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Re: Cold sucks (literally)

Posted: Tue Jan 07, 2020 2:13 pm
by DougWantsALeaf
Don't forget that the 40 and 62 Leaf keep about 9% of the battery below the 1% mark. Most of that is very usable without power loss.

Re: Cold sucks (literally)

Posted: Wed Jan 08, 2020 7:11 am
by DaveinOlyWA
Tortoisehead77 wrote:
Tue Jan 07, 2020 12:36 pm
DaveinOlyWA wrote:
Tue Jan 07, 2020 7:17 am
What method are you using to determine your range?
Odometer (trip meter). I usually take it down to 10-15% remaining charge and I'm usually less than 90 miles on the trip meter by the time I get that low.
[/quote]

The reason your GOM "seems" bloated when SOC is high is due to no hidden reserve. As the SOC drops the hidden reserve grows giving you the impression you are losing range much faster than you really are. Now, I am not saying your estimated range at 100% SOC is accurate but its not nearly as bad as you think it is.

At "zero" (according to the car) you have over 10% capacity in reserve. Unless you have LEAF Spy or something similar, you are driving blind with no indication you are running out until you start losing power. In the Gen one LEAF, I consider LEAF Spy indispensable.

Re: Cold sucks (literally)

Posted: Wed Jan 08, 2020 8:01 am
by Tortoisehead77
DaveinOlyWA wrote:
Tue Jan 07, 2020 7:17 am
The reason your GOM "seems" bloated when SOC is high is due to no hidden reserve. As the SOC drops the hidden reserve grows giving you the impression you are losing range much faster than you really are. Now, I am not saying your estimated range at 100% SOC is accurate but its not nearly as bad as you think it is.

At "zero" (according to the car) you have over 10% capacity in reserve. Unless you have LEAF Spy or something similar, you are driving blind with no indication you are running out until you start losing power. In the Gen one LEAF, I consider LEAF Spy indispensable.
[/quote]


I never mentioned the GOM. That's a whole other topic.
The issue is that I lose 40% in range (or more) in cold temperatures in the relatively mild Pacific Northwest.

Re: Cold sucks (literally)

Posted: Wed Jan 08, 2020 8:17 am
by webeleafowners
DougWantsALeaf wrote:
Tue Jan 07, 2020 2:13 pm
Don't forget that the 40 and 62 Leaf keep about 9% of the battery below the 1% mark. Most of that is very usable without power loss.
Doug can you take me to school on this?

For example what happens at 1 percent?

How is that 9 percent useful when 1 percent is reached.

How does the car behave?

What are instrument indications.

What amount of miles or km are left at this level?


Thanks Doug. Just trying to prepare ourselves for our new leaf Eplus SL arrival in March/April.

Re: Cold sucks (literally)

Posted: Wed Jan 08, 2020 8:34 am
by DougWantsALeaf
There is a good AAA article on range loss based on the 2018 Leaf. If you can live without turning on the heat (use the seat and steerwheel heaters) and keep your tires inflated, you only lose 15-20%.

https://electrek.co/2019/02/07/study-el ... -disputes/

The Leaf Fared pretty well, though the study showed the 40 Leaf to just have 141 miles of range.

Re: Cold sucks (literally)

Posted: Wed Jan 08, 2020 12:01 pm
by Tortoisehead77
DougWantsALeaf wrote:
Wed Jan 08, 2020 8:34 am
There is a good AAA article on range loss based on the 2018 Leaf. If you can live without turning on the heat (use the seat and steerwheel heaters) and keep your tires inflated, you only lose 15-20%.

https://electrek.co/2019/02/07/study-el ... -disputes/

The Leaf Fared pretty well, though the study showed the 40 Leaf to just have 141 miles of range.
141 miles of range is about right for summer driving.

Re: Cold sucks (literally)

Posted: Sat Jan 11, 2020 5:21 am
by dmacarthur
Recent stats in cold weather: (Leaf Plus studded snow tires no heat pump, studded tires really increase rolling resistance)

Southern Vt to Montpelier, 65 MPH Highway 6 degrees F: 2.6 M/KWH
Montpelier to Montreal 60 MPH Highway 6 degrees F: 3.0 M/KWH
Return:
Montreal to Montpelier 60 MPH 35 degrees F: 3.3 M/KWH
Montpelier to Southern Vt 65 MPH 35 degrees F: 3.2 M/KWH

From this one sample, a couple of question/ conclusions: it seems that raising the highway Cruise Control from 60 to 65 did NOT greatly reduce M/KWH, as I thought it would, and, -

The huge differences between the 6 degree drive and the 35 degree drive are probably mostly battery inefficiency and NOT heat useage since we kept the seats on and did not over-use heat.... seems the 64KW battery operates less efficiently at colder temps?

Re: Cold sucks (literally)

Posted: Mon Jan 13, 2020 6:55 pm
by johnlocke
Any li-ion battery has less capacity at low temps. A cold battery can't accept as much of a charge and has a harder time discharging. Actually this is true of any battery that is based on chemical reactions. That's why battery warmers are necessary for cold weather.