johnlocke
Posts: 623
Joined: Fri Jan 08, 2016 3:47 pm
Delivery Date: 14 Dec 2015
Leaf Number: 300582

Miles per KWH - is it accurate?

Thu Jan 02, 2020 10:31 pm

I've been checking my miles per KWH lately and started wondering if the Nissan dash value wasn't off. I decided to check using the GIDs values from LeafSpy. I recorded the starting value, the ending value, and miles driven. Multiplied the GIDs used by .0785 to get KWH and divided mileage by KWH to get miles/KWH. My dash reads 3.7 to 3.8/KWH pretty regularly but the calculated value is several tenth's lower. I've done this several times now with similar results each time. I've always thought that the Nissan numbers seemed a little high compared to what I was actually seeing in terms of mileage. Has anyone else checked their miles/KWH this way? I'm curious if this is a common problem or just a quirk of my driving habits.
2016 SV, New battery at 45K mi.
Jamul, CA
San Diego East County

cwerdna
Posts: 11000
Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2011 4:31 pm
Delivery Date: 28 Jul 2013
Location: SF Bay Area, CA

Re: Miles per KWH - is it accurate?

Thu Jan 02, 2020 10:38 pm

The default in Leaf Spy IIRC is 77.5 watt-hours per gid. Whether or not that's actually correct at all, esp. over the entire range of the battery is ummm...questionable.

See https://mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?p=562501#p562501 and the posts I linked to.

'19 Bolt Premier
'13 Leaf SV w/premium (owned)
'13 Leaf SV w/QC + LED & premium (lease over)

Please don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

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Nubo
Posts: 5730
Joined: Fri May 28, 2010 11:01 am
Delivery Date: 31 Oct 2014
Location: Vallejo, CA

Re: Miles per KWH - is it accurate?

Thu Jan 02, 2020 11:48 pm

Doesn't sound like you're accounting for energy derived from regeneration. Back when I used to log onto Carwings to checks stats, regen fairly consistently contributed about 10% of the overall power consumed.
I noticed you're still working with polymers.

DougWantsALeaf
Posts: 1987
Joined: Fri May 10, 2013 8:21 pm
Delivery Date: 18 May 2013
Leaf Number: 407811
Location: Chicago North Side

Re: Miles per KWH - is it accurate?

Fri Jan 03, 2020 9:20 am

For long drives I depend on the dash miles per kWh.
It feels spot in for me when calculating back to what LeafSpy says I have left, if not slightly low. When I was driving back through rain from Iowa city, I ended with 3.9 efficiency for the 220 or so miles. With 58 kW usable I should only have about 226 mile range. I ended with over 5 kW left, which is about 20 miles or 240 total possible. Now with only 1 decimal precision it could be 3.94 or...3.99 depending on how it shows up. At 3.99 we would be pretty right on.
2019 S Plus (97.98% SOH) & 2019 SV Plus (94.84% SOH) Both Silver
2013 Leaf SV sold 2019 with 11 bars
100 Mile Club Member (Number 87)
Max Miles on 13 Leaf: 120 miles
Max Miles on 19 SV+: 242 Highway miles @ 4.5 miles/kWh

johnlocke
Posts: 623
Joined: Fri Jan 08, 2016 3:47 pm
Delivery Date: 14 Dec 2015
Leaf Number: 300582

Re: Miles per KWH - is it accurate?

Fri Jan 03, 2020 9:53 am

cwerdna wrote:
Thu Jan 02, 2020 10:38 pm
The default in Leaf Spy IIRC is 77.5 watt-hours per gid. Whether or not that's actually correct at all, esp. over the entire range of the battery is ummm...questionable.

See https://mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?p=562501#p562501 and the posts I linked to.
I used .0785 because that was the best fit for the spreadsheet I use where I track my degradation. It compares GID's reported to AH reported by LeafSpy. I used the nominal battery voltage x the amp hours reported x a constant to calculate GID's. I got the best agreement with observations with 78.5w/GID. YMMV.
2016 SV, New battery at 45K mi.
Jamul, CA
San Diego East County

johnlocke
Posts: 623
Joined: Fri Jan 08, 2016 3:47 pm
Delivery Date: 14 Dec 2015
Leaf Number: 300582

Re: Miles per KWH - is it accurate?

Fri Jan 03, 2020 10:05 am

Nubo wrote:
Thu Jan 02, 2020 11:48 pm
Doesn't sound like you're accounting for energy derived from regeneration. Back when I used to log onto Carwings to checks stats, regen fairly consistently contributed about 10% of the overall power consumed.
Since I used starting and ending values from LeafSpy, regen would have been rolled in. It's possible that Nissan's dash calculation doesn't consider regeneration which would push it's numbers higher but I have no idea how Nissan calculates it. That's part of the question here.
2016 SV, New battery at 45K mi.
Jamul, CA
San Diego East County

johnlocke
Posts: 623
Joined: Fri Jan 08, 2016 3:47 pm
Delivery Date: 14 Dec 2015
Leaf Number: 300582

Re: Miles per KWH - is it accurate?

Fri Jan 03, 2020 10:19 am

DougWantsALeaf wrote:
Fri Jan 03, 2020 9:20 am
For long drives I depend on the dash miles per kWh.
It feels spot in for me when calculating back to what LeafSpy says I have left, if not slightly low. When I was driving back through rain from Iowa city, I ended with 3.9 efficiency for the 220 or so miles. With 58 kW usable I should only have about 226 mile range. I ended with over 5 kW left, which is about 20 miles or 240 total possible. Now with only 1 decimal precision it could be 3.94 or...3.99 depending on how it shows up. At 3.99 we would be pretty right on.
If you covered 220 miles with 53 KWH then you averaged 4.15m/KWH not 3.9. Even at 4.0m/KWH you would have had only about 3 KWH left. Your dash read low, mine seems to read high. Could be just the difference between a '16 and a '19 model with different size packs. I'm just curious about the accuracy of the gauge.
2016 SV, New battery at 45K mi.
Jamul, CA
San Diego East County

DougWantsALeaf
Posts: 1987
Joined: Fri May 10, 2013 8:21 pm
Delivery Date: 18 May 2013
Leaf Number: 407811
Location: Chicago North Side

Re: Miles per KWH - is it accurate?

Fri Jan 03, 2020 1:56 pm

I will try to do some screen shots in my next long drive and google drive them so I can share.

Leftie, if I become a premium member, can I upload photos?
2019 S Plus (97.98% SOH) & 2019 SV Plus (94.84% SOH) Both Silver
2013 Leaf SV sold 2019 with 11 bars
100 Mile Club Member (Number 87)
Max Miles on 13 Leaf: 120 miles
Max Miles on 19 SV+: 242 Highway miles @ 4.5 miles/kWh

LeftieBiker
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Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 3:17 am
Delivery Date: 30 Apr 2018
Location: Upstate New York, US

Re: Miles per KWH - is it accurate?

Fri Jan 03, 2020 3:22 pm

Leftie, if I become a premium member, can I upload photos?

I honestly don't know. I think you can add a photo to your posting ID, but I don't know if the posting photo upload feature still works.
Scarlet Ember 2018 Leaf SL W/ Pro Pilot
2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, & 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
BAFX OBDII Dongle
PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

dmacarthur
Posts: 138
Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2018 4:00 pm
Delivery Date: 03 Jul 2018
Leaf Number: 306556
Location: Vermont

Re: Miles per KWH - is it accurate?

Fri Jan 17, 2020 4:59 am

my suspicion is that M/KWH meter on the 2019 S does not account for electricity used to heat the cabin- traction motor pretty accurate I think but I get bigger differences in actual miles depending on how cold it is outside.
2015 Leaf sold
2019 Leaf Plus S as of 9/30/19

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