My Mountain Top Experience - Mt. Hamilton/Lick Observatory

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Long4Leaf

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 2, 2010
Messages
139
Well I suppose everyone has their mountain to climb, and mine was going to Lick Observatory on Mt Hamilton. So I decided to go for a Sunday (well actually Saturday) drive just for the fun of it. It's a little bit of "me too", but here is my experience:

-- Left home (Sunnyvale) with a full charge, 126mi range, ~80ft elevation
-- First leg across the valley, drop to sea level, then up to ~70ft at the base of the east bay hills
19.6 miles, 10 bars left, 103 showing on range, 5.8mi/kWh, level
-- Sencond leg was up Quito road to the first ridge - ~2010 ft elevation
4.6 miles, 8 bars left, 38 showing on range, 1.3 mi/kWh, average grade ~8%
-- Third leg was down into a valley between the ridge and Mt. Hamilton - ~1600 ft elevation
1.2 miles, 8 bars left, 48 showing on range, 50.8 mi/kWh, average grade ~6%
-- Forth leg was up to Lick Observatory, Mt. Hamilton - 4196 ft elevation
11.2 miles, 5 bars left, 17 showing on range, 2.2 mi/kWh, average grade ~4.5%
-- Fifth leg was back the way I came to the valley, - ~1600 ft elevation
11.2 miles, 6 bars left, 67 showing on range, 98.9 mi/kWh, average grade ~4.5%
-- For the sixth leg, I decided not to go back up to the ridge, but go around it contining down hill until I reached Santa Clara valley floor - ~175 ft elevation
8.4 miles, 6 bars left, 77 showing on range, 99.9 mi/kWh, average grade ~3%
-- Seventh leg was back home accross the valley - ~ 80ft but drops to zero and back up
16.7 miles, 4 bars left, 43 showing on range, 6.0 mi/kWh, level

So, total trip was 72.9 miles using 8 bars, ~4600ft vertical climb, ~4.5mi/kWh. (I took all surface roads, no highway.)

There is one thing I was particularly impressed with. While it is not a BMW 335i convertable (my other car), it handled the mountain roads wonderfully. While I was not driving agressively, on the way down I was trying to avoid using the brakes so ended up taking some of the hairpin turns pretty agressively. It handled them smooth as silk. And as for the complaints about the steering, again while not a performance sports car, I thought the feel of the turns was clean and responsive.

It was a fun drive, good fresh air, good view, a little wild life, ... :D :D :D So the LEAF can be more than just an around town commute car.

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Thanks Boomer for pointing me to the instructions on how to post images. :mrgreen:
 
Very nice report, Long.

I'd love to see your pics. Here is how to post them:

http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=2456

I took my LEAF to my favorite twisty road drive the other day. This is a country canyon road with a speed limit of 35, which I usually drive at 40 to 45. My most satisfying drives there have been with my former car, an '08 BMW 328i coupe Sport 6 speed, and in that car it literally had me grinning as I drove it. As you say, the LEAF does nicely on curving roads. It's certainly no BMW, but also certainly not a Prius, either. I thought that the tires gripped well and the instant-on torque made the LEAF accelerate nicely out of the curves. On the other hand, the LEAF sits up higher on the road, there might have been a bit more body roll than in the BMW, though not much more, and I had to pay closer attention to the steering to make sure I kept the line I wanted on the road, while in the BMW you can rely on steering feel for some of that. No real sports car grins induced here, but kind of fun and I may take it back for another trip.
 
Long4Leaf,

Thank you for the report.

I live in Shasta county, and nearly all my driving will be "mountain" driving, until the DC fast-chargers are in place on the 1-5 corridor. Nice to be getting reports that LEAF handling matches what the relatively low weight (for a BEV) and low center of gravity promised.

I'm certainly not expecting the LEAF to be a "sports car", but I just never have been able to seriously consider a much heavier BEV/plug in hybrid, for my roads. The first rule of vehicle design for both efficiency and handling, IMO, was long ago best expressed (and largely forgotten since) as "add lightness".

Your range-with-altitude-numbers are VERY much appreciated. What do you think your average speed might have been?

Obviously, you got a large percentage of the energy expended in the climb back from brake regeneration. Would you care to give your "real world" estimate, either as a percentage, or expressed as miles of range "consumed", per 1,000 ft of climb AND descent? Put another way, if you took a 73 mile flat drive at the same speed, how many bars and/or what range would you expect to have left?
 
Thanks for posting this. Great information. And special thanks for keeping track of the battery gauge as well as the range estimate. It looks like you added one bar on the way down. I'm guessing you were in ECO on the descent. I'm also guessing no climate control?

All in all, impressive performance. I wouldn't have bet you could make it to the top of Mt Hamilton, and you made it with room to spare.
 
Long4Leaf said:
Well I suppose everyone has their mountain to climb, and mine was going to Lick Observatory on Mt Hamilton. So I decided to go for a Sunday (well actually Saturday) drive just for the fun of it. It's a little bit of "me too"...
Thank you very much for providing the data! My drive home from the dealer is going to involve the better part of 5000 feet of climbing, so I am very happy to see further confirmation of the LEAF's mountain climbing abilities. Your efficiency seems to have been quite good. My only question is, how fast were you driving while climbing?
 
abasile said:
My only question is, how fast were you driving while climbing?

Its a hairpin turns mountain road, my guess 15-45mph.. the lesson for you on how to deal with your 5000ft elevation is to drive at 55mph at most.. if you start to get worried slow down to 45, 45mph is probably the slowest that you can go in a hwy without getting a ticket.. dont worry, no one will hit you from the back, those accidents are extremely rare and usually involve heavy fog. Later on as you get used to your daily commute start increasing your speed, but who knows?, you may get hooked and keep driving at 55mph.. forsaking the culture of rushing about and driving in a zen like state.
 
Herm said:
abasile said:
My only question is, how fast were you driving while climbing?
Its a hairpin turns mountain road, my guess 15-45mph.. the lesson for you on how to deal with your 5000ft elevation is to drive at 55mph at most.. if you start to get worried slow down to 45, 45mph is probably the slowest that you can go in a hwy without getting a ticket.. dont worry, no one will hit you from the back, those accidents are extremely rare and usually involve heavy fog. Later on as you get used to your daily commute start increasing your speed, but who knows?, you may get hooked and keep driving at 55mph.. forsaking the culture of rushing about and driving in a zen like state.
Thanks; fortunately, it turns out that the speed limit on both CA-18 and CA-330 (the two highways we use to climb into the San Bernardino Mountains) is 55. As long as one is willing to use turnouts to allow faster cars to pass, driving 40-45 mph is not a problem, and is actually quite the norm for some locals who want to conserve fuel as well as for many of our "flatlander" visitors who aren't used to the curves.

Also, I don't anticipate driving the LEAF "down the hill" (and back up) more than once or twice per week at most. Due to the continuous power drain required to climb a mountain, and the potential for additional stress on the battery pack, I would have a hard time recommending the LEAF to anyone whose daily commute involves a big mountain climb until more is known about the impact on battery capacity over time. However, I do expect the LEAF will be quite nice for driving within our mountain communities (Crestline to Big Bear).
 
abasile said:
Long4Leaf said:
Well I suppose everyone has their mountain to climb, and mine was going to Lick Observatory on Mt Hamilton. So I decided to go for a Sunday (well actually Saturday) drive just for the fun of it. It's a little bit of "me too"...
Thank you very much for providing the data! My drive home from the dealer is going to involve the better part of 5000 feet of climbing, so I am very happy to see further confirmation of the LEAF's mountain climbing abilities. Your efficiency seems to have been quite good. My only question is, how fast were you driving while climbing?

On the 8% grade, about 20 mph, on the 4.5% grade up to the top, about 25 mph. The road is very curvy, so this was typical. On the surface roads before getting to the climb, average speed was about 30mph. So overall, very little wind drag on my trip.
 
edatoakrun said:
Long4Leaf,

Thank you for the report.

I live in Shasta county, and nearly all my driving will be "mountain" driving, until the DC fast-chargers are in place on the 1-5 corridor. Nice to be getting reports that LEAF handling matches what the relatively low weight (for a BEV) and low center of gravity promised.

I'm certainly not expecting the LEAF to be a "sports car", but I just never have been able to seriously consider a much heavier BEV/plug in hybrid, for my roads. The first rule of vehicle design for both efficiency and handling, IMO, was long ago best expressed (and largely forgotten since) as "add lightness".

Your range-with-altitude-numbers are VERY much appreciated. What do you think your average speed might have been?

Obviously, you got a large percentage of the energy expended in the climb back from brake regeneration. Would you care to give your "real world" estimate, either as a percentage, or expressed as miles of range "consumed", per 1,000 ft of climb AND descent? Put another way, if you took a 73 mile flat drive at the same speed, how many bars and/or what range would you expect to have left?

On flat land, eco mode, surface streets, I get about 5.8mi/kWhr. So given that I used about 16 kWhr on this trip , I'd expect about 20 miles more range for same condition on flat ground.
 
Long4Leaf said:
On the 8% grade, about 20 mph, on the 4.5% grade up to the top, about 25 mph. The road is very curvy, so this was typical. On the surface roads before getting to the climb, average speed was about 30mph. So overall, very little wind drag on my trip.
That is indeed one curvy road! I expect to be doing a steady 40-45 mph up a grade that's an average of 7%. (At that speed on CA-18 or CA-330, slowing down for curves is unnecessary.) Besides a bit more wind drag vs. climbing at 25 mph, there is the possibility of the battery not discharging as efficiently at higher rates. Hopefully, we shall soon see. :D
 
Hey Long...

Could you provide more details about the exact route you chose up and back?
I've never been up there before, but would love to go check it out sometime.
Sounds like a great Sunday drive from Sunnyvale.

Thanks!
 
lemketron said:
Hey Long...

Could you provide more details about the exact route you chose up and back?
I've never been up there before, but would love to go check it out sometime.
Sounds like a great Sunday drive from Sunnyvale.

Thanks!
Maybe the South Bay members of the SF BayLEAFs can do it as a group on a weekend when we aren't having a meeting--or maybe after one of them?
 
gascant said:
Maybe the South Bay members of the SF BayLEAFs can do it as a group on a weekend when we aren't having a meeting--or maybe after one of them?
What a kick that would be! Can you imagine 20 LEAFs parked in front of the observatory? Or the way we'd look like a long train, winding our way up the curves, nose to hatch to nose to hatch? (Well, not too close together, of course.)

You know how old folks live in the past. I can't help thinking back to a day in late 1968 when my first wife and I were trying to get the hang of being parents to our first child. Our baby had been very fussy all day, and when I got home my wife had had it. I knew that riding in the car usually calmed our daughter down, so I suggested a drive. My wife said, "You take her, I need some time to myself." I loaded her in her car seat in the back of our VW Beetle, and away I went. Since we lived on the east side of San Jose I started toward Alum Rock Park, but changed my mind and turned right on Mt. Hamilton Road. The whimpering had stopped, and checks in the rear view mirror confirmed our darling daughter was enjoying the drive. I was enjoying it too, though Bugs are not exactly known for for their stability on curves. After I got to the curviest part I was watching the road 100% of the time, and not looking in the mirror, though things certainly sounded peaceful back there.

Imagine my consternation when I stopped at the top and turned to grin at her. She had vomited all over everything! It was one of the guiltiest feelings I have ever had in my entire life. But she smiled back at me and said "Goo."

Ray
 
planet4ever said:
Imagine my consternation when I stopped at the top and turned to grin at her. She had vomited all over everything! It was one of the guiltiest feelings I have ever had in my entire life. But she smiled back at me and said "Goo."
Ray
Great story, Ray! Lemketron is also interested in it. Let's pick a date and time and go for it. If we post it here, we'll see who we get.
 
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