dhanson865
Moderator
Posts: 1496
Joined: Wed May 25, 2011 7:12 am
Leaf Number: 16156
Location: Tennessee

Re: Leaf Spy and Leaf Spy Pro

Sun Apr 01, 2018 10:25 pm

I'd just toss in that resistance goes up as a battery degrades, HX goes down as the battery degrades.

It might be that HX is the inverse of resistance but I haven't seen any documentation saying exactly what HX is and I have no reason to say it is or isn't anything else.
Blue 2012 Leaf 195/65/15 tires, 15" Rims
Silver 2012 Leaf 16" stock wheels
http://www.mynissanleaf.com/wiki/index. ... acity_Loss
(efficiency 3.x KW vs 6.x KW)
please join Truedelta.com and input your repairs.

DaveinOlyWA
Posts: 14470
Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 7:43 pm
Delivery Date: 16 Nov 2019
Leaf Number: 319862
Location: Olympia, WA
Contact: Website

Re: Leaf Spy and Leaf Spy Pro

Mon Apr 02, 2018 10:14 am

Sorry to interrupt your conversation but I have a LEAF Spy question...

I now have the recommended LEAF Spy dongle and am still having focus issues with LEAF Spy staying on while car is off but charging. This used to not be an issue. Is there a setting, workaround, etc I should try? I do have the "always on" option enabled.
2011 SL; 44,598 mi, 87% SOH. 2013 S; 44,840 mi, 91% SOH. 2016 S30; 29,413 mi, 99% SOH. 2018 S; 25,185 mi, SOH 92.23%. 2019 S Plus; 3500.3 mi, 96.95% SOH
My Blog; http://daveinolywa.blogspot.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

lorenfb
Posts: 2313
Joined: Tue Dec 17, 2013 10:53 pm
Delivery Date: 22 Nov 2013
Leaf Number: 416635
Location: SoCal

Re: Leaf Spy and Leaf Spy Pro

Mon Apr 02, 2018 1:07 pm

dhanson865 wrote:I'd just toss in that resistance goes up as a battery degrades, HX goes down as the battery degrades.

It might be that HX is the inverse of resistance but I haven't seen any documentation saying exactly what HX is and I have no reason to say it is or isn't anything else.
My Leaf data today;
http://mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f ... 50#p523503
#1 Leaf SL MY 9/13: 76K miles, 47 Ahrs, 5.0 miles/kWh (average), Hx=70, SOH=78, L2 - 100% > 1000, temp < 95F, (DOD) > 20 Ahrs
#2 Leaf SL MY 12/18: 8.5K miles, 115 Ahrs, 5.2 miles/kWh (average), Hx=98, SOH=99, DOD > 20%, temp < 105F

lorenfb
Posts: 2313
Joined: Tue Dec 17, 2013 10:53 pm
Delivery Date: 22 Nov 2013
Leaf Number: 416635
Location: SoCal

Re: Leaf Spy and Leaf Spy Pro

Mon Apr 02, 2018 1:18 pm

Hopefully Turbo3 will provide info on whether LeafSpy Pro ever provided an actual calculation for battery resistance.
If so, is it still in the app?
#1 Leaf SL MY 9/13: 76K miles, 47 Ahrs, 5.0 miles/kWh (average), Hx=70, SOH=78, L2 - 100% > 1000, temp < 95F, (DOD) > 20 Ahrs
#2 Leaf SL MY 12/18: 8.5K miles, 115 Ahrs, 5.2 miles/kWh (average), Hx=98, SOH=99, DOD > 20%, temp < 105F

Turbo3
Gold Member
Posts: 2011
Joined: Mon Jul 19, 2010 8:34 pm
Delivery Date: 12 May 2011
Leaf Number: 002191
Location: San Jose, CA

Re: Leaf Spy and Leaf Spy Pro

Mon Apr 02, 2018 2:27 pm

lorenfb wrote:Hopefully Turbo3 will provide info on whether LeafSpy Pro ever provided an actual calculation for battery resistance.
If so, is it still in the app?
My understanding, from posts long ago, is that Hx is thought to be related to the inverse of resistance (conductance) which is why it goes down.

Hx is just a value read from the Leaf's BMS ECU. Only the Nissan engineers back in Japan know its real meaning.

Turbo3
Gold Member
Posts: 2011
Joined: Mon Jul 19, 2010 8:34 pm
Delivery Date: 12 May 2011
Leaf Number: 002191
Location: San Jose, CA

Re: Leaf Spy and Leaf Spy Pro

Mon Apr 02, 2018 2:29 pm

DaveinOlyWA wrote:Sorry to interrupt your conversation but I have a LEAF Spy question...

I now have the recommended LEAF Spy dongle and am still having focus issues with LEAF Spy staying on while car is off but charging. This used to not be an issue. Is there a setting, workaround, etc I should try? I do have the "always on" option enabled.
You seem to have a number of Leafs. Is this happening with all of them or just one? If just one, which one?

DaveinOlyWA
Posts: 14470
Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 7:43 pm
Delivery Date: 16 Nov 2019
Leaf Number: 319862
Location: Olympia, WA
Contact: Website

Re: Leaf Spy and Leaf Spy Pro

Mon Apr 02, 2018 4:56 pm

Turbo3 wrote:
DaveinOlyWA wrote:Sorry to interrupt your conversation but I have a LEAF Spy question...

I now have the recommended LEAF Spy dongle and am still having focus issues with LEAF Spy staying on while car is off but charging. This used to not be an issue. Is there a setting, workaround, etc I should try? I do have the "always on" option enabled.
You seem to have a number of Leafs. Is this happening with all of them or just one? If just one, which one?
Well, it started with 2016. The issue is I rarely ran LEAF Spy other than to collect daily stats so it was just a few mins in the morning. So not sure how well the focus was there although I am relatively sure the 2013 would stay focused as long as it was charging.

The 2018 sometimes stays on for 4-5 mins when charging after car is powered off and sometimes its longer. no consistency.
2011 SL; 44,598 mi, 87% SOH. 2013 S; 44,840 mi, 91% SOH. 2016 S30; 29,413 mi, 99% SOH. 2018 S; 25,185 mi, SOH 92.23%. 2019 S Plus; 3500.3 mi, 96.95% SOH
My Blog; http://daveinolywa.blogspot.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

lorenfb
Posts: 2313
Joined: Tue Dec 17, 2013 10:53 pm
Delivery Date: 22 Nov 2013
Leaf Number: 416635
Location: SoCal

Re: Leaf Spy and Leaf Spy Pro

Mon Apr 02, 2018 7:18 pm

Turbo3 wrote:
lorenfb wrote:Hopefully Turbo3 will provide info on whether LeafSpy Pro ever provided an actual calculation for battery resistance.
If so, is it still in the app?
My understanding, from posts long ago, is that Hx is thought to be related to the inverse of resistance (conductance) which is why it goes down.

Hx is just a value read from the Leaf's BMS ECU. Only the Nissan engineers back in Japan know its real meaning.
Thanks for the reply. As I've been using LeafDD to actually calculate the battery resistance, it never compares to Hx even if one takes the
inverse (conductance). The only possibly is if Hx is the average resistance over time.

In any case, could you actually have LeafSpy calculate the battery resistance by just using the drop in battery voltage divided
by the corresponding increase in battery current? As an example, for a current exceeding 50 amps, just measure the battery
voltage decline and do a division. The way LeafDD does it by sensing the accelerator pedal being fully depressed and monitoring
current and voltage for a few seconds. This would be helpful in doing a comparative analysis of the 24/30/40 kWhr Leaf batteries
as it relates to battery degradation. An alternative is to do like you did for your Tesla app (TM-Spy) where you provided a graphical
display of the battery voltage verses the battery current under a heavy load. That graphic was excellent! From the graphic, one can
determine that the battery resistance is about 77 mohms (100 volts / 1300 amps). The battery power loss is about 130 kW.
Calculations values based on Tesla page link below. Here it is.

Thanks


Image

Found the Tesla link;

https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/posts/1381783/
#1 Leaf SL MY 9/13: 76K miles, 47 Ahrs, 5.0 miles/kWh (average), Hx=70, SOH=78, L2 - 100% > 1000, temp < 95F, (DOD) > 20 Ahrs
#2 Leaf SL MY 12/18: 8.5K miles, 115 Ahrs, 5.2 miles/kWh (average), Hx=98, SOH=99, DOD > 20%, temp < 105F

GerryAZ
Gold Member
Posts: 2356
Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 6:47 pm
Delivery Date: 12 Jun 2011
Location: Phoenix, AZ

Re: Leaf Spy and Leaf Spy Pro

Tue Apr 03, 2018 7:52 pm

DaveinOlyWA wrote:
Turbo3 wrote:
DaveinOlyWA wrote:Sorry to interrupt your conversation but I have a LEAF Spy question...

I now have the recommended LEAF Spy dongle and am still having focus issues with LEAF Spy staying on while car is off but charging. This used to not be an issue. Is there a setting, workaround, etc I should try? I do have the "always on" option enabled.
You seem to have a number of Leafs. Is this happening with all of them or just one? If just one, which one?
Well, it started with 2016. The issue is I rarely ran LEAF Spy other than to collect daily stats so it was just a few mins in the morning. So not sure how well the focus was there although I am relatively sure the 2013 would stay focused as long as it was charging.

The 2018 sometimes stays on for 4-5 mins when charging after car is powered off and sometimes its longer. no consistency.
I will chime in and say that I used to be able to record charging sessions on my 2015, but updates to Leaf Spy, my phone, and/or the Bluetooth adapter have made it consistently drop out after a short time. I had to replace my old Kyocera Event when it started to fail to save data and had problems with SD cards. I replaced it with a BLU (not sure which model) and then had to replace the Bluetooth unit because the BLU would not recognize it. With my present set up, I can record DCQC charging sessions if I don't touch the phone. Changing screens will often cause it to lose connection. It will not stay connected more than a short time when charging on L2, but I don't know exactly when this started.
Gerry
Silver LEAF 2011 SL rear ended (totaled) by in-attentive driver 1/4/2015 at 50,422 miles
Silver LEAF 2015 SL purchased 2/7/2015; traded 8/10/2019 at 82,436 miles
White LEAF 2019 SL+ purchased 8/10/2019

Turbo3
Gold Member
Posts: 2011
Joined: Mon Jul 19, 2010 8:34 pm
Delivery Date: 12 May 2011
Leaf Number: 002191
Location: San Jose, CA

Re: Leaf Spy and Leaf Spy Pro

Tue Apr 03, 2018 9:09 pm

I am going to be gone for about 10 days so will not have time to look into this until I get back.

As always, an ELM trace would help me understand what is causing the connection to drop.

My guess would be one of the ECUs being read from is going to sleep during charging causing an endless retry on the ECU that is no longer communicating. The fix would be to skip reading from that ECU.

As for the internal resistance question, you can actually use TM-Spy on the Leaf to capture the amps/volts trace. Just need to make a recipe to graph the Message ID that has the amps/volts data and select graph at start so TM-Spy does not try to capture any Tesla only frames. I can look into what that recipe would be when I get back.

Using that technique TM-Spy can be used to graph any Message Id from any vehicle. I use that technique for testing TM-Spy since I only have a Leaf.

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