nondem
Posts: 11
Joined: Mon May 13, 2019 6:42 am
Delivery Date: 11 May 2019
Leaf Number: 332282

Newbie with a low mileage 2015 wondering about range degradation.

Mon May 13, 2019 6:17 pm

I just bought a 2015 S with 9500 garage-kept miles on it and just one capacity bar missing. I have a Heavy duty diesel pickup for pulling a camper and decided I'd like to keep the miles down on it and save some fuel costs since it was how I was getting back and forth to work.
I'm having no problems completing my daily commute right now - with 20 miles of estimated range left when I pull back in my driveway.
I live 15 miles outside of town so the first and last 15 of each cycle is at 60ish mph. The rest is city. I've only got a couple of drive cycles since I bought it but so far so good on the range as I said...but it is summer. I should mention due to my paranoia - so far I've pretty much kept it in B mode w/Eco activated so these numbers are based on that.
This car has really low miles obviously so it doesn't have a ton of cycles on the battery...but it does have 4 years of age in the Florida heat. It was previously owned by a senior-citizen who decided to just totally quit driving - so the car likely spent a lot of time sitting around for days or weeks w/unknown states of charge.
So, my commute is about 50 miles a day on average so based on the 20 miles left over I'm thinking I've got about 70ish miles of range total. With the AC running about half of the time - at least if the Range Estimator is to be trusted.
I'm concerned that over the next 2-3 years the battery might degrade enough to be a problem. Also, I'm pretty sure since I have an S that I've got the resister-type heater which kinda makes sense for North Florida where there are maybe 30 days a year where I will even need heat...and then only in the morning. I read that it is a power hog which concerns me considering my already somewhat tight range window and the added concern with reduced range in the cold.

I see there are battery checks involved in the scheduled maintenance....I'm wondering what good that will even be? It isn't like they could do anything about an issue except replace the battery right? This is an S but is heavily optioned with the 6.6Kv charging and also the DC charge port. Is it a sure bet the heater is Resistor or was the heat pump an option on the S in 2015...if so I may have it.(fingers crossed)
I've got a 6.6Kv charger on the way but I'm wondering if a quick DC charge on occasion might also be a good idea? I know it isn't ideal to do it all of the time but Li-Ion batteries have weird lifestyles depending on the chemistry involved :)
The fact that is has the "Lizard" battery makes me feel a little better about the heat issue but I could use some reassurance from you fine folks?
Sorry for the babbling questions...I hope be being a newbie helps excuse some of it.
Also, before someone crucifies me about not searching around - did read some threads here about range estimations etc...I just thought folks would have thoughts pertinent to my particular situation.

Oh and Hello from Tallahassee, Florida :)
-Randy

GerryAZ
Gold Member
Posts: 2249
Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 6:47 pm
Delivery Date: 12 Jun 2011
Location: Phoenix, AZ

Re: Newbie with a low mileage 2015 wondering about range degradation.

Mon May 13, 2019 8:45 pm

Hi Randy,

Welcome to the forum. If your car is an S model (no touchscreen navigation system), then it does not have the heat pump. The S should be OK for your climate because you won't use the heat much and you can always preheat the car while it is plugged in on a cold morning. I have a 2015 SL with 78,000 miles that has lived its entire life in the Phoenix heat and I still make my 52-mile round trip commute (with not much reserve now that the battery has 4 years worth of deterioration). The annual battery test does not cost much and is required to keep the battery warranty intact. The capacity warranty is 5 years or 60,000 miles (and comes into play once 4 capacity bars are lost) and the defect warranty (complete cell failure, for example) is 8 years or 100,000 miles so you probably have some warranty coverage left, depending upon the actual in service date.

The remaining range DTE (distance to empty) display can be reasonably accurate if your driving is at steady speed on the level, but can be really inaccurate if speed varies or you drive up/down hills. I typically get at least 7 miles after the first low battery warning (LBW) before getting the very low battery warning (VLBW) and another 7 miles after VLBW so 20 miles remaining might be realistic if you do not reach LBW during your normal commute.

I normally see a little improvement in battery capacity for a while after a quick charge so don't be afraid of an occasional QC--just try not to get the battery too hot. I strongly recommend that you obtain LEAF Spy Pro and a suitable OBDII adapter because there have been times when public charging stations caused communication errors between the station and car that set diagnostic trouble codes (DTC) and those codes needed to be cleared before the car would charge at other stations. I would have been calling for a tow to the dealer if I had not been able to clear the DTCs with Leaf Spy Pro. Leaf Spy also gives you a lot of information about the battery.
Gerry
Silver LEAF 2011 SL rear ended (totaled) by in-attentive driver 1/4/2015 at 50,422 miles
Silver LEAF 2015 SL purchased 2/7/2015; traded 8/10/2019 at 82,436 miles
White LEAF 2019 SL+ purchased 8/10/2019

LeftieBiker
Moderator
Posts: 12993
Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 3:17 am
Delivery Date: 30 Apr 2018
Location: Upstate New York, US

Re: Newbie with a low mileage 2015 wondering about range degradation.

Mon May 13, 2019 10:54 pm

What Gerry wrote. Plus, unless you need it badly or the weather is cool, you want avoid DC quick charges, because they heat the battery, and heat is, as you seem to realize, your pack's enemy. Just try to keep it cool, don't charge it in any way if it shows more than 6 temp bars on the dash and you have the option of not charging (5 is better, but you are in Florida), and don't charge it to 100% except for charges that end right before you use the car.
Scarlet Ember 2018 Leaf SL W/ Pro Pilot
2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, & 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
BAFX OBDII Dongle
PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

nondem
Posts: 11
Joined: Mon May 13, 2019 6:42 am
Delivery Date: 11 May 2019
Leaf Number: 332282

Re: Newbie with a low mileage 2015 wondering about range degradation.

Tue May 14, 2019 5:54 am

Thanks to both of you for the replies.
I do have the touchscreen Navi which is odd apparently on an S. It also has the Alloy wheels and as I mentioned - pretty much all the other options I can think of except leather and that solar panel on the back spoiler to help with the 12v battery. It was sold to me as an S though so I'll assume the VIN proves it is actually an S or the "stealer" would have been happy to get a higher price for it.
I'll dig around and see if I can find a way to get a list of what options it has....

I'll also avoid the DC quick charges - There actually aren't any that I can find here in Tallahassee so far anyway. My usage plans wouldn't require topping during the day so no issue there.
I did notice that my range - at least the estimates - seems to have gone up since I've cycled the battery a few times. It showed 71 miles after the first charge - this morning it showed 81...so I'm thinking the car sat around a while and the battery needed to be exorcised a bit. Still one capacity bar missing so I'm assuming they can't come back once they go unless someone resets it.
I do have an OBDII adapter and will get Leafspy.

LeftieBiker
Moderator
Posts: 12993
Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 3:17 am
Delivery Date: 30 Apr 2018
Location: Upstate New York, US

Re: Newbie with a low mileage 2015 wondering about range degradation.

Tue May 14, 2019 6:02 am

The car is an SV, making it a better buy. Does it have a Bose subwoofer in the rear cargo area? If it has, and thus has Premium Package as well, that gives you the Bose stereo and a great 4 camera parking monitor system.

The range estimate isn't changing because the battery has improved. The "Guess O Meter" as we call it, just takes the last few minutes of driving and uses that alone for a range estimate. So if you drive it gently as you about to park it (and most people do) it will give too high a range estimate that will likely drop quickly when you drive it again.
Scarlet Ember 2018 Leaf SL W/ Pro Pilot
2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, & 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
BAFX OBDII Dongle
PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

WetEV
Posts: 3043
Joined: Fri May 04, 2012 8:25 am
Delivery Date: 16 Feb 2014
Location: Near Seattle, WA

Re: Newbie with a low mileage 2015 wondering about range degradation.

Tue May 14, 2019 6:27 am

nondem wrote:Thanks to both of you for the replies.
I do have the touchscreen Navi which is odd apparently on an S.
Then you don't have an S

If a bit of HTML hackering isn't beyond you, you can get the original window stickers using the hack at

http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.p ... 40#p535946

and

http://cpo.nissanusa.com/search-inventory/
WetEV
#49
Most everything around here is wet during the rainy season. And the rainy season is long.
2012 Leaf SL Red (Totaled)
2014 Leaf SL Red
2019 eTron Blue

nondem
Posts: 11
Joined: Mon May 13, 2019 6:42 am
Delivery Date: 11 May 2019
Leaf Number: 332282

Re: Newbie with a low mileage 2015 wondering about range degradation.

Tue May 14, 2019 10:35 am

I'll work on getting that OEM window sticker to prove it but I think you are right about it being an SV. It doesn't have the Bose system though.

https://nissannews.com/en-US/nissan/usa ... -press-kit
Looking at this link - these are the items on this vehicle that aren't even an option on the S:
Alloy wheels
Michelin Tires
LED Headlight
QuickCharge port(DC charging port)
Auto on/off headlights.
Fog lights.
The 7" touchscreen(Navi)
Carwings telematics
HandsFree text messaging

Since it is a SV - it shows the Heatpump heater as standard...so I'll assume it has that till I can prove different :)

So I did get a sweet deal since the pricing was based on it being an S. I guess the dealer had the same problem I did figuring out what model it is. Nothing so far has shown it as anything but a generic Nissan Leaf.

GerryAZ
Gold Member
Posts: 2249
Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 6:47 pm
Delivery Date: 12 Jun 2011
Location: Phoenix, AZ

Re: Newbie with a low mileage 2015 wondering about range degradation.

Tue May 14, 2019 6:58 pm

You have a well-equipped SV so enjoy it. The heat pump will save energy when using heat and defrost in your climate. You will need to set up an EV Connect (formerly called CarWings) account with Nissan through the EV Customer Service phone line if you want to use the remote climate control and other remote access features. You will also need to have the telematics unit (cellular modem) updated if it has not already been done. The telematics unit should be replaced by the dealer without cost to you if it is needed.

Don't worry too much about battery temperature--do what you can to keep it from getting really hot, but don't be afraid to use the car. Today was close to 100 degrees F and my battery temperature was at 7 bars on the way home. It may be down to 6 bars by the time I plug in after 8:00 pm (off peak power rate starts then). It will not be too long before I start seeing 8 bars. I quit worrying about battery temperature a long time ago because I bought the car to drive and it gets almost all of my local miles (saving wear and tear on my other vehicles). Also, don't be afraid to charge to 100% as long as you will drive it within a few hours, just don't leave it parked for extended time at high SOC (state of charge).
Gerry
Silver LEAF 2011 SL rear ended (totaled) by in-attentive driver 1/4/2015 at 50,422 miles
Silver LEAF 2015 SL purchased 2/7/2015; traded 8/10/2019 at 82,436 miles
White LEAF 2019 SL+ purchased 8/10/2019

LeftieBiker
Moderator
Posts: 12993
Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 3:17 am
Delivery Date: 30 Apr 2018
Location: Upstate New York, US

Re: Newbie with a low mileage 2015 wondering about range degradation.

Tue May 14, 2019 9:33 pm

The heat pump will save energy when using heat and defrost in your climate.
Just to clarify, using heat and A/C-assisted defrost at the same time will negate the advantage of the heat pump, and the car will use as much power as a non heat pump-equipped car. That's because the SV and SL also have the same resistance heater as the S trim, and that heater has to provide all of the heat in that scenario, with the heat pump providing the A/C. This is still the quickest way to defog the windshield and windows, so use it if needed - just be aware of the hit to efficiency.
Scarlet Ember 2018 Leaf SL W/ Pro Pilot
2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, & 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
BAFX OBDII Dongle
PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

ebeighe
Posts: 55
Joined: Wed Jul 05, 2017 1:56 pm
Delivery Date: 27 Jul 2017
Leaf Number: 308422
Location: Phoenix, AZ

Re: Newbie with a low mileage 2015 wondering about range degradation.

Fri Jul 19, 2019 9:05 am

GerryAZ wrote: The annual battery test does not cost much and is required to keep the battery warranty intact.
how much might it cost? and,
What makes you say that?
I took my '17 leaf to dealer at 1st anniversary last July and as far as i can tell that wasn't done -- or how would i know?
I mentioned it to the service advisor dude and he said something to the effect of "don't worry we know what to do".
My 2nd anniversary is coming up so i'd like to understand the situation better.


EDIT:
oops, i should have looked harder(!), here's from the 2017 Warrantee booklet, so i guess the operative phrase here is if the degradation "...could have been avoided...", my emphasis added:
MAINTENANCE , DATA ACCESS, ANDRECORDSAs a condition of this warranty, you are responsible forproperly using, maintaining and caring for your vehicleas outlined in your OWNER’S MANUAL and yourNISSAN LEAF SERVICE & MAINTENANCE GUIDE,and maintaining copies of all maintenance records &receipts for review by Nissan. You are required to per-form annual EV Battery Usage Reports at intervals of12 months, 24 months, 36 months, 48 months,60 months, 72 months, and 84 months. These EVBattery Usage Reports can be performed by a NissanLEAF certified dealer or any qualified repair shop facility.The 12 and 24 month EV Battery Usage Report will be performed at no charge to the customer, provided thework is done at a Nissan LEAF certified dealer. Any damage or failure resulting from a failure to have these required services performed, or that could have been avoided had these services been performed, is not covered under warranty.
https://owners.nissanusa.com/content/te ... ooklet.pdf

2nd EDIT:
jeez i've really been going off half-cocked -- I just found and re-looked at the paperwork i got after my 1st anniversary visits and it says things like
CAUSE: PERFORMED MULTI POINT INSPECTION
...
GBATT BATTERY TESTED AND PASSED AT THIS TIME USING NISSAN APPROVED BATTERY TESTER
It also said on another line item:
PERFORM BATTERY USAGE TEST, CAUSE WARR, A99 PC0530

I'd still be curious to know what the test costs annually (i.e. after the 24month one), on average or whatever, i know different dealers charge different prices.
Last edited by ebeighe on Fri Jul 19, 2019 9:53 am, edited 1 time in total.
"Brilliant Silver" 2017 S built 04/17, delivered 7/27/2017

Return to “New Members & Newbie Questions”