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Nubo
Posts: 5457
Joined: Fri May 28, 2010 11:01 am
Delivery Date: 31 Oct 2014
Location: Vallejo, CA

Re: 2019 Leaf battery overheating

Sun Jun 09, 2019 7:10 pm

metricus wrote:
SageBrush wrote:
metricus wrote:Only a paid troll would go to such lengths to pollute a rational conversation.
'Shill' is the most descriptive. A shill is not arguing to be annoying, but as a paid for service.
Correct.

If at anytime it will be considered to ban him for this reason I am all for it.
An unsubstantiated allegation is not a "reason" for banning someone.

I don't agree with all of his assertions or conclusions but he's usually civil and some of what he says makes sense. If you find what he writes annoys you it's easily fixed with the "add foe" button. I have a number of members on that list but OE isn't one of them.
I noticed you're still working with polymers.

metricus
Posts: 94
Joined: Wed May 15, 2019 1:51 pm
Delivery Date: 28 Apr 2019
Leaf Number: 307046
Location: Reading, PA

Re: 2019 Leaf battery overheating

Sun Jun 09, 2019 7:19 pm

SageBrush wrote: Since the temperature dependent charging taper is meant to keep the battery degradation to within Nissan tolerance (aka, to minimize battery warranty costs,) it is amusing that they ignore the hottest cells.

Nissan corporate decision making at its finest.
I was thinking of that too but then I realized that these are the temps when the gauge jumps. This does not mean that the charge power tapering process follows the same algorithm.

Frankly, I would expect the charge current to be dependent on the highest temp sensor. Remains to be seen. A different test needs to be done.

For now, I will collect gauge data.

metricus
Posts: 94
Joined: Wed May 15, 2019 1:51 pm
Delivery Date: 28 Apr 2019
Leaf Number: 307046
Location: Reading, PA

Re: 2019 Leaf battery overheating

Sun Jun 09, 2019 7:31 pm

One thing is clear: Nissan has used every tool possible to create the illusion that the battery temp is constant.
First, by using a gauge like display instead of digital readout which would have been much easier to produce.
Second, using an incremental gauge instead of a linear one.
Third, assigning larger temperature intervals for the middle increments compared to the the end ones.
Last edited by metricus on Sun Jun 09, 2019 7:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.

metricus
Posts: 94
Joined: Wed May 15, 2019 1:51 pm
Delivery Date: 28 Apr 2019
Leaf Number: 307046
Location: Reading, PA

Re: 2019 Leaf battery overheating

Sun Jun 09, 2019 7:38 pm

Nubo wrote: he's usually civil and some of what he says makes sense.
You clearly have not read all his "work"
If you find what he writes annoys you it's easily fixed with the "add foe" button.
Already done.

metricus
Posts: 94
Joined: Wed May 15, 2019 1:51 pm
Delivery Date: 28 Apr 2019
Leaf Number: 307046
Location: Reading, PA

Re: 2019 Leaf battery overheating

Tue Jun 11, 2019 1:58 pm

As I mentioned I did another trip to Newark Airport.

This time it was at night, 22-24C temperatures, high humidity since it drizzled in spots.

Everything went very much like in the OP despite me driving extremely conservative, Eco mode, no E-pedal, Cruise, 100 km/h on the dot.

My first charge after 171 km at 100 km/h went at 35 kW. The second one, on the return trip, after another 180 km at 90 km/h went at 24 kW.

In all, I spent an extra one hour and half at chargers than I should have spent in a 50kW scenario. I also spent whatever extra time by not driving at the 70mph speed limit. My total travel time more than doubled which makes the EV savings and comfort simply not worth the effort. Screw this!

The only thing worth mentioning was that, thanks to LeafSpy, I could record a temperature decrease. During my first charge the temp went up to 41C so on the last 35 km leg to the airport I reduced the speed to 90 km/h. During this drive the temperature steadily decreased. I continued at 90 until the second charge on my return trip but it plateaued at 35C and never went lower than that. During the second charge it went up again and down again during driving.

So there is some heat loss during the drive but not nearly enough.

This confirms what many have said that one cannot count on DC charging this vehicle unless one is open for adventures and/or doesn't really have to stick to a schedule.

I for one have had enough of this exercise.

ChozoGhost79
Posts: 52
Joined: Sat Dec 14, 2013 10:29 pm
Delivery Date: 19 Apr 2019
Location: Ridgecrest, CA

Re: 2019 Leaf battery overheating

Tue Jun 11, 2019 2:36 pm

metricus wrote:As I mentioned I did another trip to Newark Airport.

This time it was at night, 22-24C temperatures, high humidity since it drizzled in spots.

Everything went very much like in the OP despite me driving extremely conservative, Eco mode, no E-pedal, Cruise, 100 km/h on the dot.

My first charge after 171 km at 100 km/h went at 35 kW. The second one, on the return trip, after another 180 km at 90 km/h went at 24 kW.

In all, I spent an extra one hour and half at chargers than I should have spent in a 50kW scenario. I also spent whatever extra time by not driving at the 70mph speed limit. My total travel time more than doubled which makes the EV savings and comfort simply not worth the effort. Screw this!

The only thing worth mentioning was that, thanks to LeafSpy, I could record a temperature decrease. During my first charge the temp went up to 41C so on the last 35 km leg to the airport I reduced the speed to 90 km/h. During this drive the temperature steadily decreased. I continued at 90 until the second charge on my return trip but it plateaued at 35C and never went lower than that. During the second charge it went up again and down again during driving.

So there is some heat loss during the drive but not nearly enough.

This confirms what many have said that one cannot count on DC charging this vehicle unless one is open for adventures and/or doesn't really have to stick to a schedule.

I for one have had enough of this exercise.
In 100+ SoCal desert temps, I don't expect any temperature decrease whatsoever.

danrjones
Posts: 396
Joined: Wed Apr 17, 2019 8:02 am
Delivery Date: 17 Jun 2019
Location: Ridgecrest, CA

Re: 2019 Leaf battery overheating

Tue Jun 11, 2019 2:48 pm

Its only suppose to be 105F tomorrow. It's a dry heat.

I knew this going in and never plan to fast charge EXCEPT when I go down to the Nissan dealer in Palmdale.
So twice a year?

But if anyone around here planned to fast charge all the time (assuming one could find a charger, which there are none) yeah it would be too hot.

It all depends on how you plan to use the vehicle.
2018 Leaf SV Pearl White with Tech and All Weather, Purchased New on 5/3/19

metricus
Posts: 94
Joined: Wed May 15, 2019 1:51 pm
Delivery Date: 28 Apr 2019
Leaf Number: 307046
Location: Reading, PA

Re: 2019 Leaf battery overheating

Tue Jun 11, 2019 3:10 pm

ChozoGhost79 wrote:In 100+ SoCal desert temps, I don't expect any temperature decrease whatsoever.
You will surely see an increase. Temp is completely out of control.

Frankly, it is a sad development for the Leaf. I expected they had worked out all the bugs by now.

metricus
Posts: 94
Joined: Wed May 15, 2019 1:51 pm
Delivery Date: 28 Apr 2019
Leaf Number: 307046
Location: Reading, PA

Re: 2019 Leaf battery overheating

Tue Jun 11, 2019 3:35 pm

danrjones wrote:It all depends on how you plan to use the vehicle.
My frustration is about what Nissan sells it to be.
Which is not.

Just like anything else you can make it work but it's not really there.

danrjones
Posts: 396
Joined: Wed Apr 17, 2019 8:02 am
Delivery Date: 17 Jun 2019
Location: Ridgecrest, CA

Re: 2019 Leaf battery overheating

Tue Jun 11, 2019 3:38 pm

I knew what I was getting and what I could and couldn't do with it, but I totally understand your concern.

I'm pretty sure I knew more than the salesman (partly thanks to this this forum!). As an example he said the battery health indicator had been removed in the 2018 and 2019's. It hasn't, it was just moved to a different display page.

Like any other company, they want to make a sale.
2018 Leaf SV Pearl White with Tech and All Weather, Purchased New on 5/3/19

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