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TimeHorse
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Re: Altra! Re: Reliable EV Data for Comparison

Fri May 14, 2010 6:38 am

AndyH wrote:All righty then - let the fun begin. Folks are wondering about how far the Leaf will move on a charge.

Image
Andy, I don't need this to calculate range at a fixed velocity but the thing is to make the calculation more reasonable I was wondering if you could compile battery capacity into your charts. This would allow me to work in energies rather than inverse ranges which make more sense from a common sense point of view. I don't need those numbers to work, but it will definitely make things easier and we already know the Nissan LEAFs capacity so it's not like it's information we couldn't work with when doing our final numbers.

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AndyH
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Re: Altra! Re: Reliable EV Data for Comparison

Fri May 14, 2010 1:09 pm

TimeHorse wrote:Andy, I don't need this to calculate range at a fixed velocity but the thing is to make the calculation more reasonable I was wondering if you could compile battery capacity into your charts. This would allow me to work in energies rather than inverse ranges which make more sense from a common sense point of view. I don't need those numbers to work, but it will definitely make things easier and we already know the Nissan LEAFs capacity so it's not like it's information we couldn't work with when doing our final numbers.

(Oh, and yes, Radar Detectors are still illegal here.)
In the mountains we forget to count the days. ;)

My intent was only to sift thru some of the reports and present some bite-sized views. I did list battery size and charging info in post 8. I highly recommend that you build your model with data from both the single-page summaries that I'm pulling info from, as well as one of the more thorough reports like this for the NiMH Ranger. The Southern California Edison reports list temps, energy used, times, etc. for on-road tests. The Idaho National Labs reports provide much more detail from dyno tests.

I'd post direct links, but I can only include two links per post. ;(

I hope that helps,
Andy

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Re: Reliable EV Data for Comparison

Fri May 14, 2010 1:17 pm

One thing I see missing in all your distance/mileage calculations and comparisons with other BEVs: You may have forgotten that unlike most of the the other BEVs, the LEAF has ECO mode which will give you an extra 10-15% distance.
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garygid
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Re: Reliable EV Data for Comparison

Fri May 14, 2010 1:33 pm

Does ECO mode just limit speed and acceleration?
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Re: Reliable EV Data for Comparison

Fri May 14, 2010 1:52 pm

garygid wrote:Does ECO mode just limit speed and acceleration?
From what I've read lately, I believe ECO mode increases the regen braking which gives you that extended range. All you have to do is ease off the accelerator pedal slightly to get extra regen. So even at hwy speeds (65mph) you could easily extend your range by 10-15%. I have a ScangaugeII for my cng Honda Civic GX and I've learned that when I've reached the speed limit, no matter how fast or slow, I can ease off the pedal just a 'hair' and my MPG increases immensely (from low 30's to high 40's) and still maintain the same speed.
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AndyH
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Re: Reliable EV Data for Comparison

Fri May 14, 2010 1:54 pm

leaffan wrote:One thing I see missing in all your distance/mileage calculations and comparisons with other BEVs: You may have forgotten that unlike most of the the other BEVs, the LEAF has ECO mode which will give you an extra 10-15% distance.
I'm only reporting bits of info from standardized testing - just the facts - and not trying to further process or guess.

I agree that an ECO mode should make a difference - as would all the ECO variations that our right foot allows. ;)

Bicster
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Re: Reliable EV Data for Comparison

Fri May 14, 2010 1:55 pm

leaffan wrote:From what I've read lately, I believe ECO mode increases the regen braking which gives you that extended range. All you have to do is ease off the accelerator pedal slightly to get extra regen. So even at hwy speeds (65mph) you could easily extend your range by 10-15%. I have a ScangaugeII for my cng Honda Civic GX and I've learned that when I've reached the speed limit, no matter how fast or slow, I can ease off the pedal just a 'hair' and my MPG increases immensely (from low 30's to high 40's) and still maintain the same speed.
So ECO mode = B mode?
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JasonT
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Re: Reliable EV Data for Comparison

Fri May 14, 2010 2:06 pm

Bicster wrote:So ECO mode = B mode?
I think we can only speculate at this point. I would imagine that ECO mode would do some (or all) of the following:
  • Increase brake regen
  • Decrease acceleration speeds
  • Limit top speed
  • Decrease cabin heating/cooling capabilities
As I think AndyH was hinting at, all of this can be done by the driver at any time. I would guess an ECO mode just forces this on the driver to help them be able to make it home.

Hypermilers out there probably are saying "ECO mode? We don't need no stinking ECO mode!"

darelldd
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Re: Reliable EV Data for Comparison

Fri May 14, 2010 4:35 pm

Bicster wrote:
leaffan wrote:From what I've read lately, I believe ECO mode increases the regen braking which gives you that extended range. All you have to do is ease off the accelerator pedal slightly to get extra regen. So even at hwy speeds (65mph) you could easily extend your range by 10-15%. I have a ScangaugeII for my cng Honda Civic GX and I've learned that when I've reached the speed limit, no matter how fast or slow, I can ease off the pedal just a 'hair' and my MPG increases immensely (from low 30's to high 40's) and still maintain the same speed.
So ECO mode = B mode?
If you're speaking of B mode as in the Prius, then no. That doesn't add regen, but adds engine drag. If you're speaking of B mode as in the Rav4EV then that sounds closer to the mark. Though I'm just shooting in the dark my guess is that Eco mode would limit torque in the Leaf. Maybe reduce AC compressor speed. And maybe add more regen. The torque reduction would be the biggie though. That's how I'd save energy in an EV. Well it IS how I save energy in my EV. I just use my right foot instead of pressing a button.
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Prior Nissan EV 'Art'

Fri May 14, 2010 5:10 pm

The new EV testing portal/page at the Idaho National Laboratory has two full-scale evaluations of the Nissan Altra EV. I just finished a quick read from the 2000 Altra test - there's also a report for the 1999 Altra.

The info is from Southern California Edison on-road and on racetrack testing - they evaluated the cars from a fleet-owner/operator perspective. The data is excellent! For example - in the report for the 2000 Altra, they did multiple runs thru their road loops with experienced EV drivers (more efficient) and 'Joe public' drivers and listed rang differences. There's a range of temperatures, the range of weight and electrical accessory loads, interior sound level tests, and a thorough look at changes from the earlier vehicle.

The 2000 eval has battery tech data - the early packs used the same LiMn variant of the Li-Ion family as the Leaf (though from two different manufacturers). The 1999 used analog battery management; the 2000 used digital. Geek Alert! :D

Enjoy!
Andy

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