Blink changes billing model for public charging

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pkulak said:
johnrhansen said:
I think my days of charging away from home are numbered. I charge at home mostly anyway. Just too expensive. If it costs the same as driving a small ice car, why not drive a small ice car and not worry about the range restrictions?
Because I don't want to own two cars?
+1*N. This would be one of MANY possible other reasons. i.e., I suspect that the lower cost of fuel is not the top, let alone the only, reason that most here choose to drive electric. The above question might very well be flipped on its head, and become, "Why would anyone buy an EV if his or her only concern and/or perceived advantage in driving one was the cost of fuel??"
 
Nekota said:
Using the calculation of energy content seems misleading to me since this calculation omits the heat engine losses compared to the losses in an electrical motor. If you use the max cost of $0.79 per kwhr and a typical 4 miles/kwhr the cost becomes $0.20 per mile which is on par with the gas cost of $4.00/gal and 20 mpg giving $0.20 per mile for gas.
I agree, the energy content calculation is a bit disingenuous. Usable energy content (what, 25%?) might be a bit fairer.

Then, regarding the second "fairer" calculation, aren't we past the 20 mpg average yet?!
 
Nekota said:
Using the calculation of energy content seems misleading to me since this calculation omits the heat engine losses compared to the losses in an electrical motor. If you use the max cost of $0.79 per kwhr and a typical 4 miles/kwhr the cost becomes $0.20 per mile which is on par with the gas cost of $4.00/gal and 20 mpg giving $0.20 per mile for gas.

ahagge said:
Fees for Level 2 EV charging stations owned by Blink and operated on the Blink Network in kWh eligible states will range from $0.39 to $0.79 per kWh, depending on the state and individual’s membership status. Fees for DCFC chargers owned by Blink and operated on the Blink Network in kWh eligible state will range from $0.49 to $0.69 per kWh, depending on the state and individual’s membership status.

Let's see - some perspective - 1 gallon of gasoline has roughly 33.7 kWh (per the EPA), so...

- L2 charging: $13.14 to $26.62 per gallon equivalent
- L3 charging: $16.51 to $23.25 per gallon equivalent

OPEC has nothing on these guys! :roll:

In other words, to fully charge a Leaf (24kw) @$0.65 per kw (avg), it will cost 24x0.65 = $15.6 for 75 miles or an equivalent of 3.9 gallons of fuel @ $4 per gallon, which in turn, works out to be 75/3.9 = 19.2 miles per gallon of gas!

It is worse than an average small ICE car.
 
sky074 said:
It is worse than an average small ICE car.
Yes, if you're going to charge 100% of the time at Blink public stations. How do your calculations work out if you charge 95-99% of the time at home with $0.12/kWh electricity, or at home with solar at a feed-in tariff opportunity cost of $0.04/kWh?
 
mbender said:
pkulak said:
johnrhansen said:
I think my days of charging away from home are numbered. I charge at home mostly anyway. Just too expensive. If it costs the same as driving a small ice car, why not drive a small ice car and not worry about the range restrictions?
Because I don't want to own two cars?
+1*N. This would be one of MANY possible other reasons. i.e., I suspect that the lower cost of fuel is not the top, let alone the only, reason that most here choose to drive electric. The above question might very well be flipped on its head, and become, "Why would anyone buy an EV if his or her only concern and/or perceived advantage in driving one was the cost of fuel??"
They won't, and unless public L2 costs less than gas, people living in apartments with no charging available (like me) will stick with gas. I have about a 5 block walk to a bunch of Blink L2s, and could have just seen using them at $1.00 for 3.3 kWh, or just over $0.30/kWh (after they turned down the charging rate). Now? My 11 year old Subaru Forester typically gets 28-30 mpg on the highway, and gas is down to about $3.70/gallon. Even if it averages $4.00/gallon, I'm getting 7+ miles/$1.00. $0.39/kWh is from the wall, so dividing that by 0.85 to get the true cost/kWh into your battery gives $0.46/kWh, or 7.8 miles/$1.00 at 3.6 miles/kWh (steady 65 mph).

So, while kWh pricing and shorter intervals for time pricing are both excellent changes, the increased cost means even fewer people will use them than heretofore. I will say that the local Blinks have been more reliable recently. After I kept on them about OoS units (at one point 50% were broken), they've now had 100% in service for at least the past month, and maybe 2 months.
 
Related, via ievs.com:

"CarCharging Lost $5.60 Per Every kWh Delivered In Q2 2014?"

http://insideevs.com/carcharging-lost-16-8-per-every-kwh-delivered-second-quarter-2014/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
 
Too bad for me, as I live in an apartment and charge at a nearby blink station almost all the time and was used to paying $1/hr, which was working out well for me. Now, I believe the best option for me is to charge at EVgo which is $15/month and $0.10 per minute of quick charging, though it'll add about 4 miles of extra miles on my way to work.
 
I still feel that, ideally, the cost of public L2 should be no more than gasoline for a 50 mpg Prius. A little less would be better for adoption. Cost-wise, part of the problem is that so many public charging stations are more complex than necessary and thus costly to maintain. Touch screens and card readers seem to fail regularly.

While even the GE Wattstation EVSE is probably more expensive than it needs to be, I like the fact that it's activated through a smartphone app by scanning a QR code, and billing is via PayPal. This reduces potential points of failure at the EVSE. Sure, not everyone has a smartphone or a PayPal account, but that group of people is shrinking rapidly. GE needs to do more to streamline their website and app, but that should come with time. I think "lightweight", WiFi-based EVSE clients will be the way to go. (Keeping on-site WiFi up and running isn't that hard.)
 
walterbays said:
sky074 said:
It is worse than an average small ICE car.
Yes, if you're going to charge 100% of the time at Blink public stations. How do your calculations work out if you charge 95-99% of the time at home with $0.12/kWh electricity, or at home with solar at a feed-in tariff opportunity cost of $0.04/kWh?

Currently my commute is 76 miles per day. So I would have to charge at work (no free charging at work). No Charge to Charge only gives a max of $1012. At this rate, it won't last for 2 years.
 
ColumbiaRiverGorge said:
This is why I prefer Aerovirnment. $20 a month for unlimited L2 & QCs.
If Blink is smart they will offer a plan alternative similar to Aerovirnment or to eVgo's apartment plan. Then they can get both the higher price from people like me who charge in public 1-5% of the time, and also get the dependable revenue stream from people who charge in public 50-100% of the time.
 
walterbays said:
ColumbiaRiverGorge said:
This is why I prefer Aerovirnment. $20 a month for unlimited L2 & QCs.
If Blink is smart they will offer a plan alternative similar to Aerovirnment or to eVgo's apartment plan. Then they can get both the higher price from people like me who charge in public 1-5% of the time, and also get the dependable revenue stream from people who charge in public 50-100% of the time.

This is it right here. You need variable pricing so everyone pays what they are willing to.
 
GRA said:
They won't, and unless public L2 costs less than gas, people living in apartments with no charging available (like me) will stick with gas.
leafo said:
Too bad for me, as I live in an apartment...
Not sure how well-known this is, the details, and/or when it will go into effect, but just before adjourning for the summer, the California legislature passed a bill allowing renters to have chargers installed in their complex(es) if they want one.

It hasn't been signed by Brown yet, but I suspect he will.
 
pkulak said:
TomT said:
Exactly! When I have to charge away from home, I seek out QCs... L2 is just too much of a nuisance on many levels...
Well, when there's a charger at your destination, that's as good as (or better than) a quick charger 2 miles away.
Shoot, just the other day I chose to use a L2 station over a QC station even though the stations were right next to each other, I was only staying for an hour and I needed a charge to get home (and yes, I only have 16A charging!).

Why? The L2 station cost $1.50/hr and the QC station cost $4.95 to plug-in + $0.20 / minute and I only needed about 10 miles to give me the range I needed to get home. In this case - I very happily paid $0.45 / kWh.

johnrhansen said:
I think my days of charging away from home are numbered. I charge at home mostly anyway. Just too expensive. If it costs the same as driving a small ice car, why not drive a small ice car and not worry about the range restrictions?
Because for most EV owners, they charge mostly at home so the cost of an occasional charge at "expensive" public stations has a negligible effect on total operating costs.

ColumbiaRiverGorge said:
This is why I prefer Aerovirnment. $20 a month for unlimited L2 & QCs.
This plan would cost me $20 often when I don't use a public charging station at all. A year would cost me $240. I probably only spend about $50/year on "expensive" public charging stations.

walterbays said:
If Blink is smart they will offer a plan alternative similar to Aerovirnment or to eVgo's apartment plan. Then they can get both the higher price from people like me who charge in public 1-5% of the time, and also get the dependable revenue stream from people who charge in public 50-100% of the time.
Blink certainly does need a volume discount plan for high volume customers. The current rates are OK for light users, but for frequent users it is too expensive.
 
This has really priced me out of the market - CarCharging messed up horribly here. I charge everyday at work, my wife charges twice a week at school. Neither will be doing it now.

$2.40 to go 12 miles (yes a 2011) is HORRIBLY expensive. And compared to premium gas for the Volt - it cost $3.39 per gallon to go 40 miles. Or pay $2.40 to go 12 miles. Gas would have to reach $7.25 per gallon to make public charging at school even worth it anymore. CarChargning wants a more money, but they are pricing themselves out of people buying their services, so they are going from ~$40-50 per month from me to $0. This company is not very smart.
 
abasile said:
Pipcecil said:
$2.40 to go 12 miles (yes a 2011) is HORRIBLY expensive.
Wait - $0.39/kWh * 12mi / 3mi/kWh = $1.56

I am one of the "lucky" people to live in a state that CarCharging is not doing kWh pricing (this is despite the fact we CAN do kWh pricing and their other two ChargePoint stations in the area they own do kWh pricing....so...lazy? money grab? other? your call :?: ).

Its $0.02 per 30 seconds (with card) = $0.04 per minute * 60 minutes = $2.40 per hour :eek: . So yea. sucks. :evil: Today (my last day to charge at work) I spent $4.64 for 1:56, which was $2.00 previously. The range I got back (~25 miles) was the equivalent of a 18 mpg vehicle. My father-in-laws big truck doesn't even get that bad of mileage. When it cost more to fuel my EV than a truck it makes me think someone didn't think this pricing all the way through.

It just means I won't use Blink stations anymore nor will I go out of my way to frequent places that have them either. It's not worth it unless I really need it. But since NRG eVgo has a bunch of QCs around I already pay for, I would rather fuel up there instead of using the blink at the actual place I am at. Sad.
 
Pipcecil said:
When it cost more to fuel my EV than a truck it makes me think someone didn't think this pricing all the way through.
Very sad indeed, especially considering that electricity is cheaper in Texas than in California.
 
First 2 hours should be free, then $4 thereafter to discourage people from staying connected for extended periods of time. With the first 2 hours being subsidized by a government fee on the purchase of new cars that don't meet or exceed Car CAFE standards. This may encourage people to purchase more fuel efficient cars and .

If not plugged in, then a $75 fine for being parked in an Electric Vehicle charging parking spot.

Thoughts?
 
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