Leaf Price / Discount discussion thread

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Oils4AsphaultOnly said:
Kieran973 said:
So after lurking on this forum for almost a year, I finally bought a Leaf today (4/30). I picked up a silver 2019 Leaf SV with the All-Weather package. The deal worked out like this:

MSRP: $35,195 (in addition to the All-Weather package, this car has $910 of add-on crap that the dealer refused to take out)
Dealer Discount: $1,195
Selling Price: $34,000
Dealer/Doc Fees: $270
Taxes: $2,092.29 (combined state and county sales tax is 8.875% in my area)
Total Price: $36,362
NY State Drive Clean Rebate: $2,000
Con Edison Discount (utility): $5,000
Trade-in Value (2016 Honda Civic LX with 30,000 miles): $10,500
Out the Door (not including the trade-in value): $29,362
Out the Door (after the trade-in): $18,862
Total out of pocket cost after $7,500 federal tax credit: $21,862

I followed your math up to the last part. Wouldn't your total out-of-pocket after Fed Tax Credit be $11,362? Assuming you qualify for the full credit of course.

Anyway, if the $11,362 amount is correct, with a $2300 per year savings, you made out nicely. At least you got some sort of discount, unlike the stories I hear from others.


Kieran973 said:
My car insurance also went down $100 a year by switching from a 3-year-old used Honda Civic to a new Nissan Leaf.

Also, my best estimate is that my wife and I stand to save about $2,300 a year in operating costs by trading in my Civic for the Leaf. Part of these savings will come from aggressively using the Leaf almost everywhere we go, while limiting the use of her CRV to under 3,000 miles a year. Part of this will also come from massively cheap electricity through a Con Edison/Fleet Carma partnership that bills EV charging between midnight and 8 AM at effectively 2 cents per kWh in my area.

Did I do OK? This is the first new car I've ever owned. Two years ago I was driving a 2001 Honda Civic.

I debated for a long time whether to get a 40 kWh Leaf or 62 kWh Leaf Plus. At the end of the day, my wife and I drive about 19,000 miles a year, and through some smart reorganization of our car usage, we can do 16,000 of those miles in the 40 kWh Leaf, while we could do 17,000 miles in the Leaf Plus. The lowest total out of pocket cost I could find for a Leaf Plus S was about $27,000 (after the federal tax credit), and this was just too much money for me to spend on a car, especially for one that would only allow me to drive 1,000 more electric miles a year. I was also underwhelmed by the Leaf Plus' somewhat choppy ride and somewhat stiff driver's seat.


In terms of Leaf Spy, are these the things I should be buying?

OBD Dongle:

https://www.amazon.com/BAFX-Products-Bluetooth-Diagnostic-Scanner/dp/B005NLQAHS

Leaf Spy Pro:

https://www.amazon.com/Turbo3-Leaf-Spy-Pro/dp/B00PMLTPN0

Cheap Android: which ones are best these days? I have a Kindle Fire from 2014. Can I use that?

And it's my understanding that I need to get an extension cord that I would leave plugged in always, that was I don't damage the OBD port by constantly plugging in and unplugging the dongle. Is that right? If so, what kind?

Thanks for any and all suggestions.

As for the OBD dongle, why not just keep it connected? I've kept mine connected for almost 3 years now, and have only taken it out maybe 3 times to use on other people's cars.

Sorry, what I meant was that the total cost for me for the Leaf - before giving the dealership my Civic, but after factoring in the $7,500 federal tax credit - is $21,862. In other words, if I didn't have a car to trade in, the Leaf would cost me $21,862 in total (although the trade-in value of the Civic did knock about $1,000 off the sales tax, so the real total cost in the case of no trade-in would have been around $22.8K).

I certainly could keep the dongle connected, sure. I'm new to how all this works. I would like to run Leaf Spy at the same time as a program here in NY called Smart Charge, which also runs off the OBD port, because doing this is what makes my electricity rates so cheap.....
 
LeftieBiker said:
Unless they have power off capability, then the only really safe way to use them always plugged in is to re-wire the OBDII port plug pins to achieve port auto-power-off.

If the concern is safety/security, the blutooth antennae isn't powered when the car isn't "on". The power switch simply turns off blutooth when the car is on.
 
Oils4AsphaultOnly said:
LeftieBiker said:
Unless they have power off capability, then the only really safe way to use them always plugged in is to re-wire the OBDII port plug pins to achieve port auto-power-off.

If the concern is safety/security, the blutooth antennae isn't powered when the car isn't "on". The power switch simply turns off blutooth when the car is on.

The concern is mainly phantom drain on the 12 volt battery. That may be less an issue now than in older Leafs, but I wouldn't want to test that by waiting to see if the accessory battery dies if the car is left parked for several days or a week...
 
LeftieBiker said:
Oils4AsphaultOnly said:
LeftieBiker said:
Unless they have power off capability, then the only really safe way to use them always plugged in is to re-wire the OBDII port plug pins to achieve port auto-power-off.

If the concern is safety/security, the blutooth antennae isn't powered when the car isn't "on". The power switch simply turns off blutooth when the car is on.

The concern is mainly phantom drain on the 12 volt battery. That may be less an issue now than in older Leafs, but I wouldn't want to test that by waiting to see if the accessory battery dies if the car is left parked for several days or a week...

No worries. Already tested. Car was parked with the dongle plugged in for 10 days on my last trip. The OBD port is unpowered when the car is off.
 
Here are some numbers on the Leaf S Plus I purchased last week. I'm in Oregon with Portland General Electric as my power company. They have a $2500 rebate going on S Plus through 7/1/19 ($3500 on the S). Unfortunately, the dealer and NMAC discounts cannot be combined with PGE's incentive. In this deal the Nissan discounts were a better option.

The State of Oregon is running the Oregon Clean Vehicle Rebate Program with $2500 rebates for EVs. I found one dealer who could apply it directly at time of purchase. It's a simple form to complete though and I can float the cash for a few weeks during processing, so that ended up a non-factor in my decision.

MSRP: $37,445 (was shown $38,340 with wheel locks that weren’t even installed)
Total dealer discounts: -$3,132
NMAC Captive Cash: -$1,000 (0%, 36 months)
Nissan Holiday Bonus Cash: -$500
Dealer/Doc Fees: +$150
Registration, Title, and Excise Tax: +$581.07
Out the door Total Price: $33,554
Trade-in Value (2013 Honda Odyssey with 64,000 miles): -$10,780
Out the Door (after the trade-in): $22,764
Oregon Clean Vehicle Rebate Program: $2,500 (file myself after purchase)
Federal Tax Credit: $7,500 (adjusting withholdings now to put some of it in my pocket!)
Out of pocket, not considering trade: $23,544
My final out of pocket cost: $12,764


This was a big step, getting away from the minivan and into all-electric. The van's great a few weekends a year hauling stuff from Home Depot, and for camping trips into the mountains, but we plan to rent something if we really need it for those occasions. Driving a big empty van around town just felt bad, and the Leaf gets one or all of us everywhere we go 98% of the time. The larger battery also means we'll only need to two or three times per week for our use cases.

My workplace recently installed three level II ports, which sell power for $0.10/kwh. That's slightly cheaper than my $0.12/kwh retail rate at home. In February, our utility filed a program to offer $500 or $1000 rebates on residential level II equipment, self-installed or professionally installed respectively. When that comes into force, I'll put in a Juicebox or similar and look seriously at a time-of-use plan ($0.042/kwh offpeak).

Looking forward to the electric life, and for the OBDII dongle to get here from Amazon!!!
 
RandyInPortland said:
Here are some numbers on the Leaf S Plus I purchased last week. I'm in Oregon with Portland General Electric as my power company. They have a $2500 rebate going on S Plus through 7/1/19 ($3500 on the S). Unfortunately, the dealer and NMAC discounts cannot be combined with PGE's incentive. In this deal the Nissan discounts were a better option.

The State of Oregon is running the Oregon Clean Vehicle Rebate Program with $2500 rebates for EVs. I found one dealer who could apply it directly at time of purchase. It's a simple form to complete though and I can float the cash for a few weeks during processing, so that ended up a non-factor in my decision.

MSRP: $37,445 (was shown $38,340 with wheel locks that weren’t even installed)
Total dealer discounts: -$3,132
NMAC Captive Cash: -$1,000 (0%, 36 months)
Nissan Holiday Bonus Cash: -$500
Dealer/Doc Fees: +$150
Registration, Title, and Excise Tax: +$581.07
Out the door Total Price: $33,554
Trade-in Value (2013 Honda Odyssey with 64,000 miles): -$10,780
Out the Door (after the trade-in): $22,764
Oregon Clean Vehicle Rebate Program: $2,500 (file myself after purchase)
Federal Tax Credit: $7,500 (adjusting withholdings now to put some of it in my pocket!)
Out of pocket, not considering trade: $23,544
My final out of pocket cost: $12,764


This was a big step, getting away from the minivan and into all-electric. The van's great a few weekends a year hauling stuff from Home Depot, and for camping trips into the mountains, but we plan to rent something if we really need it for those occasions. Driving a big empty van around town just felt bad, and the Leaf gets one or all of us everywhere we go 98% of the time. The larger battery also means we'll only need to two or three times per week for our use cases.

My workplace recently installed three level II ports, which sell power for $0.10/kwh. That's slightly cheaper than my $0.12/kwh retail rate at home. In February, our utility filed a program to offer $500 or $1000 rebates on residential level II equipment, self-installed or professionally installed respectively. When that comes into force, I'll put in a Juicebox or similar and look seriously at a time-of-use plan ($0.042/kwh offpeak).

Looking forward to the electric life, and for the OBDII dongle to get here from Amazon!!!

Welcome to the borg ... I mean forest!

If you install a hitch receiver, you can do the home depot runs with the leaf too! Here's the thread: http://mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=27&t=13428
 
Will be picking up a new lease on a pearl white 40kWh 2019 Leaf SV tomorrow night for my wife. Turning in our 2016 Leaf SV lease.

Has added floor and cargo mats, splash guards, and front/rear clear bumper protectors.

Price includes all taxes and fees:
$3,000 down
$280/mo
36 month lease
12k/yr mileage allowance
=$13,080 total (before government/utility incentives)
-$2,500 CA rebate
-$800 PG&E utility rebate
=$9,780 net cost after all incentives

That's nearly the same price after inflation that we paid on the 2016 Leaf SV.

Of course we also get HOV stickers and 2 years of free L3 charging with EVgo.

Choices just keep getting better. Looking forward to trading up again in 3 years to something even sweeter.
 
It would be nice, but no, we don’t need it with our mild winters. And since the Leaf is the secondary vehicle, the 150 miles is a lot more than needed so inefficient resistance heating is ok.
 
Finally got the E+ SV

+Tech and weather package and a few things like carpets.

$38,430 + tax (essentially 31k after federal rebate) about 2k under invoice.

A substantially better equipped car then the 35k or 40k Tesla 3, and a bit cheaper with longer range. The semi autonomous driving is great.

Though it will come down, the range read 311 miles when picked up.
 
Congrats.


DougWantsALeaf said:
Finally got the E+ SV

+Tech and weather package and a few things like carpets.

$38,430 + tax (essentially 31k after federal rebate) about 2k under invoice.

A substantially better equipped car then the 35k or 40k Tesla 3, and a bit cheaper with longer range...

No on longer range. I paid $37k for my Model 3 SR+ a few months ago and it has more range than the E+ (SR+ 240 miles EPA vs. E+ 226 miles EPA).

True, since we get only half the federal tax credit, the final price is a bit higher. But this is our primary vehicle, so supercharging, though not a requirement, is a big plus. We go to visit family in SoCal in a few weeks and will put on >1200 miles round trip. This would be a PITA with our current 30kWh Leaf, very soon to have 40kWh Leaf, or even an E+.

Still good to have options, and one size does not fit all...

Going to pickup our secondary vehicle, my wife's newest daily driver, a 2019 40kWh Leaf SV on lease in a few hours.
 
Yeah, we are heavy sams club/Costco shoppers so we didn’t think it the 3 was going to do the jobs with 3 kids in the back and paper towel/tp runs.

No doubt it’s cool. The tech is certainly a bit better. Interesting, my boss has a 3 and an X 85. She tells me she is only getting about 190 miles on a charge on the X. She says the 3 long range does much better, upper 200s or 300 with gentle driving.

Alex onAutos did a petty level comparison on the 3 standard+ vs leaf vs Kona/niro range, and the leaf + was between the 3 and the Niro/Kona.

1 Day in, we have 70 miles on the car, about 60% freeway, and dash still showing 73% and 211 miles in the tank. Admittedly, it’s 73 degrees in Chicago today, so only some light AC beyond perfect efficiency weather.

Enjoy your car. It’s amazing how going from the 80 mile range on our 2013 to the new 62kW e+ makes you not even think about range any more.
 
Newbie here with first EV. Just purchased a used certified 2019 Leaf SV with 85 miles for $20K before taxes in a California dealership. Could you kindly help me understand if this a good/OK deal?
 
^^^
It's too late now. Not sure that it's that great a deal, esp. if you qualified for $2500 CVRP (https://cleanvehiclerebate.org/eng/eligibility-guidelines) and could qualify for the entire $7500 Federal tax credit. I don't know the going price for 40 kWh '19 Leaf SV but MSRP (https://usa.nissannews.com/en-US/releases/us-2019-nissan-leaf-press-kit under Pricing) which nobody should is $32,600, so take $10K off that. Take off some more $ given that there's no way they're selling for MSRP.
 
DougWantsALeaf said:
Finally got the E+ SV

+Tech and weather package and a few things like carpets.

$38,430 + tax (essentially 31k after federal rebate) about 2k under invoice.

A substantially better equipped car then the 35k or 40k Tesla 3, and a bit cheaper with longer range. The semi autonomous driving is great.

Though it will come down, the range read 311 miles when picked up.
Sounds very, very nice, so a big congrats! But did you really mean 311 for mileage? I thought range was more in the 220’s or so.
 
311 was the guess o meter from the factory (we ordered the car).

300+ miles on a charge is certainly possible in good weather, but only with very careful driving at slower speeds and gentle acceleration. You have to keep the car above 5 miles per kWh.

I plan to do a test in a couple weeks driving the car from north side of Chicago to Iowa city all hwy. Will report back how capable the car is post that trip.
 
DougWantsALeaf said:
311 was the guess o meter from the factory (we ordered the car).

300+ miles on a charge is certainly possible in good weather, but only with very careful driving at slower speeds and gentle acceleration. You have to keep the car above 5 miles per kWh.

I plan to do a test in a couple weeks driving the car from north side of Chicago to Iowa city all hwy. Will report back how capable the car is post that trip.
That would be amazing, and wonderful indeed. For me, 300+ miles of range was the minimum for an EV to be an ICE replacement, and I’ve spoken to others at EV meets who feel similarly. As that number becomes standard by more and more EV’s, I think the next hurdle will be 300+ miles in all weather conditions, especially winter rain and snow including heat. That would imply a likely 400-mile range in more average conditions, maybe more.
 
300 miles is at the early summer country roads at with a very gentle foot and limited additional weight scenario for the leaf plus. Short of living in Northern California or North Carolina, it would be difficult to do year round.

While I don’t consider myself a hyper miler, I am also at the 55mph limit on the hwy not the 70 that most do and I try to coast and time lights when not holding up traffic.

I think 100kWh (350-500 mile range) is where we will hit the magic trade off of diminishing returns to have a bigger battery vs cost/weight, so guessing in 3-4 years everyone settles there, except for trucks and sport cars.
 
Iplug,

The other hesitation I have with the 3 is repair costs. TFL (thrifty 3) has a good piece on some of the challenges. Guessing it will quickly mature in next 2-3 years, but 10k to repair a tail light and dented bumper, ouch. Guess this is an extreme example, and maybe less of an issue in CA, but still ouch.

https://www.tflcar.com/2019/06/the-nightmare-continues-this-is-how-much-it-costs-so-far-to-fix-our-tesla-model-3-thrifty-3-ep-11/
 
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