Official BMW i3 thread

I used the hybrid gasoline burning motorcycle motor through Mission Viejo just this past weekend.

It goes 70mph just fine, and Orange County doesn't have "real hills".

TonyWilliams said:

I used the hybrid gasoline burning motorcycle motor through Mission Viejo just this past weekend.

It goes 70mph just fine, and Orange County doesn't have "real hills".

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It can climb the 73 grade from the 5 to Newport Beach at 70 mph with a 35 HP
motorcycle engine in a full Rex Mode, i.e. no battery power? Don't think so!
It'll be lucky to do 45 mph.

TomT tested the Rex Mode on the 5 near Magic Mountain with its grades,
i.e. not as bad as the 73, and was concerned about his safety the result of
an inadequate speed. The Rex Mode has been tested on the 17 from San Jose
to Santa Cruz and that route proved problematic, i.e. I've driven that many
times and it's not as difficult a grade as the 73 or 241 would be.

My Leaf requires at least 40 HP to climb the grade from the 101 to Mulholland
Hwy on the 405 doing 50-55 mph. Yes, the i3 is lighter (14%) but that's not
enough to reduce the power needed for an adequate climbing speed with
a 35 HP ICE.

AVTA has posted first capacity loss results, click the battery testing links for the i3 here:

http://avt.inel.gov/fsev.shtml

Looks like they averaged ~3% degradation over > three ~winter months and < 4k miles, not disimilar to the initial rates of capacity loss reported last winter for the 2013 LEAF and 2013 Focus E.

It will be interesting to see how well the i3s coped with the Phoenix heat since these reports, and how well the i3's ATM manages to reduce the high rates of battery degradation Both the LEAF and (ATM) Focus showed over testing periods including Spring/Summer/Fall Phoenix heat.

I test drove the i3 last weekend at BMW's Ultimate Drive Event in the LA area.

I'm very impressed. The car was quick and agile and fun - exactly like I would expect a BMW to be. And the range extender would alleviate the concerns regarding my current commute being a tad long for the Leaf.

I'm still not happy with the rear doors and getting in/out of the rear. So it would not be a replacement for the Leaf. But I'm seriously thinking about it being the replacement for my SLK. Since I would be replacing a 2-seater, getting a car I could treat as a 2-seater but does have 4 if needed, would work.

So now I just need to wait a bit. I dislike buying 1st year models and prefer to buy 3rd year models. And two years from now is about the time I would be willing to part with the SLK. Of course, by that time I imagine there will be a few more options to consider. But I think BMW has put forward a solid entry into this market.

Of course, by that time I imagine there will be a few more options to consider

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..except that you dislike buying first year models. Which means you pretty much are restricted to Leaf & i3 in a few years.

Actually that just means the restriction is to any model that is currently available and still available 2 years from now. So far, I like the B, eGolf, i3 and Leaf. But you are correct to a point in that if my commute continues to be as long as it is, then it would boil down to the i3 or the Leaf with the 30kwh pack unless I get swayed by a PIH like the c350e.

And yes, I'm hoping that by that time, the B and eGolf would also have longer range and be viable options. I like the C, so if the PIH version is as good as I'm hoping, then that will be a real contender.

Had a chance to try out an i3 during a recent stopover in San Francisco. BMW's DriveNow car-sharing service has added them to the fleet fairly recently, replacing the older ActiveE. Not bad overall, but with some odd quirks that left me missing our 2011 Leaf. Throttle response was strong on the hills of downtown SF, but not dramatically better. Regen resembled the ActiveE, which I liked -- unless you're going down a *really* steep hill, you hardly need the brake pedal. There were nice touches like cargo tie-downs in back, but the rear-passenger area is strictly an afterthought. Room for only two in back -- not a lot of room, either -- and the front seat-belt attachment points are on the *rear* suicide-style doors, so the front passenger has to not only open the front door but also unbuckle to let somebody in/out of the back. Just weird. Didn't have a chance to push the cornering ability in city traffic, but seemed taut despite the skinny tires. The styling is more modern than the Leaf, but other than that, Nissan should little to worry about until Tesla's Model 3 rolls out.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/kandrade/shares/3m28FT

808pv said:

Had a chance to try out an i3 during a recent stopover in San Francisco. BMW's DriveNow car-sharing service has added them to the fleet fairly recently, replacing the older ActiveE. Not bad overall, but with some odd quirks that left me missing our 2011 Leaf. Throttle response was strong on the hills of downtown SF, but not dramatically better. Regen resembled the ActiveE, which I liked -- unless you're going down a *really* steep hill, you hardly need the brake pedal. There were nice touches like cargo tie-downs in back, but the rear-passenger area is strictly an afterthought. Room for only two in back -- not a lot of room, either -- and the front seat-belt attachment points are on the *rear* suicide-style doors, so the front passenger has to not only open the front door but also unbuckle to let somebody in/out of the back. Just weird. Didn't have a chance to push the cornering ability in city traffic, but seemed taut despite the skinny tires. The styling is more modern than the Leaf, but other than that, Nissan should little to worry about until Tesla's Model 3 rolls out.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/kandrade/shares/3m28FT

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The Honda Element also lacked a B-pillar and had the suicide doors, and had the same issue with the front seat belts. From 2007 on, the upper belt anchors were moved to the top outer corner of the front seat itself.

GRA said:

The Honda Element also lacked a B-pillar and had the suicide doors, and had the same issue with the front seat belts. From 2007 on, the upper belt anchors were moved to the top outer corner of the front seat itself.

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So BMW needs to catch up by 7 years with Honda? :lol:

The rear seats and door etc. noted above is really the sticking point for me. So it is only an option for when it is time to replace my 2-seater.

i3 battery:
-Ideal operating temperature is between 77 to 104

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http://insideevs.com/impact-temperature-bmw-i3-battery-performance-video/

Which is why my warm climate LEAF's cold weather performance is a much greater concern to me than the relatively small amount of time during the year the pack temperature exceeds ~104 F.

The nights are starting to cool down already, and I began driving with my pack temperature below 70F yesterday.

Just as a happened over the last four Fall/Winters, more and more of my pack's available capacity (itself lower, due to the cooler temperature while charging) will be used up in warming the battery as I drive, and my LEAFs average kWh available for traction, cabin heating, etc. will slowly decline.

My next trip of over 100 miles on a single charge (assuming I only use the ~87% of my pack's present total available capacity, that fraction between "100%" and ~VLBW) probably won't happen until ~next May.

My 2012 Leaf lease is up in a few months. I test drove the i3 Rex today and really loved it. I have a couple of questions.
-How would this do driving from Roseville to Reno (in good weather and dry roads)?
-How would insurance costs be vs. the Leaf since the i3 has the carbon fiber body?
-Any advantage to waiting for the 2016 model? Will it have blind spot monitoring (those side mirrors are really small)?
Thanks

willk55 said:

My 2012 Leaf lease is up in a few months. I test drove the i3 Rex today and really loved it. I have a couple of questions.
-How would this do driving from Roseville to Reno (in good weather and dry roads)?
-How would insurance costs be vs. the Leaf since the i3 has the carbon fiber body?
-Any advantage to waiting for the 2016 model? Will it have blind spot monitoring (those side mirrors are really small)?
Thanks

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i3 may get a bigger battery next year. Can you extend your lease?

http://www.bmwblog.com/2015/10/22/bmw-i3-range-will-be-increased-in-2016-with-a-new-battery/

willk55 said:

My 2012 Leaf lease is up in a few months. I test drove the i3 Rex today and really loved it. I have a couple of questions.
-How would this do driving from Roseville to Reno (in good weather and dry roads)?
-How would insurance costs be vs. the Leaf since the i3 has the carbon fiber body?
-Any advantage to waiting for the 2016 model? Will it have blind spot monitoring (those side mirrors are really small)?
Thanks

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Can't answer any of these specifically but for #2 I would call your auto insurance agent; at least initially it may be about the same but insurance did go up on the LEAF once a few claims on repairing it are filed nationally; my '12 LEAF comprehensive coverage costs more than a much more expensive '13 VW Touareg but the VW doesn't have all the special electronics and battery pack, etc. that might need fixing.

As to the i3 itself, had a chance to drive one and they are indeed fun to drive; a little short on cargo space and those rear suicide doors may become a bit tiresome for anyone that needs to get in the back seat but the fit and finish and interior materials used (loved the bamboo dash) do set it apart from a LEAF but you are paying for it!

willk55 said:

My 2012 Leaf lease is up in a few months. I test drove the i3 Rex today and really loved it. I have a couple of questions.
-How would this do driving from Roseville to Reno (in good weather and dry roads)? <snip>

Thanks

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You might be okay, although you'd probably need to stop once en route for gas. Doing both the 'hold mode' (retains 75% of battery capacity) and 'gas tank usable volume' (from 1.9 allowed to 2.4 gal.) hacks would give you more options and make things easier. See http://bmwi3.blogspot.com/search/label/hold%20mode

GRA said:

willk55 said:

My 2012 Leaf lease is up in a few months. I test drove the i3 Rex today and really loved it. I have a couple of questions.
-How would this do driving from Roseville to Reno (in good weather and dry roads)? <snip>

Thanks

Click to expand...

You might be okay, although you'd probably need to stop once en route for gas. Doing both the 'hold mode' (retains 75% of battery capacity) and 'gas tank usable volume' (from 1.9 allowed to 2.4 gal.) hacks would give you more options and make things easier. See http://bmwi3.blogspot.com/search/label/hold%20mode

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Correction: The hold mode hack will be mandatory for you to go up hwy 80 to Reno. There was a fella on the i3 facebook group that hit the low power mode going up 50... he ended up going 35 mph up the hills! :shock: Granted 50 is a bit steeper than 80, but still. The ICE range extender simply doesn't have enough power on its own to push the car up a mountain. It is NOT like a Volt in that respect. You will have to code the car so that you can pull from both the pack and the ICE to maintain safe highway speeds.

Honestly I would wait for next years model. There's been a lot of quality issues with these cars and the current model battery is going to seem comically small in just a few years.

JeremyW said:

GRA said:

willk55 said:

My 2012 Leaf lease is up in a few months. I test drove the i3 Rex today and really loved it. I have a couple of questions.
-How would this do driving from Roseville to Reno (in good weather and dry roads)? <snip>

Thanks

Click to expand...

You might be okay, although you'd probably need to stop once en route for gas. Doing both the 'hold mode' (retains 75% of battery capacity) and 'gas tank usable volume' (from 1.9 allowed to 2.4 gal.) hacks would give you more options and make things easier. See http://bmwi3.blogspot.com/search/label/hold%20mode

Click to expand...

Correction: The hold mode hack will be mandatory for you to go up hwy 80 to Reno. There was a fella on the i3 facebook group that hit the low power mode going up 50... he ended up going 35 mph up the hills! :shock: Granted 50 is a bit steeper than 80, but still. The ICE range extender simply doesn't have enough power on its own to push the car up a mountain. It is NOT like a Volt in that respect. You will have to code the car so that you can pull from both the pack and the ICE to maintain safe highway speeds.
...
There's been a lot of quality issues with these cars...

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Yep on all of the above. The i3 REx looks pretty darn unreliable and for whatever reason, i3's when in the "spa" spend quite a bit of needless time there waiting for parts, for some weird reason.

One has to wonder what's going on w/BMW repair parts supply chain. Are the folks there just oblivious, asleep at the wheel or just unwilling to have sufficient supply of parts on hand at depots near dealers?

JeremyW said:

GRA said:

willk55 said:

My 2012 Leaf lease is up in a few months. I test drove the i3 Rex today and really loved it. I have a couple of questions.
-How would this do driving from Roseville to Reno (in good weather and dry roads)? <snip>

Thanks

Click to expand...

You might be okay, although you'd probably need to stop once en route for gas. Doing both the 'hold mode' (retains 75% of battery capacity) and 'gas tank usable volume' (from 1.9 allowed to 2.4 gal.) hacks would give you more options and make things easier. See http://bmwi3.blogspot.com/search/label/hold%20mode

Click to expand...

Correction: The hold mode hack will be mandatory for you to go up hwy 80 to Reno. There was a fella on the i3 facebook group that hit the low power mode going up 50... he ended up going 35 mph up the hills! :shock: Granted 50 is a bit steeper than 80, but still. The ICE range extender simply doesn't have enough power on its own to push the car up a mountain. It is NOT like a Volt in that respect. You will have to code the car so that you can pull from both the pack and the ICE to maintain safe highway speeds.

Honestly I would wait for next years model. There's been a lot of quality issues with these cars and the current model battery is going to seem comically small in just a few years.

Click to expand...

The extended battery is rumored to be released for the 2017 or later model. No firm information whether that is fact yet. Certainly not coming out early to mid next year.

There have been some issues with the i3 from early production, but if you visit the i3 forum, you will notice that the number of problems has dropped away. I'm not in the US, but my 2014 delivered i3 (BEV, not REX) has only had a recall for the KLE issue which would not effect current stock. Zero issues. The car is everything I had hoped for, and some. Would buy it again in a heartbeat.

BTW, the timber on the dash is Eucalypt, not Bamboo.

JeremyW said:

GRA said:

willk55 said:

<snip>
-How would this do driving from Roseville to Reno (in good weather and dry roads)? <snip>

Thanks

Click to expand...

You might be okay, although you'd probably need to stop once en route for gas. Doing both the 'hold mode' (retains 75% of battery capacity) and 'gas tank usable volume' (from 1.9 allowed to 2.4 gal.) hacks would give you more options and make things easier. See http://bmwi3.blogspot.com/search/label/hold%20mode

Click to expand...

Correction: The hold mode hack will be mandatory for you to go up hwy 80 to Reno. There was a fella on the i3 facebook group that hit the low power mode going up 50... he ended up going 35 mph up the hills! :shock: Granted 50 is a bit steeper than 80, but still. The ICE range extender simply doesn't have enough power on its own to push the car up a mountain. It is NOT like a Volt in that respect. You will have to code the car so that you can pull from both the pack and the ICE to maintain safe highway speeds. <snip>

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I'm not sure that the 'hold mode' hack will be essential from Roseville to Reno, and shouldn't be needed going the other direction. It's 74.5 miles and about 7,085 feet of net gain from Roseville to Donner Summit on I-80, but there's a truck climbing lane (typ. 35-45 mph) for much of the way, so it may be possible to make it on the battery to the Summit (no heater use). When all the side roads (U.S. 40 etc.) are open (spring through fall), I expect you could make it even easier, and from either Donner Summit or Donner Pass it's about 41 miles downhill to Reno, which can be done on the REx. Coming the other way, you should be able to make the ~2,700' climb from Reno to the Summit on the battery, maybe taking it a bit slow (55 or 60). So, while you couldn't do it at the I-80 speed limit going east up hill, it may well be possible to do it it with some inconvenience. Having the hold mode and maybe the larger usable tank capacity makes the trip easier, and certainly if this trip would be one done fairly often, at least the 'hold mode' hack is recommended; if you're doing that one you might as well do the tank hack at the same time, as there's no down side.

Beleaf said:

There have been some issues with the i3 from early production, but if you visit the i3 forum, you will notice that the number of problems has dropped away. I'm not in the US, but my 2014 delivered i3 (BEV, not REX) has only had a recall for the KLE issue which would not effect current stock. Zero issues. The car is everything I had hoped for, and some. Would buy it again in a heartbeat.

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I don't hang out on mybmwi3.com much (no time) but although it seems the problem reports have definitely fallen off in frequency on the BMW i3 Facebook group, they definitely still continue, esp. on the REx version.

Before, it used to be at least once a day on average where there was a new problem report (e.g. drivetrain malfunction, check engine light, failure that required a flatbed truck, restraint system malfunction, etc.)

cwerdna said:

Beleaf said:

There have been some issues with the i3 from early production, but if you visit the i3 forum, you will notice that the number of problems has dropped away. I'm not in the US, but my 2014 delivered i3 (BEV, not REX) has only had a recall for the KLE issue which would not effect current stock. Zero issues. The car is everything I had hoped for, and some. Would buy it again in a heartbeat.

Click to expand...

I don't hang out on mybmwi3.com much (no time) but although it seems the problem reports have definitely fallen off in frequency on the BMW i3 Facebook group, they definitely still continue, esp. on the REx version.

Before, it used to be at least once a day on average where there was a new problem report (e.g. drivetrain malfunction, check engine light, failure that required a flatbed truck, restraint system malfunction, etc.)

Click to expand...

Yes, definitely the problem reports have dropped off significantly, and also yes, the REX has had way more reports than the BEV.