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jlv
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Re: Hyundai Kona Electric

Fri Apr 26, 2019 7:21 am

OrientExpress wrote:I just went through all the photos of BEVs that I have tested over the last three years and other than the current '18-'19 LEAF not a single one had a numerical percentage display of battery charge.
you didn't test a Tesla? It can display SOC% (but only by replacing the remaining range with the SOC%).

The underlying value is the same: range is just remaining charge (in kWh) multiplied by the rated efficiency, which is a fixed value per model.

IMHO, a real range value like that is far better than a SOC%. How far can I go when the car says the SOC is 50%? It depends upon the car. Its certainly different in my wife's X vs. my S. If the car doesn't have a real range display (and instead a LEAF-like GOM), then the SOC% becomes crucial. But I think they've missed out on giving the driver the more important value.
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WetEV
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Re: Hyundai Kona Electric

Fri Apr 26, 2019 8:14 am

jlv wrote:IMHO, a real range value like that is far better than a SOC%. How far can I go when the car says the SOC is 50%? It depends upon the car.
If the GOM is smarter than you are, knows more about the weather than you do, knows the route better than you do, knows traffic conditions better than you do, and know how you are going to drive, I'd agree. And I'm not saying I want only an SOC%, a GOM is useful even when less than ideal.

This is almost a moot point. GOM, SOC% and SOC bars are all rarely used. If you bought an EV that has enough range for daily driving in any weather with capacity loss and a safety margin, then you almost never care about charge level, range to empty, and so on. For most people, on most days, any, all or none would be fine.
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DaveinOlyWA
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Re: Hyundai Kona Electric

Fri Apr 26, 2019 10:56 am

I think it should all be available and leave it up to the driver to decide what to use and how it should be interpreted. Seems like manufacturers do not want to give us that option (Nissan seemingly excepted)

I travel the digital World extensively and hear constant complaints about the lack of "right" information people are looking for. My LEAF has MANY different options whether it be km or miles/kwh or power estimates over 100 km. Do I need all that? Not really although it fun to play with it at times but its all about choice.

But at the same time, I get people's frustration over seeing figures they are not familiar with. I tried to live with my TPMS in Pascals but it was simply too weird. I accepted it but then again, why? When it took all of 3 seconds to change back? Its like vacation; We look forward to it for weeks but after a while of it, we simply desire to go back to work and sleep in our own beds.
2011 SL; 44,598 miles. 2013 S; 44,840 miles.2016 S30 deceased. 29,413 miles. 2018 S40; 15,000 miles, 478 GIDs, 37.0 kwh 109.81 Ahr , SOH 94.61, Hx 120.15
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smkettner
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Re: Hyundai Kona Electric

Tue Jun 11, 2019 3:17 pm

Too long to read the whole thread..... can someone remind me what the included KONA EVSE is rated for the USA version?
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cwerdna
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Re: Hyundai Kona Electric

Sat Jun 29, 2019 1:27 am

cwerdna wrote:
alozzy wrote:Sounds like the Kona Electric will be available in California this month:

http://www.thedrive.com/new-cars/25689/ ... ot-a-tesla

Lucky Californians!
Will be interesting to see the sales/lease figures and to see if it's basically So Cal only virtual vaporware that ships in tiny quantities (e.g. averaging under 50 units/month) or if they're actually serious.

For comparison, per https://insideevs.com/monthly-plug-in-sales-scorecard/, a whopping 345 Ioniq EVs were sold in the US for 2018. For 2018, the worst month was 3 and the highest I see was 60.
I got curious and took a look at https://insideevs.com/news/343998/month ... scorecard/. Well, sales are pretty puny. Unclear if there's lack of supply, lack of awareness, lack of demand or too high a price (e.g. lack of discounting or dealer markups).

Highest so far was a month with 127 units. The rest have been sub-100 units in a month. Will be interesting to see the June results

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GRA
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Re: Hyundai Kona Electric

Sun Jun 30, 2019 4:51 pm

cwerdna wrote:
cwerdna wrote: Will be interesting to see the sales/lease figures and to see if it's basically So Cal only virtual vaporware that ships in tiny quantities (e.g. averaging under 50 units/month) or if they're actually serious.

For comparison, per https://insideevs.com/monthly-plug-in-sales-scorecard/, a whopping 345 Ioniq EVs were sold in the US for 2018. For 2018, the worst month was 3 and the highest I see was 60.
I got curious and took a look at https://insideevs.com/news/343998/month ... scorecard/. Well, sales are pretty puny. Unclear if there's lack of supply, lack of awareness, lack of demand or too high a price (e.g. lack of discounting or dealer markups).

Highest so far was a month with 127 units. The rest have been sub-100 units in a month. Will be interesting to see the June results
I saw my first two Kona EVs in the wild this month, in the East Bay, so they are definitely here in NorCal. I've never seen a Hyundai ad for them or any other of the Korean PEVs, other than the original Soul EV TV ad and one more since.
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DougWantsALeaf
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Re: Hyundai Kona Electric

Sun Jul 07, 2019 12:49 pm

Board,

Do you think the Kona’s range advantages over Niro and Leaf are due to drive train, wheels, weight, ???

Niro and Kona do have 2 to potentially 4 more kWh of available battery, so that explains 8-16 miles of the range difference, but not the other 16-20 miles of range difference. Aerodynamics are pretty similar. Weight is very similar.

I haven’t had a chance to drive the Kona EV yet (not available here), but wondered if those who had driven both, had noticed any difference in the driving which might hint towards the improvement. The only guess I have is that it is pretty difficult to keep the leaf at a constant power output and as a result you zig zag the power output when driving. I have read in many reviews that beyond 30 or so mph the Niro/Kona are tad more sluggish, and wonder if a more mild/stretched accelerator mapping helps level the draw and improve efficiency.

Please pass on anything you know or speculate.

Thank you
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GRA
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Re: Hyundai Kona Electric

Sun Jul 07, 2019 3:33 pm

I think trying to compare the Kona with the LEAF involves too many variables, and the Niro and Kona's specs are much more similar, although they use cells from two different companies. In that case, I'd think it's almost entirely due to size and weight differences, but the Niro's heat pump cancels out that advantage in the real world any time that's in use.

I haven't driven the Kona as I know it's too short (lacking in cargo space with rear seats up, and lie down space with them down, as with the Bolt) for me, so can't comment on its driving characteristics, but judging by reviews it's got the more sporty feel of the two Koreans, which is what you'd expect. Certainly the Bolt is more of a driver's car than the Niro, and if the Niro's practical aspects were irrelevant and I just wanted a fun car to drive, I'd go Bolt. Reviews seem to rank them in that category as 1. Bolt, 2. Kona, 3. Niro.
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

LeftieBiker
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Re: Hyundai Kona Electric

Sun Jul 07, 2019 4:43 pm

I saw an Ionic for the first time yesterday. It was charging at Kohl's. Nice looking car. A bit smaller than the Leaf, especially inside, from what I could see. Still no Konas or Niros spotted here.
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Leaf15
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Re: Hyundai Kona Electric

Sun Jul 07, 2019 5:46 pm

DougWantsALeaf wrote:Board,

Do you think the Kona’s range advantages over Niro and Leaf are due to drive train, wheels, weight, ???

Niro and Kona do have 2 to potentially 4 more kWh of available battery, so that explains 8-16 miles of the range difference, but not the other 16-20 miles of range difference. Aerodynamics are pretty similar. Weight is very similar.
Kona and Niro EV power train is identical. Niro is heavier and less aerodynamic, but much more comfortable car for family. Hyundai rates their car at 0F or 32F(speculative), unlike others who want to claim as much as possible longer range taking it at 80F(no doubt). So yes, in the summer you get extra 2-4kWh depending on temperature on all Hyundai EV, in mild winter you get rated range, while others are screaming and cursing EV batteries and range loss beyond advertised figures at low temperature.

EPA should really set rules on how minimum range is estimated (winter should be taken into account), anything above it - is just icing on the cake. My Ioniq EV shows 161 miles estimate, 164 miles of real range in the summer at 80F average temperature. I never got rated 124 miles, even in cold weather in winter, always more than rated range estimated & real.
Last edited by Leaf15 on Sun Jul 07, 2019 5:55 pm, edited 5 times in total.
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