Lothsahn
Posts: 544
Joined: Thu Apr 05, 2018 4:35 pm
Delivery Date: 04 Jan 2018
Leaf Number: 007797

Re: Anybody with 2011 or 2012 interested in upgrade to new battery?

Wed Oct 23, 2019 3:43 pm

Andrey wrote:
Wed Oct 23, 2019 11:21 am
While I'm waiting Cor to reply - did anyone try to replace sockets on G2 battery (power & control) or wires on G1 Leaf to attach G2 battery to G1 Leaf without swapping cells?
There's "retrofitting procedure" https://testing-public.carmd.com/Tsb/Do ... NTB14-059c available for G2 battery, but it assumes you buy already modded battery with right sockets and do several mechanical things outside the battery to fit it to G1.
G1 == Leaf 10-12 , G2 == Leaf 13-17

My Leaf`12 has cold climate package, if that help.
Cor has primarily done cell swaps, but he's done a lot of them. He did at least one battery exchange and didn't mention anything about wire differences, but did mention that the cover panels underneath the pack differ from G1 to G2.

Dala noted that the G1 and G2 harnesses were different. When I did my pack swap, the wiring all hooked right up, so it appears that if you order a replacement pack (or get a warranty replacement), the pack comes to wire to the car--not with adapters and wiring harnesses.
2011 Silver SV, purchased 2018, lives in Missouri (previously in CA)
LeafSpy Pro + BAFX Products OBDII dongle
Battery swap 2019/04/24 (87% SOH, 12 bar)

Andrey
Posts: 41
Joined: Tue May 21, 2019 9:56 pm
Delivery Date: 04 May 2019
Leaf Number: 019812

Re: Anybody with 2011 or 2012 interested in upgrade to new battery?

Mon Oct 28, 2019 11:25 am

Lothsahn wrote:
Wed Oct 23, 2019 3:43 pm
Cor has primarily done cell swaps, but he's done a lot of them. He did at least one battery exchange and didn't mention anything about wire differences, but did mention that the cover panels underneath the pack differ from G1 to G2.

Dala noted that the G1 and G2 harnesses were different. When I did my pack swap, the wiring all hooked right up, so it appears that if you order a replacement pack (or get a warranty replacement), the pack comes to wire to the car--not with adapters and wiring harnesses.
Of course when you order it (or get it by warranty) this already has proper connectors, so that dealer just swap batteries.
I wonder if anybody tried to swap connectors on those. Also wonder if it will work w/o heater connected and will it work with G1 controllers.

AFAIK my native battery connection is like that: Image

My G2 battery has following connectors (real photo): Image

Lothsahn
Posts: 544
Joined: Thu Apr 05, 2018 4:35 pm
Delivery Date: 04 Jan 2018
Leaf Number: 007797

Re: Anybody with 2011 or 2012 interested in upgrade to new battery?

Mon Oct 28, 2019 2:47 pm

If you find a mismatch between the heaters, I'm not sure if you can just swap the heater plug and coil and such. You may be able to.

However, if it throws diagnostic codes due to the heater the BMS doesn't know about, and you do a BMS swap... you MUST swap the busbars and balancing connectors and cabling WITH the BMS.

NEVER EVER use the busbars and other wires from a G1 battery with a G2 BMS (or vice versa). You WILL fry your BMS.


At the end of the day, the replacement that will always work is a cell swap. Simply swap all of the cells from the Good battery to the original (bad) battery, using the BMS, wires, connectors, and heater (or lack thereof) from the original battery. However, this does involve opening up the battery, working with high voltages, and the batteries themselves are heavy--both the entire pack and the banks of batteries. So it's not a job for the weak or faint of heart.
2011 Silver SV, purchased 2018, lives in Missouri (previously in CA)
LeafSpy Pro + BAFX Products OBDII dongle
Battery swap 2019/04/24 (87% SOH, 12 bar)

SageBrush
Posts: 4907
Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2011 2:28 am
Delivery Date: 13 Feb 2017
Location: NM

Re: Anybody with 2011 or 2012 interested in upgrade to new battery?

Mon Oct 28, 2019 3:04 pm

^^ That is my conclusion as well.
Is the 2013-14 battery pack glued shut, or a pile of bolts ?
2013 LEAF 'S' Model with QC & rear-view camera
Bought off-lease Jan 2017 from N. California
Two years in Colorado, now in NM
03/2018: 58 Ahr, 28k miles
11/2018: 56.16 Ahr, 30k miles
-----
2018 Tesla Model 3 LR, Delivered 6/2018

NiallDarwin
Posts: 46
Joined: Thu Jul 09, 2015 1:58 am
Delivery Date: 12 Dec 2015
Leaf Number: 004321
Location: New Zealand

Re: Anybody with 2011 or 2012 interested in upgrade to new battery?

Mon Oct 28, 2019 6:07 pm

Andrey wrote:
Mon Oct 28, 2019 11:25 am

AFAIK my native battery connection is like that: Image
This photo is of a pre-production prototype. No car in the wild has these connectors or internal details AFAIK. Don't use it as a reference.

G1 packs have tons of bolts and a rubber seal.
G2s are bonded.

Putting G2 cells into G1 wiring does indeed fry the BMS. I know because I've done it :oops: I'm now running around with G2 cells in my G1 battery case, BMS, hardware, wiring. I've not found connector adapters but it seems thoroughly possible.

Personally rather than spending hours & $$ to go from 60% of a 24kWh Leaf to 80% I'd spend my money on helping these guys get their prototype 36+kWh battery into production.

https://bluecars.nz/nissan-leaf-battery ... t-project/

But I do work for them so I would say that!

Lothsahn
Posts: 544
Joined: Thu Apr 05, 2018 4:35 pm
Delivery Date: 04 Jan 2018
Leaf Number: 007797

Re: Anybody with 2011 or 2012 interested in upgrade to new battery?

Tue Oct 29, 2019 6:45 am

NiallDarwin wrote:
Mon Oct 28, 2019 6:07 pm

Putting G2 cells into G1 wiring does indeed fry the BMS. I know because I've done it :oops: I'm now running around with G2 cells in my G1 battery case, BMS, hardware, wiring. I've not found connector adapters but it seems thoroughly possible.
To be clear, putting G2 cells into a G1 pack won't fry the BMS. The BMS frying happens when you swap the BMS, but not also the busbars and all other connectors & wiring. As long as you *just* swap cells, you won't fry the BMS.

I know you knew this Niall, but I wanted to be clear to anyone reading this topic.
2011 Silver SV, purchased 2018, lives in Missouri (previously in CA)
LeafSpy Pro + BAFX Products OBDII dongle
Battery swap 2019/04/24 (87% SOH, 12 bar)

Lothsahn
Posts: 544
Joined: Thu Apr 05, 2018 4:35 pm
Delivery Date: 04 Jan 2018
Leaf Number: 007797

Re: Anybody with 2011 or 2012 interested in upgrade to new battery?

Tue Oct 29, 2019 6:48 am

NiallDarwin wrote:
Mon Oct 28, 2019 6:07 pm

Personally rather than spending hours & $$ to go from 60% of a 24kWh Leaf to 80% I'd spend my money on helping these guys get their prototype 36+kWh battery into production.

https://bluecars.nz/nissan-leaf-battery ... t-project/

But I do work for them so I would say that!

$13k USD for a 36 kWh pack. That's quite exciting! I hope you guys get to scale, get prices down even a little bit more, and offer product in the US.

I think you'll find a *ton* of interest in such a pack for ~$10-11k.
2011 Silver SV, purchased 2018, lives in Missouri (previously in CA)
LeafSpy Pro + BAFX Products OBDII dongle
Battery swap 2019/04/24 (87% SOH, 12 bar)

NiallDarwin
Posts: 46
Joined: Thu Jul 09, 2015 1:58 am
Delivery Date: 12 Dec 2015
Leaf Number: 004321
Location: New Zealand

Re: Anybody with 2011 or 2012 interested in upgrade to new battery?

Tue Oct 29, 2019 3:44 pm

Lothsahn wrote:
Tue Oct 29, 2019 6:48 am


$13k USD for a 36 kWh pack. That's quite exciting! I hope you guys get to scale, get prices down even a little bit more, and offer product in the US.

I think you'll find a *ton* of interest in such a pack for ~$10-11k.
Thanks :D

I'm just contracting design, build & commissioning services to them. Cash to fund the project is the issue. If they can get a decent amount of pre-sales or investment they can get it done sooner and have more success and therefore more cash.

Andrey
Posts: 41
Joined: Tue May 21, 2019 9:56 pm
Delivery Date: 04 May 2019
Leaf Number: 019812

Re: Anybody with 2011 or 2012 interested in upgrade to new battery?

Tue Oct 29, 2019 4:24 pm

Seems my Leaf should have battery heater as per https://www.cars.com/articles/2012-niss ... 663161727/, but I didn't find any signs of it in Energy Info menu.

I found another image on Ebay - power socket is the same, control socket IDK, but no heater socket: Image

Thanks all, I know what to do if I only swap cells, but here I'm looking for the way how to swap G2 <-> G1 battery.

$13k, $15k, $20k - all that is too much for this car, I want to keep it cheap.

NiallDarwin
Posts: 46
Joined: Thu Jul 09, 2015 1:58 am
Delivery Date: 12 Dec 2015
Leaf Number: 004321
Location: New Zealand

Re: Anybody with 2011 or 2012 interested in upgrade to new battery?

Tue Oct 29, 2019 4:34 pm

Lothsahn wrote:
Tue Oct 29, 2019 6:48 am

$13k USD for a 36 kWh pack. That's quite exciting!
Yes, after doing a couple of thousand test kilometers on it I really, really didn't want to take it out of my car and give it to them! :lol:

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