rogersleaf
Posts: 289
Joined: Sun May 18, 2014 7:50 pm
Delivery Date: 22 Mar 2019
Leaf Number: 307726
Location: Kent, Ohio

Re: 2018 40kWh Chademo charging at 1/2 stated kW rate

Sat Jan 02, 2021 8:23 pm

HerdingElectrons wrote:
Tue Dec 29, 2020 12:33 pm
So I have only used the Chademo station at my dealer that's a 360V x100A so max 36kw charger although once I did see 38kw but anyways the last several times I have done a QC there it has taken WAY longer than it has historically & a few days ago I booted up LeafSpy & noticed that I was only seeing 1/2 the wattage charge rate that the car & charger was reporting.

The Charger walked the indicated charge rate from 36kW down to 24kW as my SOC went from 30ish% to 70ish% SOC and the battery temp did NOT climb hardly at all which anecdotally also correlates to the lower actual charge rate that LeafSpy was reporting.

So I was actually getting a 18kW charge and then as low as a 12kW charge. Temps were in the 50's F & the car was only driven 1 way for about 22 miles and then parked at Costco for about an hour before the 1 mile jaunt to the charger. Temp gauge was about 1/3 from L to R.

Back in Sept I had a battery check and a software update so I'm wondering if that is related...(Not the battery check)


Any ideas or others have the same thing happen?
If looking for a comparison to another 40KWh Leaf, the fastest DCFC peak charging rate I've observed has never been past 45KW according to graphs shown on ChargePoint's phone app. The charging curve usually builds gradually to that rate over several several minutes until roughly low-50'ish % SOC. That 45KW peak is a peak and have never observed a sustained plateau. Afterwards, the following down-slope I observe is relatively linear & gradual to about 18KW at roughly 85% SOC, and about 12KW at 90+% SOC. My last session was 50 minutes and took in 26.4 KWh, which represented 10% to 85% SOC, and chose to DCFC to rewarm the pack after leaving the car parked outside several days in 20F weather. So reasonable comparison on a stone-cold pack, took on 75% capacity averaging in low 20's KW rate.
2014 SV - Brilliant Silver - returned 1/2017 at end of lease.
2019 SL - White - w/Tech Package

GerryAZ
Gold Member
Posts: 2748
Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 6:47 pm
Delivery Date: 12 Jun 2011
Location: Phoenix, AZ

Re: 2018 40kWh Chademo charging at 1/2 stated kW rate

Sun Jan 03, 2021 10:29 pm

I just completed a 46 minute DCFC charge on my 62 kWh battery. The charge rate varied--started at 43 kW (44.6 kW according to Leaf Spy); increased to above 45 kW; and tapered to 35 kW (34.7 kW according to Leaf Spy). The email from EVgo indicated elapsed time of 0:46:19 with 32.771 kWh delivered. Therefore, the energy reported by the DCQC station matched the dashboard display and information from Leaf Spy Pro.

Edited to add: Highest battery temperature before charging was 67.8 F and highest battery temperature after charging stopped was 94.0; SOC was 21% when charging started and 81% after charging stopped.
Gerry
Silver LEAF 2011 SL rear ended (totaled) by in-attentive driver 1/4/2015 at 50,422 miles
Silver LEAF 2015 SL purchased 2/7/2015; traded 8/10/2019 at 82,436 miles
White LEAF 2019 SL Plus purchased 8/10/2019

DaveinOlyWA
Posts: 15298
Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 7:43 pm
Delivery Date: 16 Nov 2019
Leaf Number: 319862
Location: Olympia, WA
Contact: Website

Re: 2018 40kWh Chademo charging at 1/2 stated kW rate

Mon Jan 04, 2021 7:50 am

GerryAZ wrote:
Sun Jan 03, 2021 10:29 pm
I just completed a 46 minute DCFC charge on my 62 kWh battery. The charge rate varied--started at 43 kW (44.6 kW according to Leaf Spy); increased to above 45 kW; and tapered to 35 kW (34.7 kW according to Leaf Spy). The email from EVgo indicated elapsed time of 0:46:19 with 32.771 kWh delivered. Therefore, the energy reported by the DCQC station matched the dashboard display and information from Leaf Spy Pro.

Edited to add: Highest battery temperature before charging was 67.8 F and highest battery temperature after charging stopped was 94.0; SOC was 21% when charging started and 81% after charging stopped.
Great example of TMS being a minimal benefit "most" of the time. I have seen the same although I never charge that long in one session, where it takes at least 327 miles leaving home at 18% SOC before seeing temps in triple digits...well, at least once it did 8-)
2011 SL; 44,598 mi, 87% SOH. 2013 S; 44,840 mi, 91% SOH. 2016 S30; 29,413 mi, 99% SOH. 2018 S; 25,185 mi, SOH 92.23%. 2019 S Plus; 15, 235.1mi, 93.12% SOH
My Blog; http://daveinolywa.blogspot.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

HerdingElectrons
Posts: 197
Joined: Sat Sep 08, 2018 3:20 pm
Delivery Date: 17 Sep 2018
Location: Central Coast, Ca

Re: 2018 40kWh Chademo charging at 1/2 stated kW rate

Mon Jan 04, 2021 1:37 pm

rogersleaf wrote:
Sat Jan 02, 2021 8:23 pm
If looking for a comparison to another 40KWh Leaf, the fastest DCFC peak charging rate I've observed has never been past 45KW according to graphs shown on ChargePoint's phone app. The charging curve usually builds gradually to that rate over several several minutes until roughly low-50'ish % SOC. That 45KW peak is a peak and have never observed a sustained plateau. Afterwards, the following down-slope I observe is relatively linear & gradual to about 18KW at roughly 85% SOC, and about 12KW at 90+% SOC. My last session was 50 minutes and took in 26.4 KWh, which represented 10% to 85% SOC, and chose to DCFC to rewarm the pack after leaving the car parked outside several days in 20F weather. So reasonable comparison on a stone-cold pack, took on 75% capacity averaging in low 20's KW rate.
Thanks for the input. If you go back to that charger you should see on the charger itself a sticker that will label it as a 360V x 125A charger. That's why you get up to 45kW charge rates.

The only QC charger I have ever used is a 360V x 100A charger so my max charge rate will be 36kW & of course the typical taper as the reported SOC is sent back to the charger.

My issue/problem is my car is only charging at exactly 50% of the indicated charge rate that both the charger & the dash inside my car is displaying. This has happened 2-3x in total and all of the most recent sessions. This past charge was the 1st time I had the ability to load up Leaf Spy & confirm that that actual wattage going into the battery was 1/2 of indicated. The prior 1-2 sessions I simply noted that after the typical 15-30 min I would charge I had no where near the higher SOC I would have had from prior QC sessions at this same charger.

I will go back & log an entire charge session so everything will be better documented because I commenced troubleshooting after already being at the charger for like 30 min after I came back to the car after chatting with some dealership folks & discovered the car was nowhere near where it should have been relative to the time spent charging & the indicated charge rate.
2018 SL Pearl White 4.5/3.9 Warm/Cold weather

09/18-01K Mi: 114.52AHr / SOH= 99.20%
04/19-10K Mi: 111.45AHr / SOH= 96.54%
11/19-20K Mi: 107.44AHr / SOH= 93.07%
12/20-33K Mi: 105.39Ahr / SOH= 91.29%

HerdingElectrons
Posts: 197
Joined: Sat Sep 08, 2018 3:20 pm
Delivery Date: 17 Sep 2018
Location: Central Coast, Ca

Re: 2018 40kWh Chademo charging at 1/2 stated kW rate

Mon Jan 04, 2021 1:47 pm

First off; the temp gauge is still 12 segments so I would edit your description to "4 TB's"

What are TB's temperature brackets? I haven't noticed it moving in blocks so I plead ignorance on this level. The car was parked in a low-mid 50'sF garage so presumably that is where the pack started in temp & likely was in the 60's from driving the 22 miles & then sitting at Costco for about an hour & the 30 min later at a reduced QC rate the pack was in the 70'sF. None of those temps seem particularly cold/freezing in my experience but I'm happy to be reeducated

2nd off; There was a DC charge rate SW adjustment available and you MUST request it. Did you get that done?

I did NOT specifically request since my usage doesn't require/warrant it to be done & the idea was pure conjecture since that is the only known to me change if any to the car to impact/effect the charge rate albeit seemingly negatively

3rd off; There is such a thing as IceGate (made up term by me) that controls when the knee happens on a DC charge. The colder the "pack" (not OAT), the lower the knee which means this post should have notated the SOC's involved with all these charging events.

I thought I did. My recollection is the pack was about 28-31% SOC when I started & was only up to 61-65% SOC after about 40-45 min on a 40kWh car


I will go back & log an entire charge session so everything will be better documented because I commenced troubleshooting after already being at the charger for like 30 min after I came back to the car after chatting with some dealership folks & discovered the car was nowhere near where it should have been relative to the time spent charging & the indicated charge rate.
2018 SL Pearl White 4.5/3.9 Warm/Cold weather

09/18-01K Mi: 114.52AHr / SOH= 99.20%
04/19-10K Mi: 111.45AHr / SOH= 96.54%
11/19-20K Mi: 107.44AHr / SOH= 93.07%
12/20-33K Mi: 105.39Ahr / SOH= 91.29%

DaveinOlyWA
Posts: 15298
Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 7:43 pm
Delivery Date: 16 Nov 2019
Leaf Number: 319862
Location: Olympia, WA
Contact: Website

Re: 2018 40kWh Chademo charging at 1/2 stated kW rate

Tue Jan 05, 2021 7:33 am

HerdingElectrons wrote:
Mon Jan 04, 2021 1:47 pm
First off; the temp gauge is still 12 segments so I would edit your description to "4 TB's"

What are TB's temperature brackets? I haven't noticed it moving in blocks so I plead ignorance on this level. The car was parked in a low-mid 50'sF garage so presumably that is where the pack started in temp & likely was in the 60's from driving the 22 miles & then sitting at Costco for about an hour & the 30 min later at a reduced QC rate the pack was in the 70'sF. None of those temps seem particularly cold/freezing in my experience but I'm happy to be reeducated

2nd off; There was a DC charge rate SW adjustment available and you MUST request it. Did you get that done?

I did NOT specifically request since my usage doesn't require/warrant it to be done & the idea was pure conjecture since that is the only known to me change if any to the car to impact/effect the charge rate albeit seemingly negatively

3rd off; There is such a thing as IceGate (made up term by me) that controls when the knee happens on a DC charge. The colder the "pack" (not OAT), the lower the knee which means this post should have notated the SOC's involved with all these charging events.

I thought I did. My recollection is the pack was about 28-31% SOC when I started & was only up to 61-65% SOC after about 40-45 min on a 40kWh car


I will go back & log an entire charge session so everything will be better documented because I commenced troubleshooting after already being at the charger for like 30 min after I came back to the car after chatting with some dealership folks & discovered the car was nowhere near where it should have been relative to the time spent charging & the indicated charge rate.
Ok, so pack is probably normal. You will see a decline in the charge rate starting under 50% SOC (per LEAF Spy which is about 43% SOC per dash) when pack temps are cold in the upper 40's. That is what you will want to check. In Summer with pack temps in low 80's, that decline doesn't start until over 79% SOC so quite the difference.

TB = Temperature bars. Name isn't as accurate as it used to be but at least its a known term.
2011 SL; 44,598 mi, 87% SOH. 2013 S; 44,840 mi, 91% SOH. 2016 S30; 29,413 mi, 99% SOH. 2018 S; 25,185 mi, SOH 92.23%. 2019 S Plus; 15, 235.1mi, 93.12% SOH
My Blog; http://daveinolywa.blogspot.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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