greenleaf
Posts: 519
Joined: Thu Aug 05, 2010 10:06 am
Location: SF Bay Area

Re: Blink membership plans & fees

Thu Dec 15, 2011 10:53 am

greenleaf wrote:What!? This is incredibly sneaky if true.

Can we get the spouse to sign up for a separate account to get a separate RFID card?
I just click through the sign-up procedure.

Yes, it is true. You are required to agree to the new residential agreement. The new agreement is discussed here:

http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=43&t=6744" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
2011 Leaf: reserved 4/2010, delivered 3/2011 (VIN 9XX), sold 2/2014.
EVP Blink EVSE installed 4/2011.
OpenEVSE installed 3/2014.
3.22 kW DC Solar PV.

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evnow
Moderator
Posts: 11480
Joined: Thu Apr 22, 2010 11:41 am
Delivery Date: 25 Feb 2011
Leaf Number: 303
Location: Seattle, WA

Re: Blink membership plans & fees

Thu Dec 15, 2011 10:58 am

greenleaf wrote:Yes, it is true. You are required to agree to the new residential agreement. The new agreement is discussed here:

http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=43&t=6744" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Looks only for people in Bay Area. Is that correct ?
1st Leaf : 2/28/2011 to 5/6/2013
2nd Leaf : 5/4/2013 to 3/21/2017
Volt : 3/25/2017 to 5/25/2018
Model 3 : 5/10/2018 to ?

greenleaf
Posts: 519
Joined: Thu Aug 05, 2010 10:06 am
Location: SF Bay Area

Re: Blink membership plans & fees

Thu Dec 15, 2011 11:10 am

evnow wrote:
greenleaf wrote:Yes, it is true. You are required to agree to the new residential agreement. The new agreement is discussed here:

http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=43&t=6744" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Looks only for people in Bay Area. Is that correct ?
I suspect the RPA (residential participation agreement) is amended in all areas. Anyone else want to provide feedback? You need to click on the "RPA Terms and Conditions" link in the signup screen to see it.

If you look at the signup page shown below, you will notice how easy it is to simply check "I agree" without actually reading the new agreement.

Image
2011 Leaf: reserved 4/2010, delivered 3/2011 (VIN 9XX), sold 2/2014.
EVP Blink EVSE installed 4/2011.
OpenEVSE installed 3/2014.
3.22 kW DC Solar PV.

oakwcj
Posts: 339
Joined: Wed Apr 27, 2011 9:01 am
Delivery Date: 19 May 2011
Leaf Number: 2441
Location: Oakland, CA

Re: Blink membership plans & fees

Thu Dec 15, 2011 11:24 am

evnow wrote:
greenleaf wrote:Yes, it is true. You are required to agree to the new residential agreement. The new agreement is discussed here:

http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=43&t=6744" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Looks only for people in Bay Area. Is that correct ?
No. The April 30, 2014 termination date is only for the Bay Area, but the change to allow Ecotality to make further amendments without mutual consent of the parties applies to everybody:

13. Changes. ECOtality has the right to unilaterally change the terms of this agreement and Participant shall be deemed to have automatically agreed to such changes if the Participant continues using the EVSE after receiving the changes. If Participant does not agree to such changes: the Participant must inform ECOtality in writing, addressed to ECOtality’s corporate address, within five (5) of days after such changes, doing so permits ECOtality to terminate this agreement.

The agreement changes the termination date to April 30, 2013 for everyone. I understand that some people already have this termination date, but many of us have a December 31, 2012, termination date. There are also specific provisions relating to San Diego and Los Angeles. All of this is irrelevant, because paragraph 13 allows Ecotality to do whatever it wants with complete impunity.
Cayenne Red SL-e
Blink Installed 6/23/11

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Gonewild
Posts: 1262
Joined: Wed Apr 28, 2010 5:05 pm
Delivery Date: 18 May 2011
Leaf Number: 229
Location: Chandler, AZ

Re: WARNING Blink membership requires new residential agreem

Thu Dec 15, 2011 12:53 pm

What sucks is the Leaf charges using a 3.3k watt charger so if you drive a Ford EV you get twice the charge for the same price that is not fair.


Next question.

I have 2 blink RFID card already do I need to sign up to use them?
Over 25,300 miles Plus - Now Sold/ Lease given back to Nissan 8-25-2012
Ordered Glacier Pearl Nissan Leaf SL eTech Edition on 8/31, Delivered March 1, 2011
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Reserved 4/20

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davewill
Posts: 5083
Joined: Thu Mar 17, 2011 6:04 pm
Location: San Diego, CA, US

Re: WARNING Blink membership requires new residential agreem

Thu Dec 15, 2011 1:15 pm

Gonewild wrote:... I have 2 blink RFID card already do I need to sign up to use them?
I think that you will. They would need a credit card attached to the card in order to charge for the charge.
2014 Rav4 EV, Blizzard Pearl White
2011 LEAF SL w/QC, Blue Ocean, returned at end of lease

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evnow
Moderator
Posts: 11480
Joined: Thu Apr 22, 2010 11:41 am
Delivery Date: 25 Feb 2011
Leaf Number: 303
Location: Seattle, WA

Re: Blink membership plans & fees

Thu Dec 15, 2011 1:21 pm

oakwcj wrote:13. Changes. ECOtality has the right to unilaterally change the terms of this agreement and Participant shall be deemed to have automatically agreed to such changes if the Participant continues using the EVSE after receiving the changes. If Participant does not agree to such changes: the Participant must inform ECOtality in writing, addressed to ECOtality’s corporate address, within five (5) of days after such changes, doing so permits ECOtality to terminate this agreement.
As bad as it seems - isn't that almost a universal corporate practice ? In all things from credit cards to satellite tv services.
1st Leaf : 2/28/2011 to 5/6/2013
2nd Leaf : 5/4/2013 to 3/21/2017
Volt : 3/25/2017 to 5/25/2018
Model 3 : 5/10/2018 to ?

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davewill
Posts: 5083
Joined: Thu Mar 17, 2011 6:04 pm
Location: San Diego, CA, US

Re: Blink membership plans & fees

Thu Dec 15, 2011 1:28 pm

evnow wrote:As bad as it seems - isn't that almost a universal corporate practice ? In all things from credit cards to satellite tv services.
Yes, but in those cases, you can always simply cancel on them if they do something too onerous. if I'm reading this right, the penalty for refusing to accept new conditions would end up being surrendering my Blink...which seems a bit much to just give away when I already have a perfectly reasonable agreement in place with them. If they want to collect data for a longer period, I'm all for it and would be happy to cooperate, but I'm not going to let them hold my EVSE hostage to whatever conditions they want to think up, and allow them to move the "I own it" date out.
2014 Rav4 EV, Blizzard Pearl White
2011 LEAF SL w/QC, Blue Ocean, returned at end of lease

saywatt
Posts: 233
Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2011 7:43 am
Delivery Date: 25 Jun 2011
Leaf Number: 4701
Location: Issaquah, WA

Re: WARNING Blink membership requires new residential agreem

Thu Dec 15, 2011 1:43 pm

Sign it and move on. If pluging and unplugging my Leaf is a violation of my privacy, so be it! :roll:

oakwcj
Posts: 339
Joined: Wed Apr 27, 2011 9:01 am
Delivery Date: 19 May 2011
Leaf Number: 2441
Location: Oakland, CA

Re: Blink membership plans & fees

Thu Dec 15, 2011 1:58 pm

evnow wrote:
oakwcj wrote:13. Changes. ECOtality has the right to unilaterally change the terms of this agreement and Participant shall be deemed to have automatically agreed to such changes if the Participant continues using the EVSE after receiving the changes. If Participant does not agree to such changes: the Participant must inform ECOtality in writing, addressed to ECOtality’s corporate address, within five (5) of days after such changes, doing so permits ECOtality to terminate this agreement.
As bad as it seems - isn't that almost a universal corporate practice ? In all things from credit cards to satellite tv services.
It's true that contracts of adhesion always favor the party with the greater bargaining power, but the context here is completely different.

President Obama is a fan of EVs. He put a $100 million appropriation into the Stimulus Act to subsidize and jump-start EV infrastructure. The $7,500 Federal Income Tax Credit is a subsidy to encourage sales of EVs. These sums are paltry compared to federal subsidies of the oil industry and interstate highways.

Ecotality won the contract with the Department of Energy for the EV Project. Ecotality is a middleman. They didn't give the EVSEs to us. They got a federal contract to do it. The original contract I signed stipulated that I would get ownership of the EVSE at the end of the contract term in return for supplying usage data to the EV Project. The contract specified that it could be amended only with the consent of both parties. Later on, Ecotality entered into some additional contracts with regional air quality agencies, and obviously realized that the contract wouldn't allow them to meet the conditions of their new deals. That's what led them to try this scheme of turning contracts with quite reasonable conditions into the typical one-sided consumer contract used by banks and TV providers. But these EVSEs don't really belong to Ecotality. They're double-dipping by using hardware paid for by the Federal government to facilitate their new contracts with local and regional agencies. If Ecotality came to me and said, please be a good citizen and help the Bay Area Air Quality Management District compile good data, I'd say sure. That's quite a different kettle of fish than letting Ecotality retain title to my EVSE along with the power to unilaterally change the terms of the agreement according to Ecotality's whim. My contract is with Ecotality acting as Steven Chu's agent; it's not with Ecotality, the profit-seeking company.
Cayenne Red SL-e
Blink Installed 6/23/11

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