LeftieBiker
Moderator
Posts: 13468
Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 3:17 am
Delivery Date: 30 Apr 2018
Location: Upstate New York, US

Re: IEVS: Remember The Solar Road In France? It Was A Disaster

Fri Aug 16, 2019 7:20 pm

The way to go with bike trails is to put in solar charging stations at reasonable intervals. Two or three good sized panels charging a 500AH battery bank should work fine. Trying to make a road surface that has to bear tons of weight (obviously less on bike paths) also produce electricity from the sun is nuts. Some sort of rugged piezoelectric system will probably be developed, but that's a ways off for practical use.
Scarlet Ember 2018 Leaf SL W/ Pro Pilot
2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, & 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
BAFX OBDII Dongle
PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

Oilpan4
Gold Member
Posts: 957
Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2019 10:51 pm
Delivery Date: 10 May 2018
Leaf Number: 004270

Re: IEVS: Remember The Solar Road In France? It Was A Disaster

Fri Aug 16, 2019 7:26 pm

So the solar road works as long as it's used as a bike path?
Dumb. Put the panels on a roof and don't drive heavy machines or anything on them, even better don't touch them at all. If a squirrel runs on them or bird lands on them shoot it, if a twig touches them loop the tree branch off.
Hell they can't build a road that only has to do 1 thing and have it last more than 5 years with out maintenance.
2011 white SL leaf with 2014 batt.
Chargers: Panasonic brick moded for 240v, duosida 16a 240v and a 10kw setec portable CHAdeMO
Location: 88103

GRA
Posts: 11205
Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2011 1:49 pm
Location: East side of San Francisco Bay

Re: IEVS: Remember The Solar Road In France? It Was A Disaster

Mon Aug 19, 2019 6:16 pm

Alternatively, people could realize that these are experiments, that some are bound to fail, and that the knowledge gained by these failures will lead to design improvements that may ultimately succeed. Of course, that's not guaranteed, and technical success doesn't guarantee economic success, but a 1/3rd success rate for a new tech's first real-world dem/val isn't bad at all.
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

Oilpan4
Gold Member
Posts: 957
Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2019 10:51 pm
Delivery Date: 10 May 2018
Leaf Number: 004270

Re: IEVS: Remember The Solar Road In France? It Was A Disaster

Tue Aug 20, 2019 7:44 am

Put them on a deticated ground mount or roof top they could last 20 to 50 years.
2011 white SL leaf with 2014 batt.
Chargers: Panasonic brick moded for 240v, duosida 16a 240v and a 10kw setec portable CHAdeMO
Location: 88103

User avatar
paulgipe
Posts: 312
Joined: Sat Aug 02, 2014 4:23 pm
Delivery Date: 20 Oct 2014
Leaf Number: 311200
Location: Bakersfield, CA 93305
Contact: Website

Re: IEVS: Remember The Solar Road In France? It Was A Disaster

Tue Aug 20, 2019 8:40 am

GRA wrote:
Mon Aug 19, 2019 6:16 pm
Alternatively, people could realize that these are experiments, that some are bound to fail, and that the knowledge gained by these failures will lead to design improvements that may ultimately succeed. Of course, that's not guaranteed, and technical success doesn't guarantee economic success, but a 1/3rd success rate for a new tech's first real-world dem/val isn't bad at all.
Guy,

The background on this is far worse than the MSM (mainstream media) reports. This is in part because they don't understand the renewables revolution and the politics behind it. They have to accept the official version. In France that version was a special sweetheart deal with friends of the government (can't remember if it was Sarkozy or Hollande). This served the interests of the state by satisfying a major donor and giving the appearance of action when none was taken. It also took the pressure off to do what needed to be done thus avoiding a conflict with EDF, the fourth branch of government. This stunk from the get go. Follow Craig Morris' dissection of this from his perch in Germany. I never wrote about it as it was a waste of electrons.

Paul
Bakersfield, California
2017 Bolt LT with DCFC, leased 11/09/17
2015 Nissan S with QC, leased, returned
2013 Chevy Volt Premium, used 10/3/16, sold
L2; ClipperCreek HCS-40; Jesla; JDapter Stub
http://www.wind-works.org

smkettner
Posts: 7380
Joined: Mon Aug 09, 2010 10:13 pm
Delivery Date: 26 Feb 2014
Location: Orange County, CA

Re: IEVS: Remember The Solar Road In France? It Was A Disaster

Tue Aug 20, 2019 10:55 am

May as well go back to the Roman cobblestone roadways.
1 bar lost at 21,451 miles, 16 months.
2 bar lost at 35,339 miles, 25 months.
LEAF traded at 45,400 miles for a RAV4-EV
RAV4 traded in for I-Pace Dec 2018

GRA
Posts: 11205
Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2011 1:49 pm
Location: East side of San Francisco Bay

Re: IEVS: Remember The Solar Road In France? It Was A Disaster

Tue Aug 20, 2019 4:35 pm

paulgipe wrote:
Tue Aug 20, 2019 8:40 am
GRA wrote:
Mon Aug 19, 2019 6:16 pm
Alternatively, people could realize that these are experiments, that some are bound to fail, and that the knowledge gained by these failures will lead to design improvements that may ultimately succeed. Of course, that's not guaranteed, and technical success doesn't guarantee economic success, but a 1/3rd success rate for a new tech's first real-world dem/val isn't bad at all.
Guy,

The background on this is far worse than the MSM (mainstream media) reports. This is in part because they don't understand the renewables revolution and the politics behind it. They have to accept the official version. In France that version was a special sweetheart deal with friends of the government (can't remember if it was Sarkozy or Hollande). This served the interests of the state by satisfying a major donor and giving the appearance of action when none was taken. It also took the pressure off to do what needed to be done thus avoiding a conflict with EDF, the fourth branch of government. This stunk from the get go. Follow Craig Morris' dissection of this from his perch in Germany. I never wrote about it as it was a waste of electrons.

Paul

Thanks, Paul, I've checked out some of Morris' articles. My personal take runs closer to this one (which also cites Morris: https://www.dw.com/en/solar-roadways-a- ... a-19048835

Even if the French deal stunk that doesn't eliminate the value of trying similar approaches, of course they're ridiculously expensive at first, and where you put it makes a lot of difference. My personal feeling is that this approach makes more sense in industrial parks as mentioned in the article above, or parking lots that are often empty during the day such as the typical U.S. shopping mall (with its parking sized for a demand that only happens for a couple of weeks a year prior to Christmas) in addition to rooftop and fixed mount solar, although for the last it might be better to plant deciduous trees instead. However, an even better use of such space is to put buildings on it - the question in my mind is can you produce enough from rooftop PV alone to meet the higher energy density demand of built-up urban areas, especially in cities where tall skinny skyscrapers with limited roof area are the norm? PV as curtain glass may make more sense in such areas, but I'm in favor of seeing which we can make work and finding out what each costs.

Kind of like all those different designs for 1st gen wind turbines I used to see in Altamont Pass, the majority of which were broken down most or all of the time. But the best weren't, and lessons learned there and in similar early areas got us to where we are now with wind.
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

Return to “Solar”