billduck
Posts: 3
Joined: Mon Jun 15, 2020 3:21 pm
Delivery Date: 15 Jun 2020
Leaf Number: 006891

Level 1 charging with an ungrounded plug

Mon Jun 15, 2020 3:33 pm

The Level 1 charger will not work if a 110 Vac plug is ungrounded. Makes sense. I tried to charge my Leaf with a 2500 watt solar inverter. It did not work for the same reason (No electrical connection to ground.) Since the electrical service (that works at Level 1) has the neutral and ground connnedted in the brealer box, is the answer, on the solar inverter, to electrically connect neutral and ground? FYI, the source of power for the 2500 watt inverter is a large 24 volt, Lead-acid battery bank.
Thanks in advance.

LeftieBiker
Moderator
Posts: 15050
Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 3:17 am
Delivery Date: 30 Apr 2018
Location: Upstate New York, US

Re: Level 1 charging with an ungrounded plug

Mon Jun 15, 2020 4:13 pm

To use the charging cable with the 120 volt breaker box, you need to run a cable with ground wire from the box. If the cable is buried and there is no ground wire but it's in metal conduit, check the conduit for a good ground and use that for a ground to connect a ground wire to a 3 prong 120 volt outlet. You may also be able to run a separate ground wire from the box to the outlet, bypassing the cable outside the outlet, but that isn't good practice...
Scarlet Ember 2018 Leaf SL W/ Pro Pilot
2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, & 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
BAFX OBDII Dongle
PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

Learjet
Posts: 80
Joined: Tue Mar 24, 2020 8:04 pm
Delivery Date: 11 Mar 2020
Leaf Number: 309454
Location: Louisiana, USA

Re: Level 1 charging with an ungrounded plug

Mon Jun 15, 2020 5:45 pm

you need to google generator bonding...same issue here.
2019 Nissan Leaf SL Plus

GerryAZ
Gold Member
Posts: 2534
Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 6:47 pm
Delivery Date: 12 Jun 2011
Location: Phoenix, AZ

Re: Level 1 charging with an ungrounded plug

Mon Jun 15, 2020 6:30 pm

billduck wrote:
Mon Jun 15, 2020 3:33 pm
The Level 1 charger will not work if a 110 Vac plug is ungrounded. Makes sense. I tried to charge my Leaf with a 2500 watt solar inverter. It did not work for the same reason (No electrical connection to ground.) Since the electrical service (that works at Level 1) has the neutral and ground connnedted in the brealer box, is the answer, on the solar inverter, to electrically connect neutral and ground? FYI, the source of power for the 2500 watt inverter is a large 24 volt, Lead-acid battery bank.
Thanks in advance.
If the inverter neutral is truly isolated from ground, you need to make a connection between neutral and ground with either a resistor (100k ohm is appropriate to limit ground fault current below the standard GFCI threshold of 5 mA) or a bonding jumper. I made up some adapters using 120-volt plugs (one with resistor and one with solid jumper) to use with isolated generators to charge the car or to run test equipment that checks for safety ground connections. By using the plug-in adapters, I can leave the generator isolated for normal use and grounded/bonded when needed by just plugging the appropriate adapter into the second receptacle on the generator.
Gerry
Silver LEAF 2011 SL rear ended (totaled) by in-attentive driver 1/4/2015 at 50,422 miles
Silver LEAF 2015 SL purchased 2/7/2015; traded 8/10/2019 at 82,436 miles
White LEAF 2019 SL Plus purchased 8/10/2019

Oilpan4
Posts: 1494
Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2019 10:51 pm
Delivery Date: 10 May 2018
Leaf Number: 004270

Re: Level 1 charging with an ungrounded plug

Mon Jun 15, 2020 6:42 pm

Actually it didn't work because the inverter has a floating neutral.
If you have to defeat a safety system to make something work, it's a bad idea.

LeftieBiker
Moderator
Posts: 15050
Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 3:17 am
Delivery Date: 30 Apr 2018
Location: Upstate New York, US

Re: Level 1 charging with an ungrounded plug

Mon Jun 15, 2020 8:25 pm

If you have to defeat a safety system to make something work, it's a bad idea.
We agree on that. Just provide a grounded outlet for the EVSE.
Scarlet Ember 2018 Leaf SL W/ Pro Pilot
2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, & 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
BAFX OBDII Dongle
PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

billduck
Posts: 3
Joined: Mon Jun 15, 2020 3:21 pm
Delivery Date: 15 Jun 2020
Leaf Number: 006891

Re: Level 1 charging with an ungrounded plug

Tue Jun 16, 2020 4:35 am

My goal is to be able to charge the Leaf from a solar charged battery pack thru an off grid inverter. Hope I do not let the smoke out if I connect ground and Neutral.

BrockWI
Posts: 835
Joined: Fri Mar 28, 2014 6:28 am
Delivery Date: 28 Mar 2014
Leaf Number: 423875
Location: Green Bay, WI.
Contact: Website

Re: Level 1 charging with an ungrounded plug

Tue Jun 16, 2020 6:59 am

I can't find the thread now, but, if your comfortable with electricity you can make a "grounding" plug to the stock EVSE will think it is grounded. Of course this doesn't help the floating neutral issue meaning from the car to the ground you could have 60v and yes you can and will feel that :)
2013 S model with QC package Mar of 2013
lost first bar @ 72k
@100k miles - 57.3Ahr - 87.62SOH - 84.13Hx - 241GID
3.3 kw solar pv - XW6048 - eight L16's
4 ton GSHP - 1 ton ASHP
2003 VW TDI 210k miles - 52 mpg lifetime
EVSE level 2 - Clipper Creek HSC-40

Oilpan4
Posts: 1494
Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2019 10:51 pm
Delivery Date: 10 May 2018
Leaf Number: 004270

Re: Level 1 charging with an ungrounded plug

Tue Jun 16, 2020 11:58 pm

billduck wrote:
Tue Jun 16, 2020 4:35 am
My goal is to be able to charge the Leaf from a solar charged battery pack thru an off grid inverter. Hope I do not let the smoke out if I connect ground and Neutral.
Higher end pure sine inverters will fry if you connect ground to one of the 60v "lines" and modified sine wave appears to not work well at all with the leafs charging system or any charging electeonics.
You would need a higher end pure sine inverter that makes 120/240 with ground bonded neutral to do it the most correct way.
trumpvirus
Is going to get you.

billduck
Posts: 3
Joined: Mon Jun 15, 2020 3:21 pm
Delivery Date: 15 Jun 2020
Leaf Number: 006891

Re: Level 1 charging with an ungrounded plug

Wed Jun 17, 2020 6:58 am

This is good information. Let me deconstruct it. Everyone understands that a 240 volt service is 2 each of a 120 volt sine wave that are phased 180 degrees apart. Are you saying that the voltage from a 120 volt recepticle on the pure sine wave inverter is kinda the same. That is, it is 2 sine waves at 60 volts separated by 180 degrees, time wise?
The inverter I am using is from reliable inverters - a pure sine wave inverter. Do not want to let the smoke out.

Return to “New Members & Newbie Questions”