Acura4Ever
Posts: 8
Joined: Tue Apr 03, 2018 7:47 pm
Delivery Date: 07 Mar 2018

Re: Battery Upgrades are very possible

Thu Jul 04, 2019 7:21 am

Kebin, if a remember correctly, muxsan said to it will be possible eventually to add gen 2 batteries int leaf 1 using only the CAN man in the middle bus with is latest video of his projet. But I will be tested later this year.
Leaf 2013
Qc, Canada
2nd lost @ 90K Km

Dala
Posts: 108
Joined: Sun Oct 28, 2018 11:24 am
Delivery Date: 01 Jan 2015
Leaf Number: 316851

Re: Battery Upgrades are very possible

Thu Jul 04, 2019 9:55 am

kebin wrote:Thanks for the update and nice work!

I thought you were going to put the CAN bus man in the middle adapter between the battery and the VCM in order to avoid having to open the packs and do the cell swap.

I wonder whether this approach is feasible, if it was, and if 40/62kwh batteries are electrically compatible with leaf gen1, it would mean that you could upgrade a gen1 with a gen2 battery quite easily, by just translating the protocols on the fly.
EVs Enhanced over in NZ is working on this. They will offer OBD2 flashing to make the 30kWh pack work with a 24kWh VCM, without having to open it up. I am doing this the bruteforce method, and there will surely be better methods available in the future. 40kWh is the next step, but 62kWh is afaik mechanically different. We don't know how different yet, there aren't many crashed 62kWh packs floating around yet...

GerryAZ
Gold Member
Posts: 2289
Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 6:47 pm
Delivery Date: 12 Jun 2011
Location: Phoenix, AZ

Re: Battery Upgrades are very possible

Thu Jul 04, 2019 2:30 pm

I subscribed to Nissan Publications for a short time to look at the service manual for 2019 because I am considering replacement of my 2015 with a new SL+ and want to know some of the technical details. There are a lot of differences between the 40 kWh and 62 kWh versions. The number of modules is completely different between the 62 kWh and 40 kWh packs. Also, the 40 kWh packs have fewer modules than the 30 kWh and 24 kWh packs so upgrading by just swapping cell modules will not be possible. I will be watching developments in this thread.
Gerry
Silver LEAF 2011 SL rear ended (totaled) by in-attentive driver 1/4/2015 at 50,422 miles
Silver LEAF 2015 SL purchased 2/7/2015; traded 8/10/2019 at 82,436 miles
White LEAF 2019 SL+ purchased 8/10/2019

Oilpan4
Gold Member
Posts: 942
Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2019 10:51 pm
Delivery Date: 10 May 2018
Leaf Number: 004270

Re: Battery Upgrades are very possible

Fri Jul 05, 2019 11:30 pm

I too am a fan of the brute force method.
2011 white SL leaf with 2014 batt.
Chargers: Panasonic brick moded for 240v, duosida 16a 240v and a 10kw setec portable CHAdeMO
Location: 88103

Dala
Posts: 108
Joined: Sun Oct 28, 2018 11:24 am
Delivery Date: 01 Jan 2015
Leaf Number: 316851

Re: Battery Upgrades are very possible

Mon Jul 08, 2019 12:01 pm

I now have some data! Did a lot of driving over the past days to get a feel for the new pack. I managed a comfortable 205km at 15-13*C with no AC or heat. I averaged 7.3km/kWh, due to me slowing down after going past 0.0% SOC.

The first 100km I drove 85-100km/h. The second 100km I drove between 60-85km/h. Here is what the 24 LBC instrumentation said:

16% dash, 114km travelled. Low battery warning!
8% dash, 135km travelled. - - - km remaining
- - -% dash, 142km travelled, - - - 3.66V min cell voltage (Leafspy 12.3% SOC)
150km travelled, 3.64V min voltage (3.61V under load), (Leafspy 7.6% SOC)
165km travelled, 3.58V min voltage (3.53V under load), (Leafspy 0.0% SOC)
205km travelled, 3.37V min voltage (3.30V under load) (Leafspy gave up a long time ago...)

I could probably have kept driving until turtle, and waited for the contactors to open, but I really didn't want to strand myself. Taking it slow, it would probably been possible to drive 220-230km on a single charge. I love the 30kWh battery, but the instrumentation needs fixing asap, Half of the range is left after it indicates the first low battery voltage lol!

So, question to you leaf-gurus, what is the turtle cell voltage on a 24 LBC? And how low would you comfortably go? I chickened out at 3.30V under load, but it might be possible to squeeze more out of the pack?

Oilpan4
Gold Member
Posts: 942
Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2019 10:51 pm
Delivery Date: 10 May 2018
Leaf Number: 004270

Re: Battery Upgrades are very possible

Thu Jul 11, 2019 3:44 am

I think that's what happens when a older leaf battery is repacked with 40kwh modules.
A good portion of the range you gain is between LBW and turtle.
2011 white SL leaf with 2014 batt.
Chargers: Panasonic brick moded for 240v, duosida 16a 240v and a 10kw setec portable CHAdeMO
Location: 88103

Dala
Posts: 108
Joined: Sun Oct 28, 2018 11:24 am
Delivery Date: 01 Jan 2015
Leaf Number: 316851

Re: Battery Upgrades are very possible

Thu Jul 11, 2019 4:56 am

Oilpan4 wrote:I think that's what happens when a older leaf battery is repacked with 40kwh modules.
A good portion of the range you gain is between LBW and turtle.
I think the 40kWh is even better when you do it the bruteforce method. Theoretical calculations would be ~150km before low battery warning, and possible to drive up to 300km (150more) between LBW and turtle.

I actually just got a message that a 2018 ZE1 40kWh was crashed this week, and I got first dibs on the pack! Will be interesting to look at a 40kWh pack too, and perform that bruteforce upgrade too!

Dala
Posts: 108
Joined: Sun Oct 28, 2018 11:24 am
Delivery Date: 01 Jan 2015
Leaf Number: 316851

Re: Battery Upgrades are very possible

Sun Jul 28, 2019 10:15 am

I've been road-tripping and taking a proper vacation the last week. The Leaf is performing excellently! We've had a proper heatwave, the all black Leaf with black interior showed +34C as highest temp!

A benefit of the warm weather is better battery performance. The Guess-O-Meter showed as high as 203km fully charged. Does the stock 24kWh Leaf even show that high estimates when new?
Image

State of health has capped at 103.27%. It hasn't budget at all in a week. Maybe it doesn't go higher?
Image

camasleaf
Posts: 646
Joined: Sun Sep 26, 2010 5:20 am
Delivery Date: 17 Jun 2011
Location: Camas, WA

Re: Battery Upgrades are very possible

Sun Jul 28, 2019 9:38 pm

I still remember that when I picked up our 2011 LEAF the dealer said that it did not matter how much he tried to charge it, the car did not go above 128 miles that is 205 km. The real world range was 80 something miles in the summer.
2011 SLe 06/17/11 Over 89000 miles 61%SOH 13.8kWh
2018 Honda Clarity PHEV
2014 Model S P85 77888 miles 256mile range
5.7kW DC Solar System

Oilpan4
Gold Member
Posts: 942
Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2019 10:51 pm
Delivery Date: 10 May 2018
Leaf Number: 004270

Re: Battery Upgrades are very possible

Mon Jul 29, 2019 2:00 am

Dala wrote:
Thu Jul 11, 2019 4:56 am
Oilpan4 wrote:I think that's what happens when a older leaf battery is repacked with 40kwh modules.
A good portion of the range you gain is between LBW and turtle.
I think the 40kWh is even better when you do it the bruteforce method. Theoretical calculations would be ~150km before low battery warning, and possible to drive up to 300km (150more) between LBW and turtle.

I actually just got a message that a 2018 ZE1 40kWh was crashed this week, and I got first dibs on the pack! Will be interesting to look at a 40kWh pack too, and perform that bruteforce upgrade too!
Yeah if we could get a BMS that could read the 40kwh cells properly.
I say get the 40kwh cells in there now, then maybe if we are lucky some one will build or reprogram our 24kwh bms to work more correctly with 40kwh cells later on.

The absolute max range I have seen on mine was 124 miles in eco mode.
Thats when I was stuck level 1 charging and driving it like a grandma.. SOH was around 90% then too.
Around this time next year I will start seriously looking for a 40kwh pack.
I wouldn't mind having a 103.27% SOH that doesn't move for like 7 years.
2011 white SL leaf with 2014 batt.
Chargers: Panasonic brick moded for 240v, duosida 16a 240v and a 10kw setec portable CHAdeMO
Location: 88103

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