wgs1912
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Location: NW FLORDIA

Re: Electric Power Steering

Mon Oct 04, 2010 12:44 pm

the versa is the platform nissan "started" with for the leaf even though the structure is probally the only thing close to being left. but the steering feel may be close. we all know with anything computerized programing is everything and from my experince nissan does a very good job. nissan has been using electric steering since 2007. very few problems from system. but also as a mass produced car they will try to make the feel what the majoity is going to want.which at slower speeds like you said may feel a little light.
Is it better to let people think you are stupid than open your mouth and prove it?

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TRONZ
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Delivery Date: 31 Jan 2011
Leaf Number: 202
Location: Denver, CO

Re: Electric Power Steering

Mon Oct 04, 2010 12:46 pm

Not to step on anyones toes but I did not notice the Leaf's steering which essentially means it did not do anything unexpected or unusual for what I asked of it or needed it to do. It is a very digital car and so far, the MOST relaxing and easily controllable car I have ever driven! In perspective, I have driven, ridden and flown ALOT of things in my day and they have ALL "felt" different. As they should! I did not want my Honda MB5 to "feel" like my GSXR1000 or my Fiat 128 to "feel" like the USMC 5-Ton or the DA20 Katana to "feel" like the Lear 35. Different tools for different jobs. IMHO, Nissan did a great job with the "human factor" and I was immediately comfortable driving the Leaf with one hand around the pylon course. I guess I could have gotten out and stated that the Leaf's steering did not "feel" like my F350 Super Duty (which I also drive around with one hand, BTW). But why??? Believe me, if I run over a coin at 170mph on my GSXR, I WANT to know if it was heads or tails... the Leaf, not so much. Sorry to be preachy but would just like to point out that "more boost/less boost" is in your arms...

... and feel free to tease me about my old Fiat 128. :ugeek:
Last edited by TRONZ on Mon Oct 04, 2010 1:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Every start, is as good as any start can ever be. - Douglas Darden

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2011 LEAF SL VIN#202, Delivered 01.30.11. Now, by far, the oldest LEAF in Colorado.

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johnr
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Delivery Date: 11 May 2011
Leaf Number: 2151
Location: Exeter, CA

Re: Electric Power Steering

Mon Oct 04, 2010 1:32 pm

That was perhaps the biggest point I came away with after my test drive. There is really no learning curve - the Leaf drives very much like any other car. If it wasn't for the smooth acceleration with no shifting and the quiet operation - and the fact the A/C can be on while stopped without an engine running :D - I would not be able to tell it was electric - and that's something Nissan can be proud of. They succeeded in making an electric car that feels and drives like any other car and that was their intention, to make it easy for anyone to be comfortable with.
My trip to Mineral King and the value of regen

Charging stations, electrical adapters, and portable CHAdeMO quick chargers

2011 upgrade: Fossil < Leaf. 2014 upgrade: Leaf < imiev. 2017 upgrade: imiev < tesla. Done upgrading.

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EVDRIVER
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Re: Electric Power Steering

Mon Oct 04, 2010 2:07 pm

johnr wrote:That was perhaps the biggest point I came away with after my test drive. There is really no learning curve - the Leaf drives very much like any other car. If it wasn't for the smooth acceleration with no shifting and the quiet operation - and the fact the A/C can be on while stopped without an engine running :D - I would not be able to tell it was electric - and that's something Nissan can be proud of. They succeeded in making an electric car that feels and drives like any other car and that was their intention, to make it easy for anyone to be comfortable with.
Most factory EVs drive like normal cars, this is not a big feat, in fact I think they ever did it here with soft steering. One thing that will confuse people is the parking brake which is NOT like a normal car unless you drive a $100K Audi. And what kind of leaning curve is really needed to drive an EV? The Mini e is a conversion not a good example either. The Leaf is more like a family car and has few "driver" attributes, the EV factor is irrelevant. If they really wanted to make it more like a ICE they would have put in a manual lever for the parking brake but at least they departed from that. Making changes from an ICE is a good thing and frankly I prefer it was less like an ICE vehicle and had more options for the benefits of EV drivers like adjustable regen and tighter steering (not EV centric) which feels much better and connected. If anything I would say it's "Americanized".

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garygid
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Leaf Number: 000855
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Re: Electric Power Steering

Mon Oct 04, 2010 2:12 pm

Actually, the car could store several "personalities", and use the one "connected" to your RFID. And, with your password, you should be able to change all the settings.
See SOC/GID-Meter and CAN-Do Info
2010 Prius, now for sale
2011 LEAF, sold in 2015
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TRONZ
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Leaf Number: 202
Location: Denver, CO

Re: Electric Power Steering

Mon Oct 04, 2010 8:19 pm

wgs1912 wrote:the versa is the platform nissan "started" with for the leaf even though the structure is probally the only thing close to being left. but the steering feel may be close. we all know with anything computerized programing is everything and from my experince nissan does a very good job. nissan has been using electric steering since 2007. very few problems from system. but also as a mass produced car they will try to make the feel what the majoity is going to want.which at slower speeds like you said may feel a little light.
BTW- The LEAF is an entirely new car. It is NOT based on the Versa and they do not share any parts. Nissan used Versa's as early mules to test drivetrain components only. Because these cars were publicized early on, people have incorrectly assumed the LEAF is a modified Versa.
Every start, is as good as any start can ever be. - Douglas Darden

Stats;
2011 LEAF SL VIN#202, Delivered 01.30.11. Now, by far, the oldest LEAF in Colorado.

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evnow
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Delivery Date: 25 Feb 2011
Leaf Number: 303
Location: Seattle, WA

Re: Electric Power Steering

Mon Oct 04, 2010 8:30 pm

TRONZ wrote:BTW- The LEAF is an entirely new car. It is NOT based on the Versa and they do not share any parts. Nissan used Versa's as early mules to test drivetrain components only. Because these cars were publicized early on, people have incorrectly assumed the LEAF is a modified Versa.
I guess the way CAD works now-a-days you could say Leaf is a modified Versa design. They take the Versa design as the base, make some changes (like increasing the wheelbase by a foot !) and you get a new cage around which Leaf is built.
1st Leaf : 2/28/2011 to 5/6/2013
2nd Leaf : 5/4/2013 to 3/21/2017
Volt : 3/25/2017 to 5/25/2018
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johnr
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Re: Electric Power Steering

Mon Oct 04, 2010 8:35 pm

EVDRIVER wrote:Making changes from an ICE is a good thing and frankly I prefer it was less like an ICE vehicle and had more options for the benefits of EV drivers like adjustable regen and tighter steering (not EV centric) which feels much better and connected. If anything I would say it's "Americanized".
I too would like it to take more advantage of unique EV characteristics, but Nissan is not primarily catering to us early adopter EV enthusiasts - they're trying to make a car that the general public who knows nothing about EVs would not be intimidated with, and at that I think they succeeded very well. As a side note, a Nissan rep at the event commented on how they even designed the inverter to look similar to an engine. Every car drives differently, and if you've ever driven a Ford Focus, you would not say the LEAF is "Americanized" (I have, and I can tell you the Ford has very stiff steering).
My trip to Mineral King and the value of regen

Charging stations, electrical adapters, and portable CHAdeMO quick chargers

2011 upgrade: Fossil < Leaf. 2014 upgrade: Leaf < imiev. 2017 upgrade: imiev < tesla. Done upgrading.

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EVDRIVER
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Re: Electric Power Steering

Mon Oct 04, 2010 8:54 pm

johnr wrote:
EVDRIVER wrote:Making changes from an ICE is a good thing and frankly I prefer it was less like an ICE vehicle and had more options for the benefits of EV drivers like adjustable regen and tighter steering (not EV centric) which feels much better and connected. If anything I would say it's "Americanized".
I too would like it to take more advantage of unique EV characteristics, but Nissan is not primarily catering to us early adopter EV enthusiasts - they're trying to make a car that the general public who knows nothing about EVs would not be intimidated with, and at that I think they succeeded very well. As a side note, a Nissan rep at the event commented on how they even designed the inverter to look similar to an engine. Every car drives differently, and if you've ever driven a Ford Focus, you would not say the LEAF is "Americanized" (I have, and I can tell you the Ford has very stiff steering).


This has nothing to do with early adopters. The car is more conservative than many ICE cars. Why are people under the impression any EV will drive different than any regular car other than the amount of regen that could be adjusted? The shifter? A cord VS a gas hose? This is all nonsense. The difference is telling someone when you turn the key there is no noise, and how to put it in drive, learning curve over. Where is the big scary part or the part that only "early adopters" will accept in mass? Where is the big change they overcame to make the car so normal? The change is that it has limited range and runs on electricity, no special design to hide that. I have owned EV's for years(factory and conversions) and it takes a minute to explain it will be silent and the first comment is usually "this is no different than a normal car". There is no steering yoke or joystick, no special training required. This bunk you hear about making the car as normal as possible is only marketing speak that is merely a response to what people are going to say regardless in any EV, Nissan did nothing special here that is not on a Prius. As far as these EVs go, early adopters are people who buy early and take more risk on new products, we are not buying an Aptera here.


If Nissan wanted to cater to EV drivers they would add regen adjustability, that's it. To cater to drivers they would stiffen the EPS a bit, EPS can do a better job than normal power steering and feel more connected if done properly. If they wanted to cater to people with more design taste they could have used a less conservative family car look from the rear of the Murano and blend of others.

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planet4ever
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Delivery Date: 02 May 2011
Leaf Number: 1537
Location: Morgan Hill, CA, south of San Jose

Re: Electric Power Steering

Mon Oct 04, 2010 10:44 pm

EVDRIVER wrote:The difference is telling someone when you turn the key there is no noise, and how to put it in drive, learning curve over.
What's this? Turn the key? I missed that part - please enlighten me. ;)

Actually, for us Prius drivers I think the only learning curve may be that we have to reach down rather than forward for the shifter. Oh, and I know I'm going to have to think twice about where the parking brake is, but I don't need that often since I usually park on level ground.
End of April 2013: Traded my 2011 SL for a 2013 S with charge pkg.

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