DougWantsALeaf
Posts: 1014
Joined: Fri May 10, 2013 8:21 pm
Delivery Date: 18 May 2013
Leaf Number: 407811
Location: Chicago North Side

Chademo Getting a Boost Mode

Tue Jul 16, 2019 9:44 am

https://www.chademo.com/boost-mode-cable/

Its not clear on exactly how long or how much boost you will be able to get once this is implemented, but if the gear permits it, I would take a 15 minute boost from 50 to 100KW to shorten charging time.

Hopefully this makes quick top offs available for current gen Chademos (aka sans liquid cooling on the charging cable).
2019 SV Plus Silver
2013 Leaf SV
100 Mile Club Member (Number 87)
Max distance on 13 Leaf: 120 miles
Max distance on 19 Leaf: 242 Highway 4.5 miles/kWh (4.9 KWh remaining)

DougWantsALeaf
Posts: 1014
Joined: Fri May 10, 2013 8:21 pm
Delivery Date: 18 May 2013
Leaf Number: 407811
Location: Chicago North Side

Re: Chademo Getting a Boost Mode

Fri Aug 09, 2019 6:14 am

2019 SV Plus Silver
2013 Leaf SV
100 Mile Club Member (Number 87)
Max distance on 13 Leaf: 120 miles
Max distance on 19 Leaf: 242 Highway 4.5 miles/kWh (4.9 KWh remaining)

webeleafowners
Posts: 889
Joined: Mon Oct 05, 2015 5:37 pm
Delivery Date: 06 Oct 2015
Location: Okanagan Valley British Columbia

Re: Chademo Getting a Boost Mode

Fri Aug 09, 2019 6:35 am

Interesting article Doug. I’m not sure I get what is doing the job though. The whole charger? Software and a special connecter? I guess what I’m getting at is, can a 100 KW existing DCFC be modified or is a whole new cabinet required. Kinda cool though.
2015 Smart Electric Drive convertible.
2016 Nissan Leaf SV 30KWh
EV only Family...well except for the big diesel motorhome. :shock:

DougWantsALeaf
Posts: 1014
Joined: Fri May 10, 2013 8:21 pm
Delivery Date: 18 May 2013
Leaf Number: 407811
Location: Chicago North Side

Re: Chademo Getting a Boost Mode

Fri Aug 09, 2019 6:50 am

I would just hope that at a boost charger when at a low SOC (say 5-10%) I could get the full 100 kWh charging rate for a few minutes.

Now that I have found a couple chargers that will give me over 70kWh, the “old” Chademos which charge at 35-40 feel incredibly slow.

All that said, we still usually charge at 110 at home (even with the plus battery) as we don’t drive much outside of my road trips with the car.
2019 SV Plus Silver
2013 Leaf SV
100 Mile Club Member (Number 87)
Max distance on 13 Leaf: 120 miles
Max distance on 19 Leaf: 242 Highway 4.5 miles/kWh (4.9 KWh remaining)

SageBrush
Posts: 4907
Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2011 2:28 am
Delivery Date: 13 Feb 2017
Location: NM

Re: Chademo Getting a Boost Mode

Fri Aug 09, 2019 7:05 am

webeleafowners wrote:
Fri Aug 09, 2019 6:35 am
Interesting article Doug. I’m not sure I get what is doing the job though. The whole charger? Software and a special connecter? I guess what I’m getting at is, can a 100 KW existing DCFC be modified or is a whole new cabinet required. Kinda cool though.
As I understand it:

A CHAdeMO cable/plug in No. America is typically limited to 125 Amps -- Period. *
This Boost mode allows 200 Amps if the cable/plug is below some specified threshold temperature.

Without information of the temperature threshold, or how quickly temperature rises at 100 Amps, there is no way to know the practical utility. It would be tempting to speculate that boost will operate during the winter but then the cold battery becomes the Amp limit. And in the older gen LEAFs that have power electronics limited to 100 Amps this boost mode of CHAdeMO makes no difference at all. A Tesla might be able to utilize 200 Amps if the CHAdeMO adapter is upgraded from its present 125 Amp limit.

I asked Miimura at TMC not too long ago why the Amp rating for CHAdeMO is so much lower than Tesla when both are using non-liquid cooling cables. He thought the major difference was Japanese engineering conservatism and not the hardware. This boost mode would be consistent with a loosening of the engineering spec and perhaps component hardware more suitable for the higher current.
2013 LEAF 'S' Model with QC & rear-view camera
Bought off-lease Jan 2017 from N. California
Two years in Colorado, now in NM
03/2018: 58 Ahr, 28k miles
11/2018: 56.16 Ahr, 30k miles
-----
2018 Tesla Model 3 LR, Delivered 6/2018

DaveinOlyWA
Posts: 14157
Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 7:43 pm
Delivery Date: 16 Nov 2019
Leaf Number: 319862
Location: Olympia, WA
Contact: Website

Re: Chademo Getting a Boost Mode

Fri Aug 09, 2019 7:26 am

Sounds interesting. For older LEAFs, only the 30 kwh LEAFs can charge beyond 125 amps. The boost would be fine for me as I wouldn't see that high rate of charging for much more than 15-20 mins under "any" circumstances.

By the way; Has anyone noticed the differences between the 150 KW CCS cables and the 50 KW chademo cables on the EA Stations?
2011 SL; 44,598 miles. 2013 S; 44,840 miles.2016 S30 deceased. 29,413 miles. 2018 S40; 25,185 miles SOH 92.23%
My Blog; http://daveinolywa.blogspot.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

webeleafowners
Posts: 889
Joined: Mon Oct 05, 2015 5:37 pm
Delivery Date: 06 Oct 2015
Location: Okanagan Valley British Columbia

Re: Chademo Getting a Boost Mode

Fri Aug 09, 2019 9:04 am

SageBrush wrote:
Fri Aug 09, 2019 7:05 am
webeleafowners wrote:
Fri Aug 09, 2019 6:35 am
Interesting article Doug. I’m not sure I get what is doing the job though. The whole charger? Software and a special connecter? I guess what I’m getting at is, can a 100 KW existing DCFC be modified or is a whole new cabinet required. Kinda cool though.
As I understand it:

A CHAdeMO cable/plug in No. America is typically limited to 125 Amps -- Period. *
This Boost mode allows 200 Amps if the cable/plug is below some specified threshold temperature.

Without information of the temperature threshold, or how quickly temperature rises at 100 Amps, there is no way to know the practical utility. It would be tempting to speculate that boost will operate during the winter but then the cold battery becomes the Amp limit. And in the older gen LEAFs that have power electronics limited to 100 Amps this boost mode of CHAdeMO makes no difference at all. A Tesla might be able to utilize 200 Amps if the CHAdeMO adapter is upgraded from its present 125 Amp limit.

I asked Miimura at TMC not too long ago why the Amp rating for CHAdeMO is so much lower than Tesla when both are using non-liquid cooling cables. He thought the major difference was Japanese engineering conservatism and not the hardware. This boost mode would be consistent with a loosening of the engineering spec and perhaps component hardware more suitable for the higher current.
Think I got it. Essentially, if a provider switches out the cable and plug for this companies it can provide at least for a short time a peak charge closer to our 100 KW max.
2015 Smart Electric Drive convertible.
2016 Nissan Leaf SV 30KWh
EV only Family...well except for the big diesel motorhome. :shock:

SageBrush
Posts: 4907
Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2011 2:28 am
Delivery Date: 13 Feb 2017
Location: NM

Re: Chademo Getting a Boost Mode

Fri Aug 09, 2019 9:25 am

webeleafowners wrote:
Fri Aug 09, 2019 9:04 am
Think I got it. Essentially, if a provider switches out the cable and plug for this companies it can provide at least for a short time a peak charge closer to our 100 KW max.
You are presuming that the electricity supply can go higher than what is presently being supplied. That would be a maybe.

NO LEAF has been made that will take 100 kW. If the entire path is able to take 200 Amps, the battery will max that current at ~ 370 Volts for a peak power of 200*370*10^-3 = 74 kW.

The "100 kW" designation comes from chargers able to supply 500 Volts and 200 Amps. The current Porsche may be different but every other EV becomes current limited at ~ 380 Volts (or less.)
2013 LEAF 'S' Model with QC & rear-view camera
Bought off-lease Jan 2017 from N. California
Two years in Colorado, now in NM
03/2018: 58 Ahr, 28k miles
11/2018: 56.16 Ahr, 30k miles
-----
2018 Tesla Model 3 LR, Delivered 6/2018

DougWantsALeaf
Posts: 1014
Joined: Fri May 10, 2013 8:21 pm
Delivery Date: 18 May 2013
Leaf Number: 407811
Location: Chicago North Side

Re: Chademo Getting a Boost Mode

Fri Aug 09, 2019 9:37 am

So the 73.5 kWh I saw at the EA stop was basically the theoretical peak?

No chance I can see 80 or 90 with a very low SOC and spicy new EA Chademo?
2019 SV Plus Silver
2013 Leaf SV
100 Mile Club Member (Number 87)
Max distance on 13 Leaf: 120 miles
Max distance on 19 Leaf: 242 Highway 4.5 miles/kWh (4.9 KWh remaining)

SageBrush
Posts: 4907
Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2011 2:28 am
Delivery Date: 13 Feb 2017
Location: NM

Re: Chademo Getting a Boost Mode

Fri Aug 09, 2019 9:42 am

DougWantsALeaf wrote:
Fri Aug 09, 2019 9:37 am
So the 73.5 kWh I saw at the EA stop was basically the theoretical peak?

No chance I can see 80 or 90 with a very low SOC and spicy new EA Chademo?
That's right, if you are talking about kW

And in fact at low SoC the power will be less than peak. Peak power occurs at ~ 370 battery pack voltage
Last edited by SageBrush on Fri Aug 09, 2019 10:02 am, edited 2 times in total.
2013 LEAF 'S' Model with QC & rear-view camera
Bought off-lease Jan 2017 from N. California
Two years in Colorado, now in NM
03/2018: 58 Ahr, 28k miles
11/2018: 56.16 Ahr, 30k miles
-----
2018 Tesla Model 3 LR, Delivered 6/2018

Return to “Range / Efficiency / Carwings”