Official Tesla Model Y Thread

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New vehicle average prices in the USA are approaching $40k. The $10k difference that you emphasize is easily covered by fuel costs differences for households with PV even if no tax credits are available. I'm presuming that 10% of the USA households can still do arithmetic.

Two quibbles: first, "households with PV" are still not mainstream, even counting utility-installed grid tied setups*. You'd be better off just arguing "reduced fuel and maintenance costs." Second, the decision to buy a new car is not, for the vast majority of people, math-based. They will try to decide if they can afford the payments - on a car they've already decided, for decidedly non mathematical reasons, that they want.


* Searching briefly for a number or percentage, I'm not sure that anyone has one. The common approach is to look at installed solar capacity (an estimate, apparently) and divide by number of houses. Fail. My own personal guesstimate is about 5% of homes. I wouldn't be surprised if it were more like 3%.
 
lorenfb said:
Yes, I remember that well too. The impetus for adoption of the PC wasn't the utility of the PC itself, but the arrival of the internet.

The Internet predates the PC. Of course, they didn't let regular people on it for quite a while.

I got on CompuServe for the ability to send email to other CompuServe users. There were BBS available in the early 1980's as well. It's hard to say when the Internet arrived. 1989, when CompuServe users could send email to an Internet address? 1995, when all restrictions on commercial use were dropped? But the growth was steady, long before then.

totalshc.gif


http://www.retrocomputing.net/info/siti/total_share.html

lorenfb said:
Most yawned when you demoed your PC, as most do today when you start a discussion about a BEV. Again, the key for a significant BEV adoption by the consumer and a potential "EV revolution" will occur when the consumer perceives a significant value over an ICEV. Presently, that's not the case!

Not everyone yawned when they saw my PC. My kid brother (about 10 at the time) started writing games on it, then inviting the neighborhood kids over to play while I wasn't home, and charging them per game to play. Usually a quarter, sometimes a dime or less. Social popularity, income, what more could a slightly geeky kid want? I'm not sure if he made enough to pay for my computer... But he might have. I didn't see a dime of this, of course.

The technology wasn't good enough for mass consumption in 1976. I understood that. But it was going to improve a lot. And it did.

EVs are improving a lot, if you didn't notice. I'm not saying that current EVs are mass market ready. What I'm saying is that is coming.
 
DanCar said:
I'm excited about it. May not buy one, but I find it meets my needs well. The Chrysler Portal minivan is another car that I'm excited about. Competition should be good. https://cleantechnica.com/2018/09/18/chrysler-schedules-portal-electric-minivan-for-production/
An advantage of the Portal is that it can seat 6 adults unlike the Model Y.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u2ZsZpwTUqM&t=7m30s
Quote from video: No way an adult is going to sit back there in those two seats.
 
Quote from video: No way an adult is going to sit back there in those two seats.

The guy who "fixed" the Y by making it a kammback probably also fixed that problem. I think that taking the "fixed" body and adding a little Lotus Europa flair (in the nose, with covered lights) would be a hit.


1970_Lotus_Europa_S2_%28Type_54%29.jpg



Ok, maybe I'm just OLD...
 
LeftieBiker said:
Two quibbles: first, "households with PV" are still not mainstream
About 65% of households are owners of single family houses. Even if only 1/4 of those houses are highly amenable to PV, that is the addressable crowd on a money basis for an EV that costs ~ $10k more than an ICE.

BTW, Google estimates that 80% of homes in the USA are PV candidates
https://www.engadget.com/2017/03/15/google-4-out-of-5-us-homes-have-solar-power-potential/

I recognize that most Americans are driven by the monthly payment. All I suggest is that they combine the car payment and monthly fuel cost together. I estimate that at least 1 in 10 Americans retain that skill.
 
The number of households that could physically install PV isn't nearly as important as the number who would actually want to do so and have the right conditions. That number remains relatively low.
 
LeftieBiker said:
The number of households that could physically install PV isn't nearly as important as the number who would actually want to do so and have the right conditions. That number remains relatively low.

And is doubling every 3 years or so.
 
GRA said:
I knew the Model Y's profile reminded me of some other car, and now I know which.

Model Y: https://images.app.goo.gl/vVEg43jBSr8cVVpL9
Other: https://images.app.goo.gl/j5efRrnawmdcTBK36
Other #2: https://images.app.goo.gl/YhyLGEXPXpWPJXP48

Open them all up and click back and forth between them. There really isn't anything new under the aerodynamic sun.

you are absolutely right. Other and Other #2 look a lot alike. And neither look like Model Y. If you want we can get back to Leaf and Versa looking a lot alike. That was always an entertaining discussion in a thread. It is not useful to compare what cars you think look like others. 10 people will have 12 opinions on the subject.
 
palmermd said:
you are absolutely right. Other and Other #2 look a lot alike. And neither look like Model Y. If you want we can get back to Leaf and Versa looking a lot alike. That was always an entertaining discussion in a thread. It is not useful to compare what cars you think look like others. 10 people will have 12 opinions on the subject.
OTOH, there have been some, not necessarily in this thread, who have implied that Tesla has some sooper-secret formula that allows their CUVs to be much more energy efficient than others, as opposed to making a design choice like prioritizing aerodynamics over interior volume. BTW, do you really not see that the roof/rear profiles above are essentially identical, or were you just being difficult?
 
GRA said:
palmermd said:
you are absolutely right. Other and Other #2 look a lot alike. And neither look like Model Y. If you want we can get back to Leaf and Versa looking a lot alike. That was always an entertaining discussion in a thread. It is not useful to compare what cars you think look like others. 10 people will have 12 opinions on the subject.
OTOH, there have been some, not necessarily in this thread, who have implied that Tesla has some sooper-secret formula that allows their CUVs to be much more energy efficient than others, as opposed to making a design choice like prioritizing aerodynamics over interior volume. BTW, do you really not see that the roof/rear profiles above are essentially identical, or were you just being difficult?

If you just look at the roof line then you can probably name 20 vehicles that all look alike. My point is that you can't just look at one item and say that they are the same. Yes, they follow the rules of physics to be efficient. But the two cars do not look alike unless all you look at is the roofline. There are tons of other details that make them look very different.

Ford truck and Chevy truck look a lot alike in silhouette, but they are very different once you look at the details.
 
palmermd said:
GRA said:
palmermd said:
you are absolutely right. Other and Other #2 look a lot alike. And neither look like Model Y. If you want we can get back to Leaf and Versa looking a lot alike. That was always an entertaining discussion in a thread. It is not useful to compare what cars you think look like others. 10 people will have 12 opinions on the subject.
OTOH, there have been some, not necessarily in this thread, who have implied that Tesla has some sooper-secret formula that allows their CUVs to be much more energy efficient than others, as opposed to making a design choice like prioritizing aerodynamics over interior volume. BTW, do you really not see that the roof/rear profiles above are essentially identical, or were you just being difficult?

If you just look at the roof line then you can probably name 20 vehicles that all look alike. My point is that you can't just look at one item and say that they are the same. Yes, they follow the rules of physics to be efficient. But the two cars do not look alike unless all you look at is the roofline. There are tons of other details that make them look very different.

Ford truck and Chevy truck look a lot alike in silhouette, but they are very different once you look at the details.
Yet both are more similar than different, having the same basic job requirements. Both are essentially squared-off two box vehicles with rectangular cargo bays. Cosmetic differences are just that.
 
IEVS:
Tesla Model Y Recent CARB Cerifitation Suggests Range & Delivery
https://insideevs.com/news/392835/tesla-model-y-carb-certification-range-delivery/


. . . the CARB certification data suggests the upcoming Model Y's range could hit some 309 miles, as opposed to Tesla's website, which shows just 280 miles of range. Keep in mind that all of this is just preliminary at the moment. When we learn more, we'll either update this post or write another.


Also see IEVS:
Map Shows Ford Mustang Mach-E May Make Life Harder For Tesla Model Y
https://insideevs.com/news/392851/map-ford-mach-e-tesla-model-y/
 
The earnings report on Wednesday mentioned that Model Y production ramp has begun at Fremont, with deliveries expected before the end of March.

The production ramp of Model Y started in January 2020. Together with
Model 3, our combined installed production capacity for these vehicles is now
400,000 units per year.

The ramp of Model Y will be gradual as we will be adding additional machinery
in various production shops. After such expansions are done by mid-2020,
installed combined Model 3 and Model Y capacity should reach 500,000 units
per year. We will start delivering Model Y vehicles by the end of Q1 2020.

The EPA range of the Model Y has been increased to 315 miles:

Due to continued engineering progress of the Model Y all-wheel drive (AWD), we
have been able to increase its maximum EPA range to 315 miles, compared to our
previous estimate of 280 miles. This extends Model Y's lead as the most energy efficient
electric SUV in the world.

https://ir.tesla.com/static-files/b3cf7f5e-546a-4a65-9888-c928b914b529
 
IEVS:
See The Tesla Model Y With Roof Rack Attached
https://insideevs.com/news/400414/roof-rack-tesla-model-y/


There's a video. I guess Tesla was forced to realize that many, perhaps most people who buy S/CUVs place a high value on flexible Utility, unlike many of the people who opted for the Model X with its gimmicky, unreliable FWDs that prevent the carriage of roof loads.
 
Inside EVs: It's Time: Tesla Confirms Model Y Deliveries Will Start In March

Thought this was interesting:
...Both vehicles are pointed at as true cash cows for the company, but the Model Y will introduce some of the innovations that will make it a true revolution in manufacturing.

The first change will be the use of huge cast parts in the structure. That is expected to save time and effort in the manufacturing process. Elon Musk will probably detail that when the car is officially presented to his fans.

The second one – and probably as relevant as the first – is a massive reduction in wire harnesses. Analysts predict the car will have as low as 100 m of wiring and as much as 700 m. Even the most conservative prediction is half of what a current car needs.

If all this is true, the Model Y will probably cost a lot less to build than current Tesla vehicles. That implies beefier profit margins. The more the company sells it, the better...
 
The first change will be the use of huge cast parts in the structure. That is expected to save time and effort in the manufacturing process. Elon Musk will probably detail that when the car is officially presented to his fans.
This article from 3 weeks ago has some pictures showing what they think might be evidence of the cast frame.
https://insideevs.com/news/396624/tesla-model-y-frame-casting/
 
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