User avatar
TomT
Posts: 10645
Joined: Sun Aug 08, 2010 12:09 pm
Delivery Date: 01 Mar 2011
Leaf Number: 000360
Location: California, now Georgia
Contact: Website

Re: Update on Battery Warranty Enhancement for 2011 & 2012 L

Tue Aug 27, 2013 8:09 am

I think the crux of it is that, yes, they certainly could do it, but since the 2011 and 2012 is a different system and different software, they can't simply patch the old code with the new code from the 2013. Thus, it would require a specific code development cycle to make the change and they are likely not willing to invest the time and cost to do so...

I know it annoys some, but in the overall scheme of things, there are probably better things they can be doing with the resources...
Stanton wrote:Why can't a large company--with a lot of resources--do something as simple as port this feature into the 2011/2012 models? There is a HUGE--and I mean HUGE--difference between pressing "OK" EVERY TIME you start the car and once a month
Leaf SL 2011 to 2016, Volt Premier 2016 to 2019, and now:
2019 Model 3; LR, RWD, FSD, 19" Sport Wheels, silver/black; built 3/17/19, delivered 3/29/19.

User avatar
TomT
Posts: 10645
Joined: Sun Aug 08, 2010 12:09 pm
Delivery Date: 01 Mar 2011
Leaf Number: 000360
Location: California, now Georgia
Contact: Website

Re: Update on Battery Warranty Enhancement for 2011 & 2012 L

Tue Aug 27, 2013 8:14 am

I'm sure they they will prudently adopt a wait and see attitude... Remember the old adage about "Fool me once..."
edatoakrun wrote:What do the "I will never buy a BEV without ATM", and "The LEAF would be a great car, if it only had ATM" party members have to say in response?
Leaf SL 2011 to 2016, Volt Premier 2016 to 2019, and now:
2019 Model 3; LR, RWD, FSD, 19" Sport Wheels, silver/black; built 3/17/19, delivered 3/29/19.

User avatar
JPWhite
Gold Member
Posts: 1784
Joined: Sun Jul 31, 2011 3:41 pm
Delivery Date: 30 Jul 2011
Leaf Number: 5734
Location: Hendersonville TN
Contact: Website Yahoo Messenger AOL

Re: Update on Battery Warranty Enhancement for 2011 & 2012 L

Tue Aug 27, 2013 8:22 am

TonyWilliams wrote: 4. Any competitor to the Tesla products must have a robust quick recharging / battery swapping capability. My advice; buy into the Tesla Supercharger network.
Just three words to say in response to this suggestion.

Yes yes and YES!!

Actually I have more :) . With Ecotality in financial straits and allegedly guilty of fudging govt reimbursements, charging a EV may become very challenging in the not to distant future in many LEAF key markets.

If you think I want to go to a Nissan / Infiniti dealer for a charge, guess again. I don't want to beg for a fob, ask permission, fight with for-sale ICE cars in the spots, not open 24 hours, and don't want a leering salesman around. That's the current Nissan CHAdeMO model in the USA.
This can be addressed. If Boswells a small Harley Davidson dealer in Nashville can make their dealership a destination (some of the best catfish in Nashville), car dealers could do the same. Offer food and/or refreshments while folks juice up. I have zero interest in motorcycles, but I've been to Boswells many times.
5. There is no reason Nissan can't build a better mouse trap, but the committee process of Nissan is not a match for a driven, ambitious, make-it-happen, autocratic guy like Elon Musk. He will eventually move on to other things, but I recommend finding that guy in your company and putting him in charge of that future car, with a budget to make it happen.
Agreed. The current OEM business model is out dated. If Nissan can be one of the first to reinvent themselves, one product line at a time starting with EV's, they will be poised for great success.
--
JP White
http://jpwhitenissanleaf.com
2011 Blue SL-e, 132,400 Miles.
Lost 5 Capacity bars
7/18/13 (29,206), 8/25/14 (51,728), 7/12/15 (71.108), 5/12/16 (88,362), 10/17/16 (96,532)
New Battery 12/3/16 (98,956)
2018 Model 3 20,000 Miles.

User avatar
DaveEV
Posts: 6242
Joined: Fri Apr 23, 2010 3:51 pm
Location: San Diego

Re: Update on Battery Warranty Enhancement for 2011 & 2012 L

Tue Aug 27, 2013 8:31 am

TonyWilliams wrote:4. Any competitor to the Tesla products must have a robust quick recharging / battery swapping capability. My advice; buy into the Tesla Supercharger network. I will gladly pay the $1500 - $2500 for "free for life" recharging that I can use anywhere in North America.
This is a great idea, but I think that it will cost $2000 minimum - and probably significantly more. After all, Tesla charges it's own 60 kWh Model S owners $2000 to use the network (they say some of that cost is hardware, but I think we all know that the hardware cost should be minimal). The bigger issue for a non-Tesla (or specifically Nissan) is - what plug do you use? Do you need a 3rd plug? Or a CHAdeMO to Tesla adapter? Or perhaps just go with a single Tesla plug?

Either way - the batteries have to be able to handle 3-5 QCs day to match Tesla with no ill effects - that pretty much means extremely heat resistant battery (which it sounds like this hot-battery may quality) or some sort of thermal management.

User avatar
JPWhite
Gold Member
Posts: 1784
Joined: Sun Jul 31, 2011 3:41 pm
Delivery Date: 30 Jul 2011
Leaf Number: 5734
Location: Hendersonville TN
Contact: Website Yahoo Messenger AOL

Re: Update on Battery Warranty Enhancement for 2011 & 2012 L

Tue Aug 27, 2013 8:32 am

smkettner wrote:
shrink wrote:3. There was a claim that a car "Better than the Model S" was in development.
Better range?
Better acceleration?
Better economy?
Better in the crash test?
Better battery longevity?
Better handling?
Better interior?
Better cool factor?
Better charging?

All of the above? It will be many high bars to hurdle.
There's no need for Nissan to be specific. It's marketing talk.

Musk is out there saying he's gonna build an affordable EV in 2-3 years. aka a LEAF Killer. He isn't very specific, he's just seeding peoples minds to wait for his 'better car'. Whatever that is at a 'better price' whatever that is.

Nissan have correctly responded by saying we'll see your EV and raise you four new EV's.

Musk has set his targets on the lower end of the EV market, cross hairs on Nissan and GM. Musk has effectively dominated the luxury vehicle market in months, not years; overtaking BMW an entrenched leader. Tesla are a credible threat to all EV manufacturers. Nissan would be derelict in their duty if they didn't respond.

The good news for you and me is that this competition will result in better cheaper EV's for us to buy and drive.
--
JP White
http://jpwhitenissanleaf.com
2011 Blue SL-e, 132,400 Miles.
Lost 5 Capacity bars
7/18/13 (29,206), 8/25/14 (51,728), 7/12/15 (71.108), 5/12/16 (88,362), 10/17/16 (96,532)
New Battery 12/3/16 (98,956)
2018 Model 3 20,000 Miles.

User avatar
TonyWilliams
Posts: 10091
Joined: Sat Feb 19, 2011 1:48 am
Location: San Diego
Contact: Website

Re: Update on Battery Warranty Enhancement for 2011 & 2012 L

Tue Aug 27, 2013 8:32 am

TomT wrote:I'm sure they they will prudently adopt a wait and see attitude... Remember the old adage about "Fool me once..."
edatoakrun wrote:What do the "I will never buy a BEV without ATM", and "The LEAF would be a great car, if it only had ATM" party members have to say in response?
The same clueless clown also wrote this:

The good news? I finally lost my first capacity bar the morning after the Vacaville DC charge, at ~20,700 miles.
And still my LEAF still shows no significant loss of range, but I'll post more on that on an appropriate thread.

User avatar
TonyWilliams
Posts: 10091
Joined: Sat Feb 19, 2011 1:48 am
Location: San Diego
Contact: Website

Re: Update on Battery Warranty Enhancement for 2011 & 2012 L

Tue Aug 27, 2013 8:39 am

drees wrote:Either way - the batteries have to be able to handle 3-5 QCs day to match Tesla with no ill effects - that pretty much means extremely heat resistant battery (which it sounds like this hot-battery may quality) or some sort of thermal management.
If they are indeed testing the battery at 45C, we already know that Phoenix can be at that temperature, or higher on an asphalt parking lot.

Then, any quick charge of 1C or 2C will heat up just about ANY battery. What happens to a "hot battery" when I drive the West Coast Electric Highway on a 100F day? It gets really, really HOT, just like the current one.

The "hot battery" is just an improvement over the existing product; that doesn't make it a "capable" battery that is anything like what Tesla is providing with ROBUST temperature control.
Last edited by TonyWilliams on Tue Aug 27, 2013 9:09 am, edited 1 time in total.

FairwoodRed
Posts: 459
Joined: Wed May 18, 2011 10:25 am
Location: Fairwood, WA

Re: Update on Battery Warranty Enhancement for 2011 & 2012 L

Tue Aug 27, 2013 8:39 am

QueenBee wrote:I'm OK with Nissan keeping us in the dark until the cost is palatable as I will bet this will allow them to sell more EVs to the masses.
I don’t like being kept in the dark, but I do like that Nissan has shared that is their intention and some of the reasons for doing so.

shrink wrote:A few other notes (in no particular order) that I'm not sure have been mentioned previously:

5. The Nissan crew arrived at the hotel in LEAF's.
I know it’s a little thing, but this makes me happy :)

thankyouOB
Posts: 3583
Joined: Mon Feb 21, 2011 11:14 am
Delivery Date: 30 Apr 2011
Leaf Number: 1442
Location: Coastal LA

Re: Update on Battery Warranty Enhancement for 2011 & 2012 L

Tue Aug 27, 2013 8:41 am

chill with the name-calling and/or character attacks.
this happened earlier in this thread by someone else, as well.
it only makes you look small and your point is diminished.
may reserve/delivery 4/30/11
--
ECOtality/LADWP/ Blink 4/4/11
--
Gardena Nissan, msrp -1k
red SL with etec L3
SOLAR POWERED since 2008

User avatar
RegGuheert
Posts: 6419
Joined: Mon Mar 19, 2012 4:12 am
Delivery Date: 16 Mar 2012
Leaf Number: 5926
Location: Northern VA

Re: Update on Battery Warranty Enhancement for 2011 & 2012 L

Tue Aug 27, 2013 8:44 am

drees wrote:Reg, I think we are in violent agreement here. :)
Cool! :)

I'm just concerned because some of the comments about the meeting have made me think that Nissan feels that only hot climates will need the battery with the improved heat resistance. That is simply not true. Nissan needs to consider than the range-limited LEAF can be a very good fit for those of us with minimal driving needs. But this is true IF AND ONLY IF the battery can last for many years just sitting around.

Nissan, please put the heat-tolerant battery in ALL LEAFs!
RegGuheert
2011 Leaf SL Demo vehicle
10K mi. on 041413; 20K mi. (55.7Ah) on 080714; 30K mi. (52.0Ah) on 123015; 40K mi. (49.8Ah) on 020817; 50K mi. (47.2Ah) on 120717; 60K mi. (43.66Ah) on 091918.
Enphase Inverter Measured MTBF: M190, M215, M250, S280

Return to “News & Main LEAF Discussion”