salyavin
Posts: 221
Joined: Thu Sep 26, 2019 9:51 pm
Delivery Date: 30 Dec 2019
Leaf Number: 318726
Location: Littleton , CO

Re: 12V battery drained; car won't start!

Mon Nov 16, 2020 2:35 pm

Do you have a trickle charger, you could charge the 12vol to full. Charging the car the normal way does not directly charge the 12v it does that in a somewhat wonkey way that usually works. Are you sure your 12v is still good?

cje
Posts: 16
Joined: Sat Feb 01, 2020 9:53 am
Delivery Date: 01 Feb 2020

Re: 12V battery drained; car won't start!

Mon Nov 16, 2020 5:09 pm

"Earlier I had seen a message saying external drain was occurring to battery but I ignored it"
Can you monitor the 12v battery current when car shut off?
2013 S purchased used 2020
68,000- 10 bars

LeftieBiker
Moderator
Posts: 16150
Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 3:17 am
Delivery Date: 30 Apr 2018
Location: Upstate New York, US

Re: 12V battery drained; car won't start!

Mon Nov 16, 2020 5:21 pm

Earlier I had seen a message saying external drain was occurring to battery but I ignored it
I'm not familiar with this message. Do you remember the exact wording?
Scarlet Ember 2018 Leaf SL W/ Pro Pilot
2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, & 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
BAFX OBDII Dongle
PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

lebikerboy
Posts: 18
Joined: Wed Dec 19, 2018 7:03 pm
Delivery Date: 03 Jan 2019
Location: North Vancouver, BC, Canada

Re: 12V battery drained; car won't start!

Wed Nov 18, 2020 7:43 pm

For some strange reason, lead acid batteries don't seem to do well when used in an E/V environment.
I've seen examples of premature failure(s) when used in Leafs, Teslas, smart cars etc. The best option
appears to be a lifepo4 battery and is what I plan on to replace the lead acid version on our 2019 Leaf in the next six months.
2019 Leaf SV

"If a situation requires your undivided attention, it
will occur simultaneously with a compelling distraction."
:roll:

LeftieBiker
Moderator
Posts: 16150
Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 3:17 am
Delivery Date: 30 Apr 2018
Location: Upstate New York, US

Re: 12V battery drained; car won't start!

Wed Nov 18, 2020 7:58 pm

The best affordable option is an AGM 51R SLA battery.
Scarlet Ember 2018 Leaf SL W/ Pro Pilot
2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, & 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
BAFX OBDII Dongle
PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

goldbrick
Posts: 1106
Joined: Tue Aug 01, 2017 3:33 pm
Delivery Date: 01 Aug 2017
Leaf Number: 311806
Location: Boulder, CO

Re: 12V battery drained; car won't start!

Wed Nov 18, 2020 9:02 pm

There have certainly been 12V battery issues on some early Leaf years but that appears to be due to poor charging algorithms or maybe unanticipated use cases (lots of short trips, no highway driving). There is nothing technologically challenging about keeping a 12V lead acid battery healthy in an EV and while there have been problems, I'd say the majority of users never give it a thought and have no issues.

Probably the biggest difference between an ICE and an EV in this regard is that in an ICE, it's usually pretty obvious when the 12V battery is failing (trouble starting) while in an EV the first symptom is usually a total failure of the entire car with no remedy except a tow and a new battery. Some sort of early warning of 12V battery weakness would not be hard to implement in firmware and could solve this problem easily. We'll see who does it first.

LeftieBiker
Moderator
Posts: 16150
Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 3:17 am
Delivery Date: 30 Apr 2018
Location: Upstate New York, US

Re: 12V battery drained; car won't start!

Wed Nov 18, 2020 10:56 pm

It seems that Nissan has improved the 2018+ Leaf's ability to keep the 12 volt battery charged, but not by any means perfected it. I've mentioned before that I've seen my 2018's accessory battery at about 12.45 volts; well, we had my housemate's 2020 SV+ under a car cover for roughly three weeks, while the leaves fell. I fully charged the accessory battery before we covered it, but after uncovering it, said battery was at, IIRC, 12.17 volts. I was only able to have it on the maintainer for about 10 hours before she had to use it yesterday, so it will be interesting to see where it's at now, voltage-wise...
Scarlet Ember 2018 Leaf SL W/ Pro Pilot
2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, & 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
BAFX OBDII Dongle
PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

LeftieBiker
Moderator
Posts: 16150
Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 3:17 am
Delivery Date: 30 Apr 2018
Location: Upstate New York, US

Re: 12V battery drained; car won't start!

Mon Nov 30, 2020 5:29 am

If you are wondering where the first post went, the OP came back and inserted a spam message into it. It and he are now history.
Scarlet Ember 2018 Leaf SL W/ Pro Pilot
2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, & 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
BAFX OBDII Dongle
PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

User avatar
Nubo
Posts: 5845
Joined: Fri May 28, 2010 11:01 am
Delivery Date: 31 Oct 2014
Location: Vallejo, CA

Re: 12V battery drained; car won't start!

Mon Nov 30, 2020 8:29 am

LeftieBiker wrote:
Mon Nov 30, 2020 5:29 am
If you are wondering where the first post went, the OP came back and inserted a spam message into it. It and he are now history.
That's why I'm often leery of responding to the one-post wonders.
I noticed you're still working with polymers.

SageBrush
Posts: 5606
Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2011 2:28 am
Delivery Date: 13 Feb 2017
Location: NM

Re: 12V battery drained; car won't start!

Mon Nov 30, 2020 9:35 am

goldbrick wrote:
Wed Nov 18, 2020 9:02 pm
There have certainly been 12V battery issues on some early Leaf years but that appears to be due to poor charging algorithms or maybe unanticipated use cases (lots of short trips, no highway driving). There is nothing technologically challenging about keeping a 12V lead acid battery healthy in an EV and while there have been problems, I'd say the majority of users never give it a thought and have no issues.

Probably the biggest difference between an ICE and an EV in this regard is that in an ICE, it's usually pretty obvious when the 12V battery is failing (trouble starting) while in an EV the first symptom is usually a total failure of the entire car with no remedy except a tow and a new battery. Some sort of early warning of 12V battery weakness would not be hard to implement in firmware and could solve this problem easily. We'll see who does it first.
My impression is that *EVs tend to pull more amps between charging episodes. The industry has responded by selling 'deep cycle' PbA 12 batteries for our market. 12v batteries for ICE cars are much more sensitive to loss of high load current (marketed as CCA, needed to turn over the ICE during a start.)

This is a trade-off: high CCA batteries degrade quickly when deep discharged.
2013 LEAF 'S' Model with QC & rear-view camera
Bought Jan 2017 from N. California
Two years in Colorado, now in NM
03/18: 58 Ahr, 28k miles
11/18: 56.16 Ahr, 30k miles
09/20: 54.3 Ahr; 38k miles
-----
2018 Tesla Model 3 LR, Delivered 6/2018

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