2019 Leaf battery overheating

[lorenfb]

My 2013 never reached temps in excess of 95F,
although I typically only QCed for 15-30 minutes. My present 2013 Leaf datas indicated in my signature. Luckily, my 2013 battery
doesn't have a worse SOH.

knightmb at https://web.archive.org/web/20170717073 ... hp?t=22134 I think has a '13 judging by his VIN and some prior posts. He's gotten his battery to least 131 F (55 C).

I'm pretty sure I've reached battery temps over 90 F just due to high ambient temps w/my current '13 Leaf. My current Leaf doesn't even have a CHADeMO inlet.

Oh, so from the anecdotal data, the implication is that heat soaking a Li ion battery has a marginal long term degradation effect, right?
Based on a sample of one, Leaf owners should discount temperature, e.g. Tucson, AZ owners take note, and focus more on not charging to
greater than 80%.


Did you read the following TomT post?

[Evoforce]

So let's go back to my initial questions:
does anyone have a 2019? does it behave the same? I'd like to understand if my specimen has a problem or i have to just get used to it.

I wish you and others, to not get duped into buying, what amounts to a large battery city car. Nissan did not care to engineer Leaf to be a road trip car even though marketing says it is. The larger American EV market needs a car that they feel is as capable as ICE. The Leafs Achilles Heal is still the battery and its poor design. Also, if Nissan's future is a cabin air cooled battery, that, has proven to be a fail by other manufacturers also. I wish you better luck...

[cwerdna]

My 2013 never reached temps in excess of 95F,
although I typically only QCed for 15-30 minutes. My present 2013 Leaf datas indicated in my signature. Luckily, my 2013 battery
doesn't have a worse SOH.

knightmb at https://web.archive.org/web/20170717073 ... hp?t=22134 I think has a '13 judging by his VIN and some prior posts. He's gotten his battery to least 131 F (55 C).

I'm pretty sure I've reached battery temps over 90 F just due to high ambient temps w/my current '13 Leaf. My current Leaf doesn't even have a CHADeMO inlet.

Oh, so from the anecdotal data, the implication is that heat soaking a Li ion battery has a marginal long term degradation effect, right?
Based on a sample of one, Leaf owners should discount temperature, e.g. Tucson, AZ owners take note, and focus more on not charging to
greater than 80%.


Did you read the following TomT post?

Who me? I'm not sure what you're implying. I merely pointed to how hot someone got their gen 1 Leaf battery on a hot day by multiple DC FCs in a day. Nothing more was implied.

[lorenfb]

knightmb at https://web.archive.org/web/20170717073 ... hp?t=22134 I think has a '13 judging by his VIN and some prior posts. He's gotten his battery to least 131 F (55 C).

I'm pretty sure I've reached battery temps over 90 F just due to high ambient temps w/my current '13 Leaf. My current Leaf doesn't even have a CHADeMO inlet.

Oh, so from the anecdotal data, the implication is that heat soaking a Li ion battery has a marginal long term degradation effect, right?
Based on a sample of one, Leaf owners should discount temperature, e.g. Tucson, AZ owners take note, and focus more on not charging to
greater than 80%.


Did you read the following TomT post?

Who me? I'm not sure what you're implying. I merely pointed to how hot someone got their gen 1 Leaf battery on a hot day by multiple DC FCs in a day. Nothing more was implied.

Sorry for the tone. We both know well, you more so having owned a Leaf longer, the detriment to battery life that heat is.

[cwerdna]

^^^
Indeed.

I'm still at 11 bars and SOH around 82%... actually has gone up to high 82's on my used 5/2013 built Leaf at under 65K miles. In comparison, this Phoenician at http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.p ... 95#p473995 w/the same build month as mine lost his 4th bar in late 8/2016.

We have plenty of examples of Leafs faring worse in terms of degradation in hotter climates than cooler ones for a given chemistry/battery revision.

[metricus]

I wish you and others, to not get duped into buying, what amounts to a large battery city car. Nissan did not care to engineer Leaf to be a road trip car even though marketing says it is.

This is exactly what we decided after test-driving both models (plus and regular). We did not need to spend the money on more range as long as our daily commute does not justify it. The Plus is 200 kg heavier and it's like carrying a large backpack every day just bc you need it once in a blue moon. It also has higher energy consumption because of the extra weight.

What we did not know is that we would not be able to QC like we did with the 2016 Leaf. I NEVER saw my temp gauge go up like this one does.

FALSE ADVERTISING = The fact that marketing presents it as a road trip car without specifying that in normal turnpike conditions you cannot count on more than one QC per day.

[cwerdna]

What we did not know is that we would not be able to QC like we did with the 2016 Leaf. I NEVER saw my temp gauge go up like this one does.

FALSE ADVERTISING = The fact that marketing presents it as a road trip car without specifying that in normal turnpike conditions you cannot count on more than one QC per day.

Out of curiosity, can you point us to the marketing and "false advertising" you speak of?

I'm not aware of anything to that effect but I may be wrong...

Follow-up on the previous reply: Frankly I think the accuracy of the temp gauge is less relevant at this point. The main problem is the fact that a 220 mile trip caused the car to decrease the charging power to as low as 14 kW. the reason for this is irrelevant for the user.

My problem snowballs after this: EVGO kicks me out after 30 minutes. which means that at a slower power I get less energy in that amount of time.

This means that I have to use my credit card to charge to the level i need which makes the NCTC program a false advertisement.

The temp gauge accuracy and what it represents is of some importance. If you actually had something with precision, you could better identify the sweet spot in terms of speed (in mph) vs. heating the battery vs. not affecting the battery temp vs. actually cooling it. I've been able to observe this w/Leaf Spy Pro on my '13 when outside air temp is considerably cooler than the battery temp.

It would also give you a data point w/some accuracy for actual battery temp to go w/your other data.

The 30 minute session length has been documented at https://www.ez-charge.com/faq for ages. How is it a "false advertisement"? The oldest copy at https://web.archive.org/web/20141110004 ... e.com/faq/ from Nov 2014 also talks about the 30 minutes.

False advertisement is also the claim that the car can be charged in less than 30 mins on QC because that can only happen once per day if at all. in my case the first charge was at 35 kW not at 43 or "up to 50 kW" as they advertise.

Did they ever advertise you can do two+ fast charges at 43 kW or 50 kW in a single day on a 40 kWh Leaf?

It sounds like your starting SoC was too high on your first DC FC anyway and we don't know the battery temp at that point.

[LeftieBiker]

Did they ever advertise you can do two+ fast charges at 43 kW or 50 kW in a single day on a 40 kWh Leaf?

You're picking nits. Would you be happy if your Bolt could only do one QC a day, and GM had left that info out of their advertising...?

[cwerdna]

Did they ever advertise you can do two+ fast charges at 43 kW or 50 kW in a single day on a 40 kWh Leaf?

You're picking nits. Would you be happy if your Bolt could only do one QC a day, and GM had left that info out of their advertising...?

Not really. OP keeps complaining about "false advertising". I want to actually see what he claims is false.

As for the latter, not really, but I've not looked into GM's advertising and verbiage about multiple DC FCs in a day.

[SageBrush]

I'm sure it's a 40kwh Leaf. That degree of throttling of charge rate isn't likely to happen in cool temps with the ePlus.

In theory maybe, but complete reference data using LeafSpy has not been presented on the Plus battery. Some thought that the 40 kWh
battery having more parallel cells (pouches), i.e. for increased capacity, would result in lower battery resistance, thereby developing less
battery heat at higher QCs. That seems to not be the case whether QCing or driving at higher speeds. Given that, one would question
the logical of the Plus' battery being more heat tolerant than the 40 kWh battery.

I never thought that the 40kwh pack would heat any less. The 62kwh pack has the simple advantage of having much more capacity, so with much more chemical "space" available there need not be as much heating per amp of input charge. That isn't to say that the 62kwh pack won't suffer from high ambient heat, from heat produced by hard driving, or even from heat produced by multiple fast charges. It will just take it longer to get hot - and then longer to cool off again.

Same heat but perhaps less temperature rise due to more mass. And I suspect even slower heat dissipation but that is really hard to guess at since some degree of powered cooling is going on and heat dissipation is a complicated topic.