DougWantsALeaf
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Department of Energy - Chademo vs. CCS

Tue Jul 09, 2019 7:56 am

According to the DOE site today (some articles where quoting the information source)

Chademo Locations: 2,492 (Interesting that Chademo quotes 3,000 but I wonder if that counts the total number of station points as some locations have 2 or more stations/charging points at the location)

CCS Locations: 2,258

So, in spite of the joined forces of GM and Germany, CCS doesn't yet have numerical advantage. Guessing that will happen in a year or so given trends.

https://afdc.energy.gov/fuels/electrici ... ls=dc_fast
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Tortoisehead77
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Leaf Number: 307925
Location: Portland, Oregon USA

Re: Department of Energy - Chademo vs. CCS

Tue Jul 09, 2019 8:19 am

Most of the DC fast chargers that I've seen in Oregon don't even have the CCS connection, only Chademo.

I use Blink and the West Coast Electric Highway chargers.

SageBrush
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Location: NM

Re: Department of Energy - Chademo vs. CCS

Tue Jul 09, 2019 9:37 am

CHAdeMO has major disadvantages and deficiencies that the single number in the OP do not expose:

1. 50 kW or less power
2. Concentration in urban areas
3. Typically 1 - 2 taps per location
4. Frequent poor maintenance and out of service or unavailable.

For most EV owners today the point of a DC charging network is to enable reliable and convenient long distance driving. In the USA CHAdeMO is for the most part anything but since it was designed to support extended local driving with 24 kWh LEAFs.

CCS has been growing due to the EA expansion, and as a political sop EA adds ONE 50 kW CHAdeMO tap to locations that typically have 4 - 8, 150 - 350 kW CCS taps. Saying the CHAdeMO and CCS are equivalent at those locations is ridiculous.
2013 LEAF 'S' Model with QC & rear-view camera
Bought off-lease Jan 2017 from N. California
Two years in Colorado, now in NM
03/2018: 58 Ahr, 28k miles
11/2018: 56.16 Ahr, 30k miles
-----
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DougWantsALeaf
Posts: 1064
Joined: Fri May 10, 2013 8:21 pm
Delivery Date: 18 May 2013
Leaf Number: 407811
Location: Chicago North Side

Re: Department of Energy - Chademo vs. CCS

Tue Jul 09, 2019 3:14 pm

If you count the total handles, Chademo shows even a wider lead, and there are still more multi station Chademo stops, mainly on the coasts.
2019 SV Plus Silver
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Max distance on 13 Leaf: 120 miles
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SageBrush
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Re: Department of Energy - Chademo vs. CCS

Tue Jul 09, 2019 3:43 pm

CHAdeMO in the USA is in caretaker mode, and a neglected one at that.
I showed you the data from the AFDC database: of the last 200 CHAdeMO locations installed in the USA, 70% are from EA. Of the remainder I am willing to bet good money that with few exceptions, CHAdeMO is the step-child with one plug. I'm not sure about EVgo or Chargepoint but the EA installations put the CHAdeMO plug on a station that also has CCS and only one can be used at a time. How is that for a hint ? :lol:

I don't know how much more obvious the data can be.

Asia might be somewhat different, since Japan and China have agreed on a joint standard that will at least provide low power backwards compatibility with CHAdeMO but I cannot imagine it being competitive if the new standard is faster.

Europe has embraced Type II CCS. End of the CHAdeMO story there, it is in formal caretaker mode.
Last edited by SageBrush on Wed Jul 10, 2019 5:22 am, edited 1 time in total.
2013 LEAF 'S' Model with QC & rear-view camera
Bought off-lease Jan 2017 from N. California
Two years in Colorado, now in NM
03/2018: 58 Ahr, 28k miles
11/2018: 56.16 Ahr, 30k miles
-----
2018 Tesla Model 3 LR, Delivered 6/2018

webeleafowners
Posts: 923
Joined: Mon Oct 05, 2015 5:37 pm
Delivery Date: 06 Oct 2015
Location: Okanagan Valley British Columbia

Re: Department of Energy - Chademo vs. CCS

Tue Jul 09, 2019 7:01 pm

SageBrush wrote:CHAdeMO has major disadvantages and deficiencies that the single number in the OP do not expose:

1. 50 kW or less power
2. Concentration in urban areas
3. Typically 1 - 2 taps per location
4. Frequent poor maintenance and out of service or unavailable.

For most EV owners today the point of a DC charging network is to enable reliable and convenient long distance driving. In the USA CHAdeMO is for the most part anything but since it was designed to support extended local driving with 24 kWh LEAFs.

CCS has been growing due to the EA expansion, and as a political sop EA adds ONE 50 kW CHAdeMO tap to locations that typically have 4 - 8, 150 - 350 kW CCS taps. Saying the CHAdeMO and CCS are equivalent at those locations is ridiculous.
Two more Chademo and two CCS stations opened up this week about 30 km away. All are 200 kw.
2015 Smart Electric Drive convertible.
2016 Nissan Leaf SV 30KWh
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SageBrush
Posts: 4907
Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2011 2:28 am
Delivery Date: 13 Feb 2017
Location: NM

Re: Department of Energy - Chademo vs. CCS

Tue Jul 09, 2019 7:18 pm

^^ And for you, Tesla just announced that their 50 kW CHAdeMO adapter is now compatible with Model 3.
2013 LEAF 'S' Model with QC & rear-view camera
Bought off-lease Jan 2017 from N. California
Two years in Colorado, now in NM
03/2018: 58 Ahr, 28k miles
11/2018: 56.16 Ahr, 30k miles
-----
2018 Tesla Model 3 LR, Delivered 6/2018

DougWantsALeaf
Posts: 1064
Joined: Fri May 10, 2013 8:21 pm
Delivery Date: 18 May 2013
Leaf Number: 407811
Location: Chicago North Side

Re: Department of Energy - Chademo vs. CCS

Tue Jul 09, 2019 7:53 pm

Webleafowner

Where is the Chademo located?

Thanks
2019 SV Plus Silver
2013 Leaf SV
100 Mile Club Member (Number 87)
Max distance on 13 Leaf: 120 miles
Max distance on 19 Leaf: 242 Highway 4.5 miles/kWh (4.9 KWh remaining)

webeleafowners
Posts: 923
Joined: Mon Oct 05, 2015 5:37 pm
Delivery Date: 06 Oct 2015
Location: Okanagan Valley British Columbia

Re: Department of Energy - Chademo vs. CCS

Tue Jul 09, 2019 8:11 pm

DougWantsALeaf wrote:Webleafowner

Where is the Chademo located?

Thanks
Kelowna Airport in the B.C. interior. We have driven by it a few times but haven’t stopped yet.
2015 Smart Electric Drive convertible.
2016 Nissan Leaf SV 30KWh
EV only Family...well except for the big diesel motorhome. :shock:

webeleafowners
Posts: 923
Joined: Mon Oct 05, 2015 5:37 pm
Delivery Date: 06 Oct 2015
Location: Okanagan Valley British Columbia

Re: Department of Energy - Chademo vs. CCS

Tue Jul 09, 2019 8:11 pm

SageBrush wrote:^^ And for you, Tesla just announced that their 50 kW CHAdeMO adapter is now compatible with Model 3.
That’s kinda cool.
2015 Smart Electric Drive convertible.
2016 Nissan Leaf SV 30KWh
EV only Family...well except for the big diesel motorhome. :shock:

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