SageBrush
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Re: ABG: EV push in Norway could add $1.3 billion to power bills by 2040

Sun Jun 16, 2019 10:52 pm

DarthPuppy wrote:Good to know the detail on that. Still far better penetration than we have here and a notable accomplishment.
No doubt, and as EV choices expand it seems a fair guess that EV marketshare will also. I agree with Elon that the Model Y will have double the demand of the Model 3, in line with consumer preference for CUV over sedan. In Norway for now though, increase in EV marketshare has been mostly a reciprocal of PHEV and HEV drops. That last 25% ICE/diesel share is proving to be stubborn. I'm hopeful ICE drops to below 10% with more choice.
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Bought off-lease Jan 2017 from N. California
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11/2018: 56.16 Ahr, 30k miles
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kaiat
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Re: ABG: EV push in Norway could add $1.3 billion to power bills by 2040

Mon Jun 17, 2019 3:11 am

There is still a demand of sort for ICE-cars. Towing seems to be the main reason. Many have a trailer or caravan which they haul around. I am myself no exception here, and drive a diesel-SUV for this reason (my SO uses the Leaf). You got alternatives as Tesla Model X, Audi e-tron and the upcoming Mercedes EQC - but they are all pretty expensive and out of reach for many.

Also, in the more rural areas, there might not be fastchargers everywhere. In Northern Norway this is still a problem, even Teslas can struggle there. Norway has a goal that there should not be more than 50 km between fastchargers, but this proved difficult to do in the most Northern parts of Norway. But it is (slowly) getting better there too.

Oddly enough, there has also been cases where people living in the cities has sold their EV and bought an ICE instead. If you live in an appartment and/or may only have streetparking, it can be very difficult to charge your EV at home. So there are those who has given up on EVs for now because of that.

SageBrush
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Re: ABG: EV push in Norway could add $1.3 billion to power bills by 2040

Mon Jun 17, 2019 6:29 am

kaiat wrote:There is still a demand of sort for ICE-cars. Towing seems to be the main reason. Many have a trailer or caravan which they haul around. I am myself no exception here, and drive a diesel-SUV for this reason (my SO uses the Leaf). You got alternatives as Tesla Model X, Audi e-tron and the upcoming Mercedes EQC - but they are all pretty expensive and out of reach for many.

Also, in the more rural areas, there might not be fastchargers everywhere. In Northern Norway this is still a problem, even Teslas can struggle there. Norway has a goal that there should not be more than 50 km between fastchargers, but this proved difficult to do in the most Northern parts of Norway. But it is (slowly) getting better there too.

Oddly enough, there has also been cases where people living in the cities has sold their EV and bought an ICE instead. If you live in an appartment and/or may only have streetparking, it can be very difficult to charge your EV at home. So there are those who has given up on EVs for now because of that.
Thanks for the inside view :)

Bjorn Nyland recently posted a series of videos on youtube driving across Finnmark with a Fortum rep. They apparently plan to install 17 150 kW chargers in the near future. It knocks my socks off to think that a corner of the Artic will be *much* better served by DC fast charging than my 1M population city in the USA.

Go Norway !
Last edited by SageBrush on Tue Jun 18, 2019 3:54 am, edited 1 time in total.
2013 LEAF 'S' Model with QC & rear-view camera
Bought off-lease Jan 2017 from N. California
Two years in Colorado, now in NM
03/2018: 58 Ahr, 28k miles
11/2018: 56.16 Ahr, 30k miles
-----
2018 Tesla Model 3 LR, Delivered 6/2018

DarthPuppy
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Re: ABG: EV push in Norway could add $1.3 billion to power bills by 2040

Mon Jun 17, 2019 6:14 pm

Good points about the charging infrastructure being a major hurdle for apartment dwellers or those who have to rely on street parking. Without the supportive charging infrastructure, true widespread adoption and elimination of ICEV will be real tough.
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GRA
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Re: ABG: EV push in Norway could add $1.3 billion to power bills by 2040

Mon Jun 17, 2019 6:44 pm

Let's not forget that the reason Norway has the world's largest % uptake of BEVs is that they're a country with a small population which is subsidizing the purchase of PEVs via their sovereign wealth fund, the major source of income of which is royalties and associated taxes from offshore oil and gas and the businesses related to that. What a small, wealthy country can do to subsidize PEVs has little relevance for larger and/or poorer countries. Still, they had to decide to use the money that way, so kudos to them for doing so.
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

kaiat
Posts: 30
Joined: Thu Oct 23, 2014 1:56 am
Location: Bergen, Norway

Re: ABG: EV push in Norway could add $1.3 billion to power bills by 2040

Tue Jun 18, 2019 1:39 am

Technically, EVs aren't subsidized in Norway. ;) They are just extempt from our very high import taxes on cars. Other countries have some sort of system where you get a refund or rebate on the price, but you don't get that in Norway.

To illustrate the matter, take a VW e-Golf for instance. This is an expensive Golf in most places, but in Norway, because the ICE-Golf is taxed hard - the e-Golf is actually priced the same as the base model ICE-Golf. This means that the e-Golf is a bargain in Norway, as you get more standard equipment, it has more power and is even cheaper to run. Even if you are not really that into EVs and are just looking to get a car, that is a no-brainer.

If Norway didn't have those high taxes on ICE-cars, you wouldn't have seen that level of adaptation towards EVs as we have seen here in recent years.

I saw Bjørn Nyland's Youtube-videos too, and it is nice that they are building more chargers there. The problem has been that there can be far between towns, and to put a fastcharger in the middle of nowhere to enable charging inbetween proved hard to do. The roads and power grid can be miles apart, so you may have to build a small power grid to connect the fastcharger to the main power grid. That is a bit too expensive, and the fastcharger-operators decided to hold back a bit until cars with more range appered.

We are actually planning a trip to Northern Norway next year, but it will be using the diesel-SUV due to towing a caravan. Towing apart, I wouldn't have any problem taking the Leaf on a trip in Southern Norway though.

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