Warning: Battery Replacement Cost Increase (now $8500)

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After 6 weeks of going back and forth with several local Nissan dealers on how to replace the battery in my Leaf they came up with a price of just over $7700. Most quoted around $8500. We ordered the battery and it arrived just a week later. Then I got the call. They did not know that an "adapter kit" was required and the cost would now be $9300 due to extra parts and labor costs. I said no way. They came down on the price to $8400. I offered $8200 and sad not a penny more. I am still waiting on a reply. But at this point, I really do not care if they agree or not.

I am looking at used I3's with REX motor. As well as Volts or possibly a lease on a Bolt until more EV's come on the market. But if I do not get the price I want. I will not replace the Leaf with another one. I will never suggest to anyone that they buy a Nissan. The way they treat their customers is obscene.
 
My 2011 LEAF lost its fourth capacity bar last week at 42,000 miles. My Nissan dealer gave a quote of $8900 to replace it. We will just live with it as we don’t drive it very far anymore.
 
Usaverageguy said:
But if I do not get the price I want. I will not replace the Leaf with another one. I will never suggest to anyone that they buy a Nissan. The way they treat their customers is obscene.
But if you get the price you want they stop being obscene, and you recommend Nissan to your friends ?
 
Usaverageguy said:
I am looking at used I3's with REX motor. As well as Volts or possibly a lease on a Bolt until more EV's come on the market. But if I do not get the price I want. I will not replace the Leaf with another one. I will never suggest to anyone that they buy a Nissan. The way they treat their customers is obscene.
DO NOT get an i3 REx if you care about reliability and or low repair costs once out of warranty. See http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=27&t=25484. The '14 REx version is especially bad.

I would not want to keep one once its warranty is over. Join https://www.facebook.com/groups/BMWi3/ and lurk for a few weeks. You'll see what I mean.

I'd point you towards the Volt or Bolt instead.
 
SageBrush said:
Usaverageguy said:
But if I do not get the price I want. I will not replace the Leaf with another one. I will never suggest to anyone that they buy a Nissan. The way they treat their customers is obscene.
But if you get the price you want they stop being obscene, and you recommend Nissan to your friends ?
I know I won't. It's a good commuter car, but the battery sucks and with this kind of treatment of customers on a car that in many cases isn't even paid for yet, no way!

The way I've been treated by Tesla so far is like night and day. Also, two 1800 mile road trips later I can say this is the best EV available.
 
As long suspected the initial price was likely subsidized by Nissan as they were in damage control mode following the original pack debacle trying to please pissed off owners who observed battery longevity far worse than originally promised. Welcome to the real EV total cost of ownership.
 
McHoffa said:
I know I won't. It's a good commuter car, but the battery sucks and with this kind of treatment of customers on a car that in many cases isn't even paid for yet, no way!
I feel the same way, but then if I am honest with myself I cannot really fault Nissan (too much) for not discounting my ownership. They will not get a return of their investment from me.
 
McHoffa said:
The way I've been treated by Tesla so far is like night and day. Also, two 1800 mile road trips later I can say this is the best EV available.
Sure, when the company has lost north of $5.5 billion so far (maybe $6 billion, need to update my spreadsheet) and has racked up debt of over $10 billion (see page 59 of http://ir.tesla.com/node/18946/html). They lost over $700 million last quarter alone (see page 5 and note those figures are in thousands).

It's "easy" to create products with great performance, provide good service and create a great SC network when making money or just breaking even "doesn't" matter.
 
cwerdna said:
McHoffa said:
The way I've been treated by Tesla so far is like night and day. Also, two 1800 mile road trips later I can say this is the best EV available.
Sure, when the company has lost north of $5.5 billion so far (maybe $6 billion, need to update my spreadsheet) and has racked up debt of over $10 billion (see page 59 of http://ir.tesla.com/node/18946/html). They lost over $700 million last quarter alone (see page 5 and note those figures are in thousands).

It's "easy" to create products with great performance, provide good service and create a great SC network when making money or just breaking even "doesn't" matter.
Ahem.

Build a Gigafactory
Build a PV factory
Build not one but TWO car production lines
Build out the Supercharger network at a pace unheard of, a magnitude faster than all the others combined.

... And expect to be profitable from Q3 onwards.
 
SageBrush said:
cwerdna said:
McHoffa said:
The way I've been treated by Tesla so far is like night and day. Also, two 1800 mile road trips later I can say this is the best EV available.
Sure, when the company has lost north of $5.5 billion so far (maybe $6 billion, need to update my spreadsheet) and has racked up debt of over $10 billion (see page 59 of http://ir.tesla.com/node/18946/html). They lost over $700 million last quarter alone (see page 5 and note those figures are in thousands).

It's "easy" to create products with great performance, provide good service and create a great SC network when making money or just breaking even "doesn't" matter.
Ahem.

Build a Gigafactory
Build a PV factory
Build not one but TWO car production lines
Build out the Supercharger network at a pace unheard of, a magnitude faster than all the others combined.

... And expect to be profitable from Q3 onwards.
Sigh... I already went thru this before: http://mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?p=509755#p509755 and http://mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?p=509813#p509813.

The fanboys like to claim Tesla is profitable with their cars. Ok. There is positive gross profit. But that ALREADY subtracts out the amortized cost of the above capex. Building all those things you described comes out of CASH and doesn't directly by itself upfront count as part of expense. For vehicles, it is spread out over time as part of cost of automotive revenues which fanboys like to point out is profitable and also make the claim that margins are higher than everyone else. (But, it seems like other automakers (at least Ford and GM, haven't checked all others) don't have a separate line item for R&D. They include it in cost of automotive revenues, so of course their apparent gross margin will be lower and Tesla's will be inflated.)
 
cwerdna said:
Usaverageguy said:
I am looking at used I3's with REX motor. As well as Volts or possibly a lease on a Bolt until more EV's come on the market. But if I do not get the price I want. I will not replace the Leaf with another one. I will never suggest to anyone that they buy a Nissan. The way they treat their customers is obscene.
DO NOT get an i3 REx if you care about reliability and or low repair costs once out of warranty. See http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=27&t=25484. The '14 REx version is especially bad.

I would not want to keep one once its warranty is over. Join https://www.facebook.com/groups/BMWi3/ and lurk for a few weeks. You'll see what I mean.

I'd point you towards the Volt or Bolt instead.

Look at Honda Clarity Plugin also. We love it.
 
^^^
To clarify, you mean the PHEV version, right? There are 3 versions of the Clarity: BEV, PHEV and hydrogen FCEV. First two can plug in.
 
cwerdna said:
^^^
To clarify, you mean the PHEV version, right? There are 3 versions of the Clarity: BEV, PHEV and hydrogen FCEV. First two can plug in.

Yes, the plugin hybrid. Thank you. We have chosen the Clarity PHEV over the Volt.
 
cwerdna said:
The fanboys like to claim Tesla is profitable with their cars. Ok. There is positive gross profit. But that ALREADY subtracts out the amortized cost of the above capex.

I'm not a Tesla fanboy. Tesla probably is profitable with the Model S, even including capex and R&D. This is huge right there, as other car makers will need to respond. Probably will be soon be with the Model X. Not clear yet with the Model 3LR as to when, but at least years away, maybe a decade. Probably not now or soon, and maybe not ever, with the Model 3SR.
 
I would consider paying that much for a 40 kwh pack but 24 kwh is simply not capable enough to pay more than say $4000 and even then, I am not sure I would do even that.
 
The Nissan dealer did call me back and agree to install the battery at my price of $8200. I do not blame the dealer for the problem. It is Nissan that has quietly increased the battery price and yet allowed buyers to still believe they could buy a use Leaf and replace the battery at $5500 plus some labor. And nowhere have I ever heard of an adapter kit necessary to do the replacement.

To be clear. I still love my Leaf. It is a well built car. It is comfortable to drive and I have had no maintenance issues with it. Now that I am getting a new battery and with it better range I am even happier with it. But at this point I would still never recommend a Leaf to anyone. They are too expensive to buy and then have to essentially throw away after because of the battery life issue. Other EV's with liquid cooled battery packs have longer lives and would be a much better choice.
 
Usaverageguy said:
The Nissan dealer did call me back and agree to install the battery at my price of $8200. I do not blame the dealer for the problem. It is Nissan that has quietly increased the battery price and yet allowed buyers to still believe they could buy a use Leaf and replace the battery at $5500 plus some labor. And nowhere have I ever heard of an adapter kit necessary to do the replacement.

To be clear. I still love my Leaf. It is a well built car. It is comfortable to drive and I have had no maintenance issues with it. Now that I am getting a new battery and with it better range I am even happier with it. But at this point I would still never recommend a Leaf to anyone. They are too expensive to buy and then have to essentially throw away after because of the battery life issue. Other EV's with liquid cooled battery packs have longer lives and would be a much better choice.
+1
 
Usaverageguy said:
The Nissan dealer did call me back and agree to install the battery at my price of $8200. I do not blame the dealer for the problem. It is Nissan that has quietly increased the battery price and yet allowed buyers to still believe they could buy a use Leaf and replace the battery at $5500 plus some labor. And nowhere have I ever heard of an adapter kit necessary to do the replacement.

To be clear. I still love my Leaf. It is a well built car. It is comfortable to drive and I have had no maintenance issues with it. Now that I am getting a new battery and with it better range I am even happier with it. But at this point I would still never recommend a Leaf to anyone. They are too expensive to buy and then have to essentially throw away after because of the battery life issue. Other EV's with liquid cooled battery packs have longer lives and would be a much better choice.
People hate expensive repairs. They will go out and buy something new for 3-5x the repair cost and grumble less.
I'm not sure it is rational.
 
Yes. Buying a new car is more expensive than replacing the battery, but I can understand the frustration that would lead you to do that. (My biggest complaint is not the cost. (Although I believe that it is unreasonable) But rather that Nissan made such a big deal about the $5500 battery cost and then allowed owners to believe that was still the price, while they raised the price by 35%.

Had they made an announcement before they raised the price, current owners, that took a chance on their new technology, would have had a chance to replace their batteries before the price hike. Nissan damages their brand when they piss off their customers. Especially when there are so few Leaf owners out there, that would want to replace the battery. But those that would have done so, will never recommend a Nissan product to a friend. No matter how much we like the car. Poor customer service ruins the car owner experience.
 
The risk of dropping 2x of the worthless car's "worth" on a new battery is that a relatively minor fender bender may lead to a "total loss" situation. My car was totaled and I could only get 2k extra for one month old battery, and I felt I got lucky.
 
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