects but your conclusion is incorrect. Here's what's going on:

Manual Control. When acceleration is controlled by the driver (i.e., foot on pedal), there's no question that fluctuations in power demand are caused by the imperfections in the roadway surface. This is easy to observe through data and through your own personal experience. Through data, we know that the driver's foot moves up/down about 1/10th of a second after the vehicle moves in the same axis. We can measure and time this biomechanical interaction by using an accelerometer at the pedal, tracking the data from that accelerometer, and graphing it against changes in the pedal signal caused by sympathetic movement of the driver's foot. And each time this unwanted motion happens, the ECU that controls the motor's output increases or decreases power momentarily.

But our technology isn't just a simple low-pass filter. That approach leads to an immediate and significant change in the driving experience by making changes to both the intended and unintended power requests. Instead, our system utilizes probabilistic analysis to determine whether a particular change was intended by the driver. If it wasn't, the system adjusts the signal to what it believes the driver did intend. By using the built-in driving modes, drivers can manage the threshold for--and extent of--these changes. It's not magic though: if the system is set overly aggressively, it will over correct and there will be a noticeable effect on the driving experience, but even then the the effect is usually smaller (and more enjoyable) than switching from D to Eco.

Cruise Control. When acceleration is controlled by cruise control, you will also see spikes and drops in immediate demand, and this is also caused by the roadway--but not by the driver's foot moving on the pedal. Instead, the ECU is attempting to maintain the vehicle in a steady state in terms of speed. Imperfections in the roadway impart or take away energy from that equation, so the ECU constantly adjusts the instantaneous demand to return to the target speed--and you see the results of that constant "trimming" in the display of instantaneous energy demand.
DaveinOlyWA wrote: there is a million different reasons for the constant power fluctuation you saw and you are correct in that none have to do with your foot.
If you were only referring to when Leftie was driving on cruise control, I totally agree. If you were referring to manual operation as well, I disagree. The only open question is how much power is wasted. One of the purposes of this test is to see if the real-world results of a diverse group of owners/drivers match the results generated in testing on closed courses with professional drivers. There will undoubtedly be differences and things for us to learn.
DaveinOlyWA wrote:what this device is basically "adjustable Eco" mode. Even if it works exactly as advertised you will still see a wide fluctuation of power. Road and traffic and weather and wind all will insure that.
Since we are a different approach to improving mileage than is built into your vehicle, I'm not sure that "adjustable Eco" mode fully captures what we do. In any case, our focus is reducing the fluctuations in power caused by the unintended changes of the pedal position. We do that task really, really well, resulting in an upward bump of kWh from whatever it would normally be in the climate and on the roadways that your Leaf travels.

Best,
Marc

DaveinOlyWA
Posts: 15050
Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 7:43 pm
Delivery Date: 16 Nov 2019
Leaf Number: 319862
Location: Olympia, WA
Contact: Website

Re: pre-release testers wanted - range-extending technology for Leaf

Sun Oct 16, 2016 10:49 am

PedalLogic wrote:
DaveinOlyWA wrote:what this device is basically "adjustable Eco" mode. Even if it works exactly as advertised you will still see a wide fluctuation of power. Road and traffic and weather and wind all will insure that.
Since we are a different approach to improving mileage than is built into your vehicle, I'm not sure that "adjustable Eco" mode fully captures what we do. In any case, our focus is reducing the fluctuations in power caused by the unintended changes of the pedal position. We do that task really, really well, resulting in an upward bump of kWh from whatever it would normally be in the climate and on the roadways that your Leaf travels.

Best,
Marc
in general layman's terms, I think I am closer than you think. Eco mode's purpose was to do exactly what you are trying to do. But its a factory set "one size fits all" solution. Implementation or results aside, I have to stand by my statement inaccurate as it may be since it does not imply in any way that Eco mode uses the same ideology or mechanism your system does.
2011 SL; 44,598 mi, 87% SOH. 2013 S; 44,840 mi, 91% SOH. 2016 S30; 29,413 mi, 99% SOH. 2018 S; 25,185 mi, SOH 92.23%. 2019 S Plus; 13,705 mi, 93.41% SOH
My Blog; http://daveinolywa.blogspot.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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