Yodrak
Well-known member
Factory maintenance and checkups? Damned if I'll be sending my Leaf back to the factory for any checkups, free or not.
gasmiser1 said:
Factory Maintenance Schedule-Ideas?
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Boomer23
Well-known member
Dilemma on car washes. I've read that retail car washes are better environmentally because the water is recycled (Southern Cal "Be Water Wise"). So I've been paying for my car washes for years rather than wash that water and detergent down the sewer to the ocean.
With the Leaf, I don't want to turn the car over to those car wash guys, who wouldn't know an EV if it ran over them, though they're plenty used to hybrids.
So for the first few years, I'll probably wash it myself. Then when it seems that there are enough Leafs out there, maybe I'll let the car wash at it.
I wonder if there will be special instructions in the owner's manual for how to put it through a car wash.
With the Leaf, I don't want to turn the car over to those car wash guys, who wouldn't know an EV if it ran over them, though they're plenty used to hybrids.
So for the first few years, I'll probably wash it myself. Then when it seems that there are enough Leafs out there, maybe I'll let the car wash at it.
I wonder if there will be special instructions in the owner's manual for how to put it through a car wash.
evnow
Well-known member
Boomer23 said:
Atleast here in WA - car wash is the #1 cause of water pollution.
http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2009443661_apuscarwashrunoff.html
In the article they say, "Even washing a car without soap or with biodegradable soap is a no-no if the water runs off into storm drains, because it still picks up oil, grease and metals from the vehicle's brake pads."evnow said:
But if you're driving in the rain, won't that also happen? Perhaps it's beneficial to the environment to wash your car on a regular basis at a car wash which recycles the water to remove that material.
evnow
Well-known member
indyflick said:
What rain ? We don't get anything like that here in Seattle :roll:
JPVLeaf
Well-known member
We have been DIY car washers for some time. I may have to rethink this practice. However, I did learn some cities, such as Irvine, employ some level of treatment prior to releasing the storm water into the ocean. Phew. :?indyflick said:
http://www.irwd.com/about-us/irwd-basics.html?searched=washing+cars&advsearch=oneword&highlight=ajaxSearch_highlight+ajaxSearch_highlight1+ajaxSearch_highlight2
"Urban Runoff Treatment
Rain and urban runoff - from landscaping, car washing and other outdoor uses - flow into storm drains and out to the ocean bringing a wide variety of pollutants along for the ride. While counties and cities have primary responsibility for storm drains, IRWD began an innovative program in the early 1990's to use reconstructed wetlands to naturally treat urban runoff before it flows to the ocean. IRWD's Natural Treatment System diverts water from San Diego Creek to wetlands for a period of 7-10 days. Plants and soils within the ponds naturally remove nitrates and other pollutants from the water before it returns, much cleaner, to the creek to continue its journey to Upper Newport Bay and the ocean."
ttweed
Well-known member
Every two years is a very reasonable interval for brake fluid replacement. Many experts have long recommended changing the brake fluid every year or two for preventative maintenance. Their rationale is based on the fact that glycol-based brake fluid starts to absorb moisture from the moment it is put in the system. The problem is obviously worse in wet climates where humidity is high. After only a year of service, the brake fluid in the average vehicle may contain as much as two percent water. After 18 months, the level of contamination can be as high as three percent. And after several years of service, it is not unusual to find brake fluid that contains as much as seven to eight percent water. Water contamination increases the danger of brake failure because vapor bubbles can form if the fluid gets too hot. Three percent water will lower the boiling point as much as 50%. Vapor displaces fluid and is compressible, so when the brakes are applied the pedal may go all the way to the floor without slowing the vehicle. Anyone who has done "spirited" performance driving and experienced this "brake fade" will agree that the relatively small expense of flushing the brake fluid is well worth it.EVDRIVER said:
In addition to the safety issue, water-laden brake fluid promotes corrosion and pitting in caliper pistons and bores, wheel cylinders, master cylinders, steel brake lines and ABS modulators.
Only General Motors and Chrysler do not mention brake fluid in their scheduled maintenance recommendations. In Europe, brake fluid changes are often recommended. BMW says the fluid should be changed every two years. Honda recommends a flush & fill every 25,000 to 30,000 miles. Subaru also recommends a 30,000 mile brake fluid change. Volkswagen recommends changing the fluid every two years, and clearly states this in their owners manuals, as does Porsche.
I change mine every year, as I live 3 blocks from the ocean, and high humidity from fog is common. It is a simple procedure and can be done in an hour for a cost of $10-12 (the cost of a liter of Dot4 fluid) if you don't mind working on your own cars.
YMMV,
TT
prberg
Well-known member
I wanted to follow up on this topic now that I have seen the Service and Maintenance guide.
I guess I am really surprised by the brake fluid replacement requirement. It basically says you have to replace the brake fluid every 12 months! That seems pretty excessive to me. Anybody else? Does Nissan use a lower quality brake fluid? I just checked my Toyota Prius maintenance guide, and it does not require the brake fluid to be changed at all. Just checked periodically. So instead of doing our engine oil changes, we will have to go in and do our brake fluid changes? (which is a more expensive job that an oil change right?) I assume if we don't, we will void the warranty?
I've never done brake fluid replacement before. Isn't it something that pretty much has to be done at a dealer or brake shop? Is that something that a DIY'er can do at home? I normally do my own oil changes and brake pads... but I wonder if I can do this job as well.
Wouldn't the fact that the LEAF uses the physical brakes less (because of the regenerative braking) would mean we wouldn't need to replace fluid/pads as often? I know on my Prius, I am still on the original pads (and fluid) at 100,000 miles (although they are starting to get a bit thin and I will probably start hearing the wear warning noise soon).
thanks,
Peter
I guess I am really surprised by the brake fluid replacement requirement. It basically says you have to replace the brake fluid every 12 months! That seems pretty excessive to me. Anybody else? Does Nissan use a lower quality brake fluid? I just checked my Toyota Prius maintenance guide, and it does not require the brake fluid to be changed at all. Just checked periodically. So instead of doing our engine oil changes, we will have to go in and do our brake fluid changes? (which is a more expensive job that an oil change right?) I assume if we don't, we will void the warranty?
I've never done brake fluid replacement before. Isn't it something that pretty much has to be done at a dealer or brake shop? Is that something that a DIY'er can do at home? I normally do my own oil changes and brake pads... but I wonder if I can do this job as well.
Wouldn't the fact that the LEAF uses the physical brakes less (because of the regenerative braking) would mean we wouldn't need to replace fluid/pads as often? I know on my Prius, I am still on the original pads (and fluid) at 100,000 miles (although they are starting to get a bit thin and I will probably start hearing the wear warning noise soon).
thanks,
Peter
DeaneG
Well-known member
Many manufacturers ask for brake fluid replacement every two years, since it's hygroscopic. I have never heard of yearly brake fluid replacement. It's not hard to do yourself, but you'd want to buy a vacuum or pressure bleeder kit.
smkettner
Well-known member
Very do it yourself. Usually I change fluid same as front pads. I would speculate due to LEAF having very little wear may not get the brakes checked enough especially as it will not be in for any oil change. Many people may put fewer miles on Leaf and may otherwise never change the fluid. Good idea but once a year does seem excessive for most conditions.
I use this bleeder: http://store.motiveproducts.com/storefront.aspx
I use this bleeder: http://store.motiveproducts.com/storefront.aspx
Herm
Well-known member
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brake_fluid
"Most automotive professionals agree that glycol-based brake fluid, (DOT 3, DOT 4, DOT 5.1) should be flushed, or changed, every 1–2 years.[2] Many manufacturers also require periodic fluid changes to ensure reliability and safety. Once installed, moisture diffuses into the fluid through brake hoses and rubber seals and, eventually, the fluid will have to be replaced when the water content becomes too high. Electronic testers and test strips are commercially available to measure moisture content. The corrosion inhibitors also degrade over time. New fluid should always be stored in a sealed container to avoid moisture intrusion.
DOT 5 is silicone fluid and the above does not apply. Ideally, silicone fluid should be used only to fill non-ABS systems that have not been previously filled with glycol based fluid. Any system that has used glycol based fluid will contain moisture, glycol fluid disperses the moisture throughout the system and contains corrosion inhibitors. Silicone fluid does not allow moisture to enter the system, but does not disperse any that is already there either. A system filled from dry with silicone fluid, does not require the fluid to be changed at intervals, only when the system has been disturbed for a component repair or renewal. The United States armed forces have standardised on silicone brake fluid since the 1990s."
"Most automotive professionals agree that glycol-based brake fluid, (DOT 3, DOT 4, DOT 5.1) should be flushed, or changed, every 1–2 years.[2] Many manufacturers also require periodic fluid changes to ensure reliability and safety. Once installed, moisture diffuses into the fluid through brake hoses and rubber seals and, eventually, the fluid will have to be replaced when the water content becomes too high. Electronic testers and test strips are commercially available to measure moisture content. The corrosion inhibitors also degrade over time. New fluid should always be stored in a sealed container to avoid moisture intrusion.
DOT 5 is silicone fluid and the above does not apply. Ideally, silicone fluid should be used only to fill non-ABS systems that have not been previously filled with glycol based fluid. Any system that has used glycol based fluid will contain moisture, glycol fluid disperses the moisture throughout the system and contains corrosion inhibitors. Silicone fluid does not allow moisture to enter the system, but does not disperse any that is already there either. A system filled from dry with silicone fluid, does not require the fluid to be changed at intervals, only when the system has been disturbed for a component repair or renewal. The United States armed forces have standardised on silicone brake fluid since the 1990s."
TomT
Well-known member
Actually, that may or may not be true. On modern cars with ABS and VSC you often need both a pressure bleeder and a diagnostic tool to cycle the ABS/VSC system to purge the fluid. It's not like changing the brake fluid on an older car with neither system. I downloaded the Service Manual but haven't had a chance yet to peruse it for what procedure the Leaf requires...
Personally, I think every three years is fine and is what many car manufacturers recommend (that is the interval on both my BMW and Acura). 12 months simply seems silly and wasteful.
Personally, I think every three years is fine and is what many car manufacturers recommend (that is the interval on both my BMW and Acura). 12 months simply seems silly and wasteful.
DeaneG said:
DaveD said:
The Leaf does have a 12V battery.indyflick said:
It uses a 12V battery to obviate a step-down converter to make 12V out of the main battery's gazillion volts.
Uh, no. There is still a 12V DC-DC inverter used to charge the 12V battery when the car is one and periodically if the car remains off for more than a week or so (don't remember exactly).aqn said:
The 12V battery is used to power all the ancillaries without need to have the high voltage battery connected all the time when the car is off.
garygid
Well-known member
Apparently the unused, just parked LEAF will "wake up" for 5 minutes once each 5 days to re-charge the 12v battery as needed.
AndyH
Well-known member
Peter,prberg said:
Alcohol-based hydraulic fluids (including brake fluid) absorb water and must be changed unless it's used in an airtight system - and brake systems are not airtight.
The good news is two-fold: 12 month changes is ONLY for severe service, and we don't need special tools to change the Leaf's brake fluid.
The service manual shows the entire process. It's as easy as getting a piece of plastic tubing, a small container, a fresh bottle of the proper fluid, a helper, and a small box wrench to open/close the bleeding nipple on the brake calipers. We don't need electronic tools for our ABS system like other cars - Nissan did a good job here!
I schedule the fluid change to coincide with rotating the tires. I'll raise the car and put on jack stands, remove all four tires, then sit comfortably in the wheel well while bleeding all four corners. DIY isn't everyone's cup of tea, but if one wants to take an hour or two, they can completely replace the fluid for a couple of bucks.
For more info: http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?p=47159#p47159
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