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TomT
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Re: Bridgestone EP422 tires swapped for Michelin Primacy MXV

Wed Feb 13, 2013 3:18 pm

So that means they handle and brake poorly compared to both. If your primary concern is very long tire life, than they are likely fine. The MXV4 is a LRR tire, by the way...
Stanton wrote:
TomT wrote:This is why: UTQG: 820 A B
Very hard rubber with very mediocre traction...
So that means what with respect to what? The stock tires on the Leaf or the Michelins? Also, wouldn't you want a LRR tire over a NON-LRR tire (when available)?
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Stanton
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Re: Bridgestone EP422 tires swapped for Michelin Primacy MXV

Wed Feb 13, 2013 3:38 pm

So unless I'm mis-understanding, the Defenders will wear better than the MXVs which will wear better than the Ecopia's (at this point I would believe that just about ANYTHING will wear better than the Ecopia's :lol: ). In other words, the Michelin Defenders aren't a bad choice?
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TomT
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Re: Bridgestone EP422 tires swapped for Michelin Primacy MXV

Wed Feb 13, 2013 4:07 pm

Yes, if all one cares about is tire wear...
Stanton wrote:So unless I'm mis-understanding, the Defenders will wear better than the MXVs which will wear better than the Ecopia's (at this point I would believe that just about ANYTHING will wear better than the Ecopia's :lol: ). In other words, the Michelin Defenders aren't a bad choice?
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Nubo
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Re: Bridgestone EP422 tires swapped for Michelin Primacy MXV

Wed Feb 13, 2013 4:41 pm

Stanton wrote:So unless I'm mis-understanding, the Defenders will wear better than the MXVs which will wear better than the Ecopia's (at this point I would believe that just about ANYTHING will wear better than the Ecopia's :lol: ). In other words, the Michelin Defenders aren't a bad choice?
All tires strike a compromise between treadwear, traction, handling, and other variables... So it really depends on what you're looking for and what you're willing to accept. The Defender's ratings seem perfectly reasonable for a passenger tire if you're looking for maximum tread life; not every vehicle is or needs to be a sports car. Some people are just fine with Taxi, or Limo. :P I just bought a set of new Ecopias for my wife's Subaru. She was most interested in fuel efficiency. The tires other attributes aren't necessarily optimal but they're just fine for what her car is going to be used for. Again, it's all about what attributes are most important to YOU.

To be fair, the UTQG ratings say nothing about handling. They define "traction" as a function of straight-line wet braking.

For more details, check out tests and customer reviews and compare different tires, for example at tirerack.com.
I noticed you're still working with polymers.

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TomT
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Re: Bridgestone EP422 tires swapped for Michelin Primacy MXV

Wed Feb 13, 2013 5:04 pm

One other thing to consider is that improved braking and handling performance might save your life or prevent an accident when you least expect it.
You might not ever drive like an autocrosser but that enhanced capability definitely falls under the heading of active safety.
Nubo wrote:All tires strike a compromise between treadwear, traction, handling, and other variables... So it really depends on what you're looking for and what you're willing to accept. The Defender's ratings seem perfectly reasonable for a passenger tire if you're looking for maximum tread life; not every vehicle is or needs to be a sports car.
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Re: Bridgestone EP422 tires swapped for Michelin Primacy MXV

Wed Feb 13, 2013 5:06 pm

TomT wrote:Yes, if all one cares about is tire wear...
Stanton wrote:So unless I'm mis-understanding, the Defenders will wear better than the MXVs which will wear better than the Ecopia's (at this point I would believe that just about ANYTHING will wear better than the Ecopia's :lol: ). In other words, the Michelin Defenders aren't a bad choice?
All I know is I can't--make that won't--buy new tires every 20k miles, so I guess these will get serious consideration. Besides, I don't expect my Leaf to drive like a sports car ;)
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Re: Bridgestone EP422 tires swapped for Michelin Primacy MXV

Wed Feb 13, 2013 5:19 pm

[quote="TomT"]One other thing to consider is that improved braking and handling performance might save your life or prevent an accident when you least expect it.
You might not ever drive like an autocrosser but that enhanced capability definitely falls under the heading of active safety.

True, but it's all a matter of degree. One could go the extremes of sticky tires that last 5000 miles. Where the point of diminishing returns lies, is somewhat subjective and a tire's ultimate safety is comprised of a host of variables.
I noticed you're still working with polymers.

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Re: Bridgestone EP422 tires swapped for Michelin Primacy MXV

Fri Feb 15, 2013 11:49 am

I swapped my tires for MXV4s on Nov 27 and saw ~8% drop in efficiency. 3000 miles later I am still waiting for my efficiency to recover. However, handling is notably improved. Definitely have more fun with the MXV4s (perhaps part of that 8%... :-))

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Re: Bridgestone EP422 tires swapped for Michelin Primacy MXV

Fri Feb 15, 2013 12:29 pm

TickTock wrote:I swapped my tires for MXV4s on Nov 27 and saw ~8% drop in efficiency. 3000 miles later I am still waiting for my efficiency to recover. However, handling is notably improved. Definitely have more fun with the MXV4s (perhaps part of that 8%... :-))
Conversely, we replaced the tires on my wife's Subaru Forester, from Michelin Pilot Sport A/S to the Ecopia 422. Her mileage is up over 20%. Admittedly, the Michelin's tread was very aggressive but the Ecopias LRR is for real. We'll see about treadwear. Her top priority was LRR, and I like to keep the talent happy. :P
I noticed you're still working with polymers.

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Re: Bridgestone EP422 tires swapped for Michelin Primacy MXV

Wed Apr 24, 2013 9:59 pm

I put Michelin MXV4s on a couple weeks ago, after my Ecopias wore out at 22k miles. Efficiency definitely dropped immediately, even though I pumped the air pressure to 40. If I really baby the car, I can still get an average of 4.2 mi/kWh on the dash, but if I drive it like I drove it before the tire change, I'm getting 3.7 to 3.8, so a 7% or 8% efficiency loss here while the tires are new.

Frankly, I've been trying so hard to get a feel for the range with the new tires that I haven't pressed them in the corners to get a feel for whether the handling has improved or not.

One thing that I have noticed, though, is that there is a lot more tire wander on the freeway with the new tires, something that I never saw with the Ecopias. The car acts like it is in a strong crosswind on the freeway, when there's not much wind at all. I plan to do some more freeway driving on different pavement surfaces to get a better idea of what is happening, and I'll probably play with the tire pressures. With the tire pressures at 40, does anyone have any suggestions about this kind of freeway behavior, and is anyone else seeing this with the MXV4s?
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