AndyH
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Re: Safe Display of LEAF - Lock out Motion

Mon Feb 07, 2011 6:53 pm

garygid wrote:Having L1 plugged in, even if unpowered, SHOULD keep the car from being driven away.

However, it is too easy for a "visitor" to unplug the e-nozzle.
I would hope that we can discover a more-sure solution.
I don't think so, Gary - the car detects the presence of the J1772 connector with the signals provided by the EVSE - not because of the physical presence of the connector.

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garygid
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Re: Safe Display of LEAF - Lock out Motion

Mon Feb 07, 2011 7:13 pm

I believe that the Proximity detection (nozzle plugged in) is done only with 2 Resistors and one Switch in the e-nozzle (J1772) connector itself, no signal from the EVSE required.

Are you saying that the LEAF does NOT use the Proximity detection to disable the car's motion?
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AndyH
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Re: Safe Display of LEAF - Lock out Motion

Mon Feb 07, 2011 7:48 pm

You tell me, double-E Double-E -- Under what condition(s) does the car look for the proximity signal - and what's the response if it finds it? You'll find that info in the service manual and J1772 docs that you have in your possession.

Path to the dark side, lazy is, hmmm? Image
:lol:

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garygid
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Re: Safe Display of LEAF - Lock out Motion

Mon Feb 07, 2011 8:39 pm

I know what's in J1772.

If you KNOW that the LEAF does NOT "use" the Proximity Detection, perhaps you would be kind enough to tell us.

Otherwise, we can easily test, plugging in an un-powered EVSE and check if the LEAF will move. I believe "DarkStar" reported earlier in this thread that the car does NOT move.
See SOC/GID-Meter and CAN-Do Info
2010 Prius, now for sale
2011 LEAF, sold in 2015
2018 Tesla Model 3
2014 Tesla S, Model 3 in 2019
PU: SDG&E
Solar PV: 33 x 225W -> 7 kW max AC
To Sell: X-treme 5000Li EV motorcycle

DaveinOlyWA
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Re: Safe Display of LEAF - Lock out Motion

Tue Feb 08, 2011 6:52 am

put the car in the On position by push start twice with foot off brake, remove the key. the car will not move without it.
2011 SL; 44,598 mi, 87% SOH. 2013 S; 44,840 mi, 91% SOH. 2016 S30; 29,413 mi, 99% SOH. 2018 S; 25,185 mi, SOH 92.23%. 2019 S Plus; 2640.9 mi, 99.37% SOH
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AndyH
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Re: Safe Display of LEAF - Lock out Motion

Tue Feb 08, 2011 7:56 am

garygid wrote:I know what's in J1772.

If you KNOW that the LEAF does NOT "use" the Proximity Detection, perhaps you would be kind enough to tell us.

Otherwise, we can easily test, plugging in an un-powered EVSE and check if the LEAF will move. I believe "DarkStar" reported earlier in this thread that the car does NOT move.
Ok, just to be clear - you want ME to dig thru the manuals to cross-check how the Leaf responds to the existence of the L1/L2 connector even though we both know that you have the same manuals I'll spend my time digging thru? ;)

That's fine. It'll have to wait until later today though.

edit...

References:
J1772-2010 doc: http://wenku.baidu.com/view/10b7d517552 ... ef7b6.html
Leaf Service Manual

From J1772, the EVSE-side connector has three signal paths - the two AC wires, the pilot signal, and the proximity signal. As Gary already mentioned, the proximity signal is powered from the car, not the EVSE. The proximity signal also includes the push-button on the L1/L2 connector.

From the Service Manual, Section C (electric power train), chapter VC (vehicle charging) page VC-10, the car supplies +5V to the proximity function. I cannot find an indication that the +5V is always present.

Service Manual, Section C, chapter EVC (EV Control) page EVC-32: When the driver operates the power switch while depressing the brake pedal, the car activates the systems and goes to the 'READY' state - except when the charge connector is connected.

I haven't yet found when the car sends +5V to the standard charge connector. This is required for the car to detect the presence of inserted charge connector. It may be safe to assume that 5V is present when the car is on or in accessory mode, but if it was my car and my insurance policy, I'd want to know for sure. ;)

I'd certainly use at least two wheel chocks regardless.
Last edited by AndyH on Tue Feb 08, 2011 10:11 am, edited 1 time in total.

GroundLoop
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Re: Safe Display of LEAF - Lock out Motion

Tue Feb 08, 2011 9:39 am

DaveinOlyWA wrote:put the car in the On position by push start twice with foot off brake, remove the key. the car will not move without it.
No doubt the first person to push the Button will turn it Off, though.

DaveinOlyWA
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Re: Safe Display of LEAF - Lock out Motion

Tue Feb 08, 2011 9:51 am

GroundLoop wrote:
DaveinOlyWA wrote:put the car in the On position by push start twice with foot off brake, remove the key. the car will not move without it.
No doubt the first person to push the Button will turn it Off, though.
ok, the topic is how to insure that someone can access displays but not drive off. cant have everything
2011 SL; 44,598 mi, 87% SOH. 2013 S; 44,840 mi, 91% SOH. 2016 S30; 29,413 mi, 99% SOH. 2018 S; 25,185 mi, SOH 92.23%. 2019 S Plus; 2640.9 mi, 99.37% SOH
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DarkStar
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Re: Safe Display of LEAF - Lock out Motion

Tue Feb 08, 2011 10:10 am

garygid wrote:I believe "DarkStar" reported earlier in this thread that the car does NOT move.
The only way I would have been able to get that car to move at the Drive Electric tour with the J1772 nozzle plugged in (but not on the other end) would have been to get out and push! :D

I can't remember which icon popped up on the dashboard, but it lets you know that it's plugged in. It doesn't matter if the level 1 EVSE is plugged in to the outlet since the car uses the proximity pin for this detection...
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garygid
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Re: Safe Display of LEAF - Lock out Motion

Tue Feb 08, 2011 12:31 pm

AndyH wrote:
garygid wrote:Having L1 plugged in, even if unpowered, SHOULD keep the car from being driven away.

However, it is too easy for a "visitor" to unplug the e-nozzle.
I would hope that we can discover a more-sure solution.
I don't think so, Gary - the car detects the presence of the J1772 connector with the signals provided by the EVSE - not because of the physical presence of the connector.
Sorry Andy,
I thought you were saying that you were convinced that an un-powered e-nozzle just being plugged in would NOT stop the car from moving.

Since the Proximity circuit does not go back to the EVSE through the e-hose, and knowing that you are usually right, I thought that you had some "Service Manual" information that indicated that the LEAF did NOT actually USE the Proximity Detection to immobilize the car.

Apparently I misunderstood, Sorry.

I thought that I was not asking you to search for something that you had not already found.
Again, my appologies.
See SOC/GID-Meter and CAN-Do Info
2010 Prius, now for sale
2011 LEAF, sold in 2015
2018 Tesla Model 3
2014 Tesla S, Model 3 in 2019
PU: SDG&E
Solar PV: 33 x 225W -> 7 kW max AC
To Sell: X-treme 5000Li EV motorcycle

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