St. Louis. Solar installers
- Thread starter jmeitz
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megalo
Active member
I'd be interested in the same thing - though I am also researching installing it myself (though it will have to be signed off by an electrician, per Ameren UE).
nworbekim
Member
I'm also interested.
Mike
Mike
megalo
Active member
Are you guys within a city or unincorporated St. Louis county?
nworbekim
Member
St. Louis county
megalo
Active member
St. Louis County just added restrictions on placing the panels on the roof - this really hurts if you don't have a very large area suitable for panels on your roof:
http://www.stlouisco.com/Portals/8/docs/document%20library/public%20works/code%20enforcement/guides/residential/Solar-Energy-Devices.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
I'm within Creve Coeur, so this shouldn't be applicable to me (hopefully).
http://www.stlouisco.com/Portals/8/docs/document%20library/public%20works/code%20enforcement/guides/residential/Solar-Energy-Devices.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
I'm within Creve Coeur, so this shouldn't be applicable to me (hopefully).
megalo said:
Unfortunately this will be coming for most of the US as they adopt the 2012 IFC. I'm fortunately going to slip in right before my City adopts it and until then they have just been "requesting" a 2' setback on the ridge. For both my installs they think I'm being unsafe by not giving them this setback. The great thing is I heard the Seattle Fire Dept. no longer has roof venting as a SOP.
So reading the IFC it has:
"2. Panels/modules shall be permitted to be located up to the roof ridge where an alternative ventilation method approved by the fire chief has been provided or where the fire chief has determined vertical ventilation techniques will not be employed."
http://publicecodes.cyberregs.com/icod/ifc/2012/icod_ifc_2012_6_par139.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
So there might be a possibility that you could get the fire chief (Probably not actually the fire chief as my city's fire department actually has professional engineers that work in the fire dept. to help with things like this) to allow you to provide ridge venting on only one side of the ridge. While not approved based on this reasoning my thoughts were that from the street there are two access roof slopes that would provide access to the roof with no panels on them and both of these slopes have room on the ridges for venting.
I'm really fortunate to have gotten my system in place before this happened. My southern roof would have gone from 21 panels to about 12 and my west roof would have gone from 31 to say 20. In order to get even close to producing my annual consumption I would have either had to add 10 more panels to the east roof in a very shady area where the shade factor would likely get below 50% and added 18 or so to the front of my house on the west roof and 12 or so on the North roof for a total of 72 and have really crossed my fingers that I'd get as much production out of that mess compared to the 58 panels I'll have shortly
"605.11.3.2.2 Residential buildings with a single ridge.
Panels/modules installed on residential buildings with a single ridge shall be located in a manner that provides two, 3-foot-wide (914 mm) access pathways from the eave to the ridge on each roof slope where panels/modules are located. "
"605.11.3.2.3 Residential buildings with roof hips and valleys.
Panels/modules installed on residential buildings with roof hips and valleys shall be located no closer than 18 inches (457 mm) to a hip or a valley where panels/modules are to be placed on both sides of a hip or valley. Where panels are to be located on only one side of a hip or valley that is of equal length, the panels shall be permitted to be placed directly adjacent to the hip or valley. "
"605.11.3.2.4 Residential building smoke ventilation.
Panels/modules installed on residential buildings shall be located no higher than 3 feet (914 mm) below the ridge in order to allow for fire department smoke ventilation operations."
I hope these requirements will get more lax as fire departments and building departments evolve, if not it's really going to crush a lot of roofs. If I were required to put in these setbacks I think I would lay out the design so that at a later point if they changed I could easily add the missing panels.
BTW: Reading the St. Louis County Department of Public Works packet makes me sad. It's very nice of them to put together this list of the requirements that they want but they are completely ignoring all the work that has been done to streamline and expedite solar pv permitting.
http://www.solarabcs.org/about/publications/reports/expedited-permit/pdfs/Expermitprocess.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
They don't say if you are exempt from needing zoning approval for a roof mounted array but hopefully.
They require plans that are to scale for site plans, sectional drawings, plan view, and elevation views but worse is a structural certification statement. Maybe you have a high snow load that could justify this?
Sad that you can't do your own electrical work. I feel like this is a bad idea because it just encourages people to perform their own work and not get it inspected. Where as elsewhere it's completely acceptable to do your own and get permits and have it inspected.
Here's a quick summary of the 2012 IFC changes related to solar pv:
http://www.solarabcs.org/about/publications/meeting_presentations_minutes/2011/09/pdfs/webinar-IFC-092011.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
And information on the expedited permitting process:
http://www.solarabcs.org/about/publications/reports/expedited-permit/pdfs/Expermitprocess.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://www.solarabcs.org/about/publications/reports/expedited-permit/pdfs/Expermitprocess.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
They don't say if you are exempt from needing zoning approval for a roof mounted array but hopefully.
They require plans that are to scale for site plans, sectional drawings, plan view, and elevation views but worse is a structural certification statement. Maybe you have a high snow load that could justify this?
Sad that you can't do your own electrical work. I feel like this is a bad idea because it just encourages people to perform their own work and not get it inspected. Where as elsewhere it's completely acceptable to do your own and get permits and have it inspected.
Here's a quick summary of the 2012 IFC changes related to solar pv:
http://www.solarabcs.org/about/publications/meeting_presentations_minutes/2011/09/pdfs/webinar-IFC-092011.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
And information on the expedited permitting process:
http://www.solarabcs.org/about/publications/reports/expedited-permit/pdfs/Expermitprocess.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
megalo
Active member
From speaking to my city's plans examiner (with whom I dealt with a lot, unfortunately, when I built my garage), I don't need a ton of supporting documentation about the site, etc - the main requirement is an engineer's stamp saying the roof can physically support the weight/uplift. All the rest can just be sketches.
When I built the garage, I did all of the electrical work (my city contracts electrical permitting/inspection to STL county) and just had to do the normal inspections. I'm not sure if I can do that again with the county, but I do know that my electric utility requires an electrician to sign off
When I built the garage, I did all of the electrical work (my city contracts electrical permitting/inspection to STL county) and just had to do the normal inspections. I'm not sure if I can do that again with the county, but I do know that my electric utility requires an electrician to sign off
Got a bid today. Looks like they can do a 11.7kw system for 18k after ameren rebates and fed tax credit. 45 panels of certainteed solar panels. This would produce 46% of my power and they show a break even around 9-10 years. He mentioned they are upset with stl county on changing the rules very frequently. trying to decide if worth it or not.
megalo
Active member
I'm going to pursue doing (as much as possible of) the install myself. Unfortunately, St. Louis county doesn't allow homeowners to install the actual panels, so I'll be looking for an electrician to do the actual hookup. I'll handle installing the racks and as much as I legally can do of the other stuff.
I hired an engineer this morning to do the analysis on the roof trusses that the city requires. The plan is to apply for the permit as soon as possible - before the city changes their zoning to disallow panels that are visible from the street.
I hired an engineer this morning to do the analysis on the roof trusses that the city requires. The plan is to apply for the permit as soon as possible - before the city changes their zoning to disallow panels that are visible from the street.
megalo said:
Awesome!
You going with Enphase M215 microinverters? If so there shouldn't be any problem with you actually installing the racking, the panels, and the microinverters. They are all literally just plug and play. Then having the electrician handle connecting the engage cabling to the the service panel, etc.
megalo
Active member
Yeah, I'm planning on the Enphase units. The county told me that the electrician actually has to install the panel - I'm guessing because of grounding concerns, but who knows.
megalo
Active member
What're the details on your setup? Is it two arrays - one pointing northeast and one southwest? What size panels?
If you don't mind sharing, what was the price before the Ameren rebate/tax incentive?
If you don't mind sharing, what was the price before the Ameren rebate/tax incentive?
