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Re: Level 2 Charging at Home Help

Posted: Wed May 15, 2019 5:12 am
by SalisburySam
First of all, DC charging is three-phase, which very few homes are wired for. That’s a $20k installation and not feasible for most homeowners; our city just installed one and that was price mentioned...don’t know how representative that may be but the device is expensive for certain.

All of the other posts provide some good advice, and you make your choice. It appears that just a normal 120v 20-amp circuit would suffice for your needs, but the 240v options are much faster and desirable for that reason with the appropriate EVSE (electric vehicle service equipment, i.e., charging station).

You also mention future-proofing. There are two things you can reasonably expect: getting another EV and needing to charge both, and higher charging speeds in newer vehicles. I have two EVs now and use my one 32-amp AeroVironment EVSE purchased when I got my LEAF back in 2012 to charge both vehicles. My Long Range Model 3, for example, can take a 240v charge at 48 amps, requiring a 60-amp circuit with appropriate breaker, wire sizing, and EVSE. And that’s as of 2018. I would expect vehicle chargers, battery chemistries, and battery management systems to allow higher and higher charging rates over time as EVs attempt to approach the fuel fill-up times of an ICE at a gas station.

How all that fits into a home’s electrical loads remains to be seen. We completely re-wired our 1906 home when we moved into it, one part of which was upgrading the service to 400 amps, with 100 of that going to the detached garage. Many homes today have 100-amp service or even less (e.g., apartments), most newer homes seem to have 200-amp service, and moving forward that’ll probably be a minimum, at least in the US. Even at 200-amps, using 48 of that for vehicle charging is a pretty significant percentage of the total. OTOH, most high-amp charging is done overnight when other home loads other than HVAC are at their lowest. And of course, your mileage may vary.

Good luck with your vehicle, its charging, and let us all know what you decide and why.

Re: Level 2 Charging at Home Help

Posted: Wed May 15, 2019 5:23 am
by SageBrush
My charging circuit has wire that can support a 60 Amp breaker for future proofing but for now I use a 32 Amp (delivered) EVSE for our LEAF and Model 3 LR. That is fine for our car use profile. When the LEAF goes to its grave I'll think about swapping out the current J1772 Clipper Creek EVSE for a hard-wired Tesla wall charger that ups the charging rate to 48 Amps and does not require an adapter.

Re: Level 2 Charging at Home Help

Posted: Wed May 15, 2019 6:30 am
by iPlug
1. Should I install a 20-AMP, 30-AMP or 50-AMP Outlet?
-If you want to charge much faster, yes and probably with 30A+; you have lots of future upgrade space in your service panel shown and it would be very easy for someone with the ability and the least expensive to install a L2 charging station in the neighborhood of where you are currently plugged in, by the service panel

-Eaton makes 40A 2-pole standard trip circuit breakers for your service panel which would be the minimum breaker required if you went with a 32A charging station; if you have an electrician hard wire a charging station, then 40A to a 32A charging station is fine; if you go with a plugged-in outlet, as noted previously, there is no common 40A plug and these hop from 30A to 50A. So in that case you could install a 40-50A circuit and matching 40-50A breaker and go with something like a NEMA 14-50 plug.

2. Should I get a 16A or 32A charger? I'm seeing a ton of these on Amazon even though they all seem to be the same with some extra twist.
-if you are getting a L2 charging station, go with something that allows your Leaf to charge at maximum rate (30-32A)

3. Can too much AMPs destroy anything or should the charger be able to control that?
-no; between your Leaf's onboard charger, charging station, and appropriately installed circuit, these prevent excess amperage

4. Is a DC Quick charge something that could be installed in a home? Not needed, but just curious because I can't find much on it.
-as noted above, technically possible to do in some cases, but prohibitively expensive for most and little advantage when you can easily charge to full from empty in <5 hours on L2 at home (such as at night)

Re: Level 2 Charging at Home Help

Posted: Wed May 15, 2019 9:29 am
by smkettner
LeftieBiker wrote:This always happens. Someone posts about having a circuit installed for their 6.6kw (or less) charger-equipped Leaf, and the next thing you know 50 amp circuits are being pushed. Not everyone needs to "future proof" their garages. It's an option, not the only sensible thing to do.
OP mentioned future proof.

I agree a 30 amp circuit with a hardwired ClipperCreek LCS-30 charging at 24 amps should serve the OP fine even if OP upgrades to a 300+ mile vehicle in the future.

Re: Level 2 Charging at Home Help

Posted: Wed May 15, 2019 10:01 am
by LurchOR
LeftieBiker wrote:This always happens. Someone posts about having a circuit installed for their 6.6kw (or less) charger-equipped Leaf, and the next thing you know 50 amp circuits are being pushed. Not everyone needs to "future proof" their garages. It's an option, not the only sensible thing to do.
Given the close proximity of the receptacle to the panel, the cost for materials/labor would be nearly identical for any common 240V configuration. Going with a 50A circuit gives one the most options for current needs, as well as the future. Maybe not the only sensible thing to do, but what are the downsides? I just can't see putting in a circuit that might not meet the needs of their next car.

If the OP wanted the receptacle 100' from the panel...well that's different, copper's expensive.

Re: Level 2 Charging at Home Help

Posted: Wed May 15, 2019 10:18 am
by RonDawg
smkettner wrote:
LeftieBiker wrote:This always happens. Someone posts about having a circuit installed for their 6.6kw (or less) charger-equipped Leaf, and the next thing you know 50 amp circuits are being pushed. Not everyone needs to "future proof" their garages. It's an option, not the only sensible thing to do.
OP mentioned future proof.

I agree a 30 amp circuit with a hardwired ClipperCreek LCS-30 charging at 24 amps should serve the OP fine even if OP upgrades to a 300+ mile vehicle in the future.
But what if the OP gets two EV's, or an EV and a PHEV?

It doesn't cost that much more to wire a 50 amp circuit up front (assuming the capacity exists), and a lot more to have to re-do it if the OP desires a higher capacity in the future.

Re: Level 2 Charging at Home Help

Posted: Wed May 15, 2019 10:29 am
by Nubo
LeftieBiker wrote:This always happens. Someone posts about having a circuit installed for their 6.6kw (or less) charger-equipped Leaf, and the next thing you know 50 amp circuits are being pushed. Not everyone needs to "future proof" their garages. It's an option, not the only sensible thing to do.
The funny thing is, charge rate for home-charging actually becomes less important as battery capacities increase.

Re: Level 2 Charging at Home Help

Posted: Wed May 15, 2019 11:11 am
by smkettner
RonDawg wrote:
smkettner wrote:
LeftieBiker wrote:This always happens. Someone posts about having a circuit installed for their 6.6kw (or less) charger-equipped Leaf, and the next thing you know 50 amp circuits are being pushed. Not everyone needs to "future proof" their garages. It's an option, not the only sensible thing to do.
OP mentioned future proof.

I agree a 30 amp circuit with a hardwired ClipperCreek LCS-30 charging at 24 amps should serve the OP fine even if OP upgrades to a 300+ mile vehicle in the future.
But what if the OP gets two EV's, or an EV and a PHEV?

It doesn't cost that much more to wire a 50 amp circuit up front (assuming the capacity exists), and a lot more to have to re-do it if the OP desires a higher capacity in the future.
So add a second LCS-30 on its own circuit. Not rocket science here.
Really does not matter.... until it does. Will 2x 50 amp circuits be allowed on that panel?

Re: Level 2 Charging at Home Help

Posted: Wed May 15, 2019 12:38 pm
by LeafSL14
Thank you for everyone response!

I'm going to go with a Nema 14-50 so I can maximize my current position as well as being semi future proof. I'm assuming the charging cord also plays a huge role in everything, so which one of these do you suggest or should I buy something completely different? I know there is that site where they can upgrade your cord, but the price seems to be close to just buying a new one of amazon.

https://www.amazon.com/Zencar-Portable- ... 150&sr=8-4

https://www.amazon.com/Jekayla-Portable ... pons&psc=1

A couple people mentioned a charging station, but I'm not really interested in spending that much unless its necessary.

Thanks again everyone!

Re: Level 2 Charging at Home Help

Posted: Wed May 15, 2019 12:56 pm
by LeftieBiker
You realize that the Zencar charging cables only charge at 16A or about 60% of the car's maximum, right? You can get a Clipper Creek 20A charging station for about $400, or a 24A station for $500. The off-brand 32A cable is the right amperage but I'd worry about the quality.