GregH
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Leaf Number: 26967
Location: Irvine, CA

Re: SOC data: 281-based, New-Bars

Mon Jul 04, 2011 11:24 pm

So just to be clear here.. How does one tell if they have the new software? I'm assuming I am updated as I just got the car 3 weeks ago.. The "old" bars are those expressed in the LSN of byte 3 in 0x5bc? (toggling between 12 and some mystery bar level that is usually higher than what's displayed on the dashboard)... presumably the "new" bars/range are set to give more of a reserve than the original design? Drove the car down to 4 on the SOC# (starting from 278 full) and had reduced performance mode kick in rather dramatically (detailed in a post on the turtle discussion in a another sub topic)... I was kinda shocked that it would give me full power one minute then seconds later go to extreme RPM and eventually cut power completely (after about 1/2 mile in RPM).. It must have been an abnormally low cell on a still not completely balanced pack (278 instead of 281 full). I'd like to think the phases from full power to no power would be more gradual..
-Greg
'17 blue Volt Premier w/ACC
'12 SL black Leaf
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garygid
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Re: SOC data: 281-based, New-Bars

Mon Jul 04, 2011 11:58 pm

Greg,
The only RPM is Turtle mode, USUALLY at a very low SOC, about 1%.

See my PM to you.
See SOC/GID-Meter and CAN-Do Info
2010 Prius
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Boomer23
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Re: SOC data: 281-based, New-Bars

Tue Jul 26, 2011 12:04 am

I did some additional testing with the prototype SOC meter, focusing on the range of charge from 1 bar down to the Very Low Battery warning. The motivation for this experiment was the consistent finding that a reading of 1 bar of remaining charge corresponds with a SOC percentage of about 25% on the SOC meter. At a recent breakfast meeting, we were discussing this unexpected finding.

Question at hand: If the SOC meter is going to be useful near the bottom of the range (which IMHO is the range where it is most critically useful), is the burn rate from 25% to 5% similar to the burn rate for the majority of the range of charge, or does the burn rate increase, i.e., does SOC "fall off the table" rapidly below 25%, leading a person using the SOC meter to overestimate their remaining charge, and therefore their remaining miles, at this point?

I started the experiment on July 20 at 1 bar and 25% SOC on the prototype meter. I drove around my neighborhood, in D mode, headlights on, AC off, on local highways and residential streets, stopping at lights and stop signs, and reaching perhaps 50 mph at times. This was not a steady speed run by any means. I recorded the SOC% and SOC number at every half mile and at the Low Battery and Very Low Battery alert points.

I've shown below the data that I already reported for my July 2 run, which was a smooth freeway run, along with the data from my July 20 run. I realize that the driving speeds and burn rate are different on a freeway run than with slower stop-and-go driving, with some regen happening at stop lights, etc.

I did a rough plot using Excel. The slope of the burn rate from the July 20 run from 1 bar down to Very Low Battery, appeared slightly steeper than the slope of the burn rate from the freeway run from 100% charge down to 1 bar, but it wasn't very much steeper. Of course, there might still be a faster burn rate from 1 bar down to 5% charge, but it was masked by the fact that I was driving stop-and-go with some regen.

Someone with better plotting skills than mine might want to plot this data and calculate the slope of the line from the two runs to see if we can draw any conclusions from it.


Code: Select all

Miles	Pct	SOC#	Alert and bars
0	  99	279	12 bars
4.4	92	257	11 bars
9.2	84	236	10 bars
13.9	78	219	9 bars
20.8	71	199	8 bars
25.8	66	186	7 bars
35.1	58	163	6 bars
40.8	51	143	5 bars
51.7	36	102	3 bars
56.6	31	88	2 bars
61.8	26	73	End data collected July 2 (1 bar showing)
--------------
65.5	25	72	Begin data collected July 20 (1 bar showing)
66	  25	71	
66.5	25	70	
67	  23	67	
67.5	22	64	
68	  22	62	
68.5	21	59	
69	  19	55	
69.5	17	50	
69.7	17	49	Low Battery (last bar disappears, miles display starts flashing)
70	  16	47	
70.5	16	45	
71	  15	42	
71.5	14	41	
72	  13	39	
72.5	13	37	
73	  11	32	
73.5	10	30	
74	  10	29	
74.5	10	28	
75	  9	27	
75.5	8	25	Very Low Battery
76  	7	22	
76.5	7	20	
77	  6	18	
77.2	5	16	LEAF parked

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mwalsh
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Re: SOC data: 281-based, New-Bars

Tue Jul 26, 2011 5:50 am

Boomer23 wrote:I started the experiment on July 20 at 1 bar and 25% SOC on the prototype meter. I drove around my neighborhood, in D mode, headlights on, AC off, on local highways and residential streets, stopping at lights and stop signs, and reaching perhaps 50 mph at times. This was not a steady speed run by any means. I recorded the SOC% and SOC number at every half mile and at the Low Battery and Very Low Battery alert points.
Good data! Clearly you were the right man for the prototype unit!
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DaveinOlyWA
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Re: SOC data: 281-based, New-Bars

Tue Jul 26, 2011 7:10 am

looks like the only real conclusion has to be averaged on several runs. there is an obvious delta here on display changes. there is simply too much variance in distances traveled from one bar change to another. its easy to understand it on a "street" run, but even the freeway numbers are all over the place. but that means that there is changes to conditions which could mean direction (wind effects) elevation, etc.
2011 SL; 44,598 mi, 87% SOH. 2013 S; 44,840 mi, 91% SOH. 2016 S30; 29,413 mi, 99% SOH. 2018 S; 25,185 mi, SOH 92.23%. 2019 S Plus; 14,342.8 mi, 93.16% SOH
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evnow
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Re: SOC data: 281-based, New-Bars

Tue Jul 26, 2011 8:14 am

Image

Only a slight bending of the curve.
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DaveinOlyWA
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Re: SOC data: 281-based, New-Bars

Tue Jul 26, 2011 8:19 am

evnow wrote:Image

Only a slight bending of the curve.

ok so there we have 4.7 miles from bar 10-9 and 9.3 miles from bar 7 to 6 and ...oh i c. never mind. its the bars
2011 SL; 44,598 mi, 87% SOH. 2013 S; 44,840 mi, 91% SOH. 2016 S30; 29,413 mi, 99% SOH. 2018 S; 25,185 mi, SOH 92.23%. 2019 S Plus; 14,342.8 mi, 93.16% SOH
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garygid
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Re: SOC data: 281-based, New-Bars

Tue Jul 26, 2011 8:51 am

Note:
The one-channel (one CAN buss) SOC meter is ALSO programmed to send all the CAN-messages back to a PC to be Logged, Graphed, etc.

The messages are being sent out the SOC-Meter's unused 9-pin "D" connector, which is an RS232 serial port. This "Logging" port is not normally connected to anything when using the "Meter" to view SOC, but simultaneous logging of the entire EV-CAN buss message-stream is relatively easy, and inexpensive.

You need:
1. a portable Windows PC that can run my free CAN-Do program (XP, Vista, Win7),
2. some may need an "automobile" 12v power adapter (often $10 to $20) for their PC for longer recording sessions,
3. the CAN-Do program (free) downloaded from http://www.wwwsite.com/puzzles/cando/
4. an RS232 Serial port on the PC, or an inexpensive (about $5) USB-to-RS232 adapter and a USB port.

I have a bunch of these adapters that APPEAR to be fine for CAN-Logging at 115,200 baud, but are just "not quite sufficient" for consistant "flashing" of the AVR-CAN board itself.

So, for a few dollars and very modest effort, you can actually LOG and GRAPH this data.

I have just started a new thread named "SOC-Meter for One-CAN Logging & Graphing".
See SOC/GID-Meter and CAN-Do Info
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TonyWilliams
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Re: SOC data: 281-based, New-Bars

Tue Jul 26, 2011 10:24 am

Boomer23 wrote:

Code: Select all

Miles		SOC#	Alert and bars

69.7		49	Low Battery (last bar disappears, miles display starts flashing)

75.5		25	Very Low Battery

I remember a previous post that had SOC# at 48 and 24 at the respective alerts.

So, 5.8 miles from Low to Very Low. Sure wish you had gone to turtle for another data point ;-) I predict that you were very close.

Code: Select all

DATA POINT-----A------B------C-----D-
BatteryLow----11.0---8.6---13.6---6.7
VeryLow--------6.7---5.5----8.4---5.2
-------------------------------------
Total2Turtle--17.7--14.1--22.0---11.9
-------------------------------------
VeryLow/Low----61%---64%---62%----77%

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garygid
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Re: SOC data: 281-based, New-Bars

Tue Jul 26, 2011 2:08 pm

The real question is how much usable energy YOUR car's battery
has after its LBW, not how much energy the average LEAF had.

I suspect (do not know) that there is significant variation in the "low end"
energy, depending primarily upon the condition of the specific battery, what
Nissan's "SOC" reports, and how the LEAF uses that (and other) information.
See SOC/GID-Meter and CAN-Do Info
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2011 LEAF, 2014 Tesla S85
2018 & 2019 Tesla Model 3
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