bkvszomorito
Posts: 13
Joined: Sun Jul 22, 2018 2:45 pm
Delivery Date: 22 Jul 2013
Leaf Number: 403789

Re: Battery Upgrades are very possible

Mon Apr 22, 2019 7:39 am

Lothsahn wrote:
Interesting. The BMS may also be measuring the total power draw or possibly the internal resistance of the module. 3.45V indicates that roughly 12Wh (22%) of the capacity is not being used. Have you tried charging the car for only a short time (1 hour) and seeing if driving it again would trigger turtle at a lower voltage?

What this means is that the 30 kWh BMS will likely not over-discharge the 40 kWh cells, so you are safe there. However, you're not getting the full possible range.

When you charge the 40 kWh modules with the 30 kWh BMS to 100%, what does Leafspy show when the charge to 100% is done? What is the min/avg/max voltage of the cells?
Good idea, I’ll try the one hour charge and drive.

Charging of the 40kWh modules with 30kWh BMS stops at 4.110/4.115/4.120 Volts. I think there might be unused capacity as well.

If I ‘ll never discharge below 22%, my battery should be very happy.

Regarding the internal resistance, it should be really different, as the Hx value with my healthy 40kWh modules is 74 according to the 30kWh BMS.

Lothsahn
Posts: 533
Joined: Thu Apr 05, 2018 4:35 pm
Delivery Date: 04 Jan 2018
Leaf Number: 007797

Re: Battery Upgrades are very possible

Mon Apr 22, 2019 10:09 am

bkvszomorito wrote:
Good idea, I’ll try the one hour charge and drive.

Charging of the 40kWh modules with 30kWh BMS stops at 4.110/4.115/4.120 Volts. I think there might be unused capacity as well.
Based on the curve, you're wasting ~3% of the battery on the top end. That means that overall, you're sacrificing 25% of the battery, between upper and lower bounds. Your 40 kWh battery is effectively a 30 kWh battery, but I would expect it to last LONGER because it's not being kept at either extreme.
bkvszomorito wrote:If I ‘ll never discharge below 22%, my battery should be very happy.
It should help. However, cars are generally stored charged, not discharged, so I suspect the top-level charge cutoff matters more. Either way, you're going to have a small DoD on each driving cycle, which should allow your battery to last much better if you drive a lot.
bkvszomorito wrote: Regarding the internal resistance, it should be really different, as the Hx value with my healthy 40kWh modules is 74 according to the 30kWh BMS.
I don't understand what the Hx value really means, but the internal resistance of the cells will affect the amount of regen braking, among other things. If the BMS is calculating a higher Hx score, you should get more regen braking.
2011 Silver SV, purchased 2018, lives in Missouri (previously in CA)
LeafSpy Pro + BAFX Products OBDII dongle
Battery swap 2019/04/24 (87% SOH, 12 bar)

Dala
Posts: 114
Joined: Sun Oct 28, 2018 11:24 am
Delivery Date: 01 Jan 2015
Leaf Number: 316851

Re: Battery Upgrades are very possible

Wed Apr 24, 2019 6:13 am

I recently acquired the EVs Enhanced; HV Battery Pairing Tool: http://evsenhanced.com/products/hv-batt ... ring-tool/

My next step is to buy a salvage 30/40kWh pack, and make a frankenbattery. Then I will tackle the instrumentation and hopefully cutoff voltage with a CAN-in-the-middle board.

My end goal is to have a sellable product, battery swaps on the cheap, and also upgrades.

Considering that used 24kWh batteries go for 2500€, 30kWh go for 3500€ and 40kWh go for 5000€, it's even way way cheaper to upgrade than a new 24kWh battery from Nissan, that you pay 10000€ for !

Oilpan4
Gold Member
Posts: 955
Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2019 10:51 pm
Delivery Date: 10 May 2018
Leaf Number: 004270

Re: Battery Upgrades are very possible

Wed Apr 24, 2019 8:35 am

Hey I'll take one.
I will be at 11 bars any day now.
Probably be looking for a 40kwh pack next year.
I think I can get a whole crashed 40kwh leaf for under $7,000, hopefully around $5,000.
Take the battery, sell the rest piece by piece on ebay till its a hollow shell that I can drag to the scrap yard.
2011 white SL leaf with 2014 batt.
Chargers: Panasonic brick moded for 240v, duosida 16a 240v and a 10kw setec portable CHAdeMO
Location: 88103

Lothsahn
Posts: 533
Joined: Thu Apr 05, 2018 4:35 pm
Delivery Date: 04 Jan 2018
Leaf Number: 007797

Re: Battery Upgrades are very possible

Wed Apr 24, 2019 6:55 pm

Dala wrote:My next step is to buy a salvage 30/40kWh pack, and make a frankenbattery. Then I will tackle the instrumentation and hopefully cutoff voltage with a CAN-in-the-middle board.
Best of Luck. I am rooting for you! There is a can intercept/logger someone posted in this forum. It logs all communication to a SD card. That will make your project much easier.
2011 Silver SV, purchased 2018, lives in Missouri (previously in CA)
LeafSpy Pro + BAFX Products OBDII dongle
Battery swap 2019/04/24 (87% SOH, 12 bar)

yontyont
Posts: 5
Joined: Fri Mar 11, 2016 11:15 am
Delivery Date: 09 Mar 2016
Leaf Number: 321622

Re: Battery Upgrades are very possible

Sun May 12, 2019 8:02 am

Is it possible to put the slightly larger 2019 Plus battery in a 2015 Leaf ?

Thanks, Tony

SageBrush
Posts: 4907
Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2011 2:28 am
Delivery Date: 13 Feb 2017
Location: NM

Re: Battery Upgrades are very possible

Sun May 12, 2019 8:48 am

Dala wrote:I recently acquired the EVs Enhanced; HV Battery Pairing Tool: http://evsenhanced.com/products/hv-batt ... ring-tool/
My next step is to buy a salvage 30/40kWh pack, and make a frankenbattery. Then I will tackle the instrumentation and hopefully cutoff voltage with a CAN-in-the-middle board.
Good luck!
I hope you keep us informed of your progress.
2013 LEAF 'S' Model with QC & rear-view camera
Bought off-lease Jan 2017 from N. California
Two years in Colorado, now in NM
03/2018: 58 Ahr, 28k miles
11/2018: 56.16 Ahr, 30k miles
-----
2018 Tesla Model 3 LR, Delivered 6/2018

Lothsahn
Posts: 533
Joined: Thu Apr 05, 2018 4:35 pm
Delivery Date: 04 Jan 2018
Leaf Number: 007797

Re: Battery Upgrades are very possible

Sun May 12, 2019 9:17 pm

yontyont wrote:Is it possible to put the slightly larger 2019 Plus battery in a 2015 Leaf ?

Thanks, Tony
Currently? No. People haven't even gotten a way to get any battery upgrades, unless you swap the VCM on a 30 kWh pack.
2011 Silver SV, purchased 2018, lives in Missouri (previously in CA)
LeafSpy Pro + BAFX Products OBDII dongle
Battery swap 2019/04/24 (87% SOH, 12 bar)

Dala
Posts: 114
Joined: Sun Oct 28, 2018 11:24 am
Delivery Date: 01 Jan 2015
Leaf Number: 316851

Re: Battery Upgrades are very possible

Fri May 17, 2019 2:48 am

Update, the Man-in-the-middle CAN boards from Muxsan arrived today. Purchased a 30kWh pack, gonna figure out shipping next, and I'm also always on the lookout for any 40kWh packs :)

Here is where the magic happens:
Image

LeftieBiker
Moderator
Posts: 13448
Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 3:17 am
Delivery Date: 30 Apr 2018
Location: Upstate New York, US

Re: Battery Upgrades are very possible

Fri May 17, 2019 3:46 am

It looks well constructed. No questionable solder joints on the back?
Scarlet Ember 2018 Leaf SL W/ Pro Pilot
2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, & 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
BAFX OBDII Dongle
PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

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