Tesla Charging Station Adapter?

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DFTBA said:
HerdingElectrons said:
I for one hope he's not banned because you might as well be in an authoritarian state if you like that sort of censorship. I prefer to allow people to read all of the viewpoints & then one can choose the side or position on any particular issue they want.

All right, let's dive into your viewpoint.
So, you consider SageBrush's off topic remarks and blatantly incorrect information a "viewpoint"? Do you consider SageBrush's antagonist writing, hostile attitude and attacks "viewpoints"? Do you consider SageBrush's snarky comments helpful? Do you prefer the toxic environment produced by this very young man? If so, why? Let's chat!

I do not prefer of any his "behavior" on this & other threads throughout this forum & his behavior is very different in other car forums so I find that anecdotal evidence personally curious but ultimately irrelevant.

I also do NOT agree with his POV & I believe he's maybe coming at this from a well intentioned perspective albeit a very narrow minded one IMO. Speaking from my experience he's either very young or extraordinary sheltered & no amount of internet banter is going to change that. It will take a paradigm shift within his personal sphere of influence to effect meaningful change to enable greater perspective beyond his current personal opinion &/or awareness.

Yes all that he has typed is plainly his viewpoint or else he would not have typed them. We as independent humans have the ability if we choose to discern from what we want to believe & what we don't. If the differing points of view are not allowed to be disseminated then this forum becomes yet another self serving echo chamber & the value of the information here plummets as a consequence.

If one is personally annoyed or offended he & anyone else can be ignored & the impact is minimal on yourself.

To summarize freedom of speech requires a great degree of tolerance of all parties to allow the speech no matter how much you disagree because there's certainly someone else out there with the complete opposite viewpoint of all of us.
 
SageBrush said:
Funny. Next you will be arguing that my salary used to buy a Tesla is paid for by other people's money so my car is actually their car.

I would prefer that you ask rather than project my perspective in the future. Also that's a very bizarre position to take & could be applied to ANY purchase of any vehicle much less any item of value that's held by a single entity which to me is utterly nonsensical.

That being said, if you are claiming the any of the tax benefits/rebates on a federal or state level then others are most certainly subsidizing the purchase of your car.

And if you are financially benefiting from the tax/rebates, then your position about non Tesla cars using a Tesla EVSE via an adapter with owner permission is very hypocritical in my opinion.
 
HerdingElectrons said:
Also that's a very bizarre position to take & could be applied to ANY purchase of any vehicle much less any item of value that's held by a single entity which to me is utterly nonsensical.
Indeed. That was my point. As was your ZEV credit argument.
 
@SageBrush

You are trying to say that two wrongs make a right. You most certainly do not have a clue why people have purchased a hack adapter.

I'm not saying that at all, don't put words in my mouth!

I'm saying that some Tesla owners are acting indignantly, yet have no problems with hogging public QCDC stations for hours themselves. I have no sympathy for those people. I hope you are not one of them, as that behavior is every bit as bad as what you are talking about.

For easy numbers, let's say that electricity costs $0.10 per kWh. A large pack on a Tesla can easily use $8 of electricity at that price for a single charge. Some Tesla owners are doing this multiple times a week. L2 abuse is even worse, committed by many EV owners.

Regarding your argument about this being about $

Let's assume that the hack adapter costs $500 and a non Tesla/Bolt/etc owner charges at Tesla EVSEs with it. That owner will likely transfer less than 20 kWh per charge, at a cost of $2 per. So, to break even on the cost of the hack adapter, that owner would have to fully charge his/her EV at least 250 times. For most people, that would be a two year payback...

Tell me again that this is only about stealing electricity to save $$$

EVSE etiquette, or lack thereof, is at the heart of this as well as a lack of charging infrastructure- whether you believe it or not.

People are buying these hack adapters because other charging options are unavailable, due to the jerks that are camping out at non Tesla EVSEs, and they see the hack adapter as a way of accessing more charging options.

There are only two fixes for this - more charging infrastructure and better etiquette from all EV owners.
 
Just last week, early in the morning, I went to to a park with 2 free L2 chargers. There was an event that day and every parking spot was taken. Two Teslas were parked and plugged in at the free chargers... this was early in the morning.
I left a note on both cars with my phone# to text me when they're done so that I could charge my car.
I really needed to charge, I had no other option if I wanted to go home.

I get two texts from to different numbers, one at 16:45 one at 16:55 saying "Done charging"
The park closed at 17:00

So those guys used the EV charging spot all day since parking in the park was full.

Luckily the guard let me plug in and leave my car (park had a gate) and gave me his cell # to call to pick up the car two hours later.
I got this service only because this place was owned by the same company I was there doing business with.

So it was not cool that they had their car plugged in from 9am to almost 5pm ... just because it was convenient to just leave the car there.
That's why Tesla is starting to charge a fee after the car is fully charged but still plugged in.

Regardless if it's a free station or not, they need to enforce time limit in EV charge parking spots and start ticketing EVs parked there after a time limit and also put a sign that non EVs will be towed.
 
valem said:
Just last week, early in the morning, I went to to a park with 2 free L2 chargers. There was an event that day and every parking spot was taken. Two Teslas were parked and plugged in at the free chargers... this was early in the morning.
I left a note on both cars with my phone# to text me when they're done so that I could charge my car.
I really needed to charge, I had no other option if I wanted to go home.

I get two texts from to different numbers, one at 16:45 one at 16:55 saying "Done charging"
The park closed at 17:00

So those guys used the EV charging spot all day since parking in the park was full.

Luckily the guard let me plug in and leave my car (park had a gate) and gave me his cell # to call to pick up the car two hours later.
I got this service only because this place was owned by the same company I was there doing business with.

So it was not cool that they had their car plugged in from 9am to almost 5pm ... just because it was convenient to just leave the car there.
That's why Tesla is starting to charge a fee after the car is fully charged but still plugged in.

Regardless if it's a free station or not, they need to enforce time limit in EV charge parking spots and start ticketing EVs parked there after a time limit and also put a sign that non EVs will be towed.

This is a great example of why I hate ‘free’ chargers.
I see two solutions. Charge a fee for parking at a charger based on time, not kWh. Charge for the entire time the car is parked in that spot, charging or not.
Or, you could charge for the time the car is parked there, but not actively charging. This makes the charging ‘free’ however is open to abuse as well.

It would be wonderful if everyone followed etiquette, but they don’t. So a set of rules to encourage it is required.
 
There are 3 free L2 chargers in my town, however at the train station.
I drove over there during a weekday and all 3 spots were full with EV’s.
The problem is, these car owners get there early on weekdays,plug in, take the train to Manhattan and don’t return until the evening. However, parking is not free during the week, so they have to pay that .
Weekend is free parking. I don’t think there is much one can do about it. Spots are available on weekends.

I will tell you, the wife and I went to a concert in northern NJ on Saturday evening, through an app I found 5 free chargers in a parking lot, free parking after 6pm. So I parked, charged, took the wife to dinner and the show, came out and was 98% charged. Can’t beat that.

I think in the long run we who own EV’s make out better dollar/cost wise than buying gasoline in the long run, even though we come across some charger hoggers.
 
SageBrush said:
Who paid for those stations ? I'll help you out here -- Tesla did. And in some but not all cases, Tesla also paid all or part of the installation costs.

Tesla also often paid for a J1772 at the same locations.

Of course, non-Tesla cars should never use those J1772 stations as well.
 
WetEV said:
SageBrush said:
Who paid for those stations ? I'll help you out here -- Tesla did. And in some but not all cases, Tesla also paid all or part of the installation costs.

Tesla also often paid for a J1772 at the same locations.

Of course, non-Tesla cars should never use those J1772 stations as well.
.
Time for you to learn something new:
Invited Vs no invited
 
SageBrush said:
WetEV said:
SageBrush said:
Who paid for those stations ? I'll help you out here -- Tesla did. And in some but not all cases, Tesla also paid all or part of the installation costs.

Tesla also often paid for a J1772 at the same locations.

Of course, non-Tesla cars should never use those J1772 stations as well.
.
Time for you to learn something new:
Invited Vs no invited

Got documentation on that?
 
TonyWilliams said:
1) Contrary to claims stated here, JDapter Stub™ has been vetted with Tesla prior to release

If this is the case, I fail to see why people keep arguing. If Tesla is ok with it and the site operators are not restricting access then that's pretty much "case closed" as far as I'm concerned.
 
Nubo said:
TonyWilliams said:
1) Contrary to claims stated here, JDapter Stub™ has been vetted with Tesla prior to release

If this is the case, I fail to see why people keep arguing. If Tesla is ok with it and the site operators are not restricting access then that's pretty much "case closed" as far as I'm concerned.

Excluding some Tesla owners that are Special.
 
alozzy said:
I don't use a hack adapter, I've never once charged from a Tesla EVSE. You've entirely missed my point...

For the few people using a hack adapter at a Tesla EVSE, there are many more Tesla owners charging far too long at public EVSEs. Those jerks are starting to tarnish the reputation of all Tesla owners, fair or not.

In other words, there are jerks in both camps and the jerks are starting to make everyone else jaded - it becomes a vicious cycle.

I'm not excusing the behavior, but I guarantee some of those people who bought the hack adapters were at least partly motivated by frustrations with Tesla owners and feel they are giving them a taste of their own medicine.
I don't practice or excuse poor charging etiquette, so you can put away your straw man and 'two wrongs make a right' arguments.
 
WetEV said:
SageBrush said:
I don't practice or excuse poor charging etiquette,
Tesla drivers have more rights than other drivers.
If by that you mean a vastly better car and a vastly better charging network and a vastly better company, we agree !
 
SageBrush said:
If by that you mean a vastly better car and a vastly better charging network and a vastly better company, we agree !

A vastly better charging network because Tesla uses everyone else's networks as well. For parking as well as charging.

What is yours is yours, what isn't you will share. As long as you get a Tesla sized share.

It's really amusing getting to a DCQC and finding a Tesla parked, not plugged in, blocking the station.
 
SageBrush said:
If by that you mean a vastly better car and a vastly better charging network and a vastly better company, we agree !

A vastly better charging network because Tesla uses everyone else's networks as well.

What is yours is yours, what isn't you might share. As long as you get a Tesla sized share.

It's really amusing getting to come back to an L2 and finding a Tesla driver has unplugged your car and is charging.

I just love the attitude of Tesla drivers.
 
SageBrush said:
alozzy said:
I don't use a hack adapter, I've never once charged from a Tesla EVSE. You've entirely missed my point...

For the few people using a hack adapter at a Tesla EVSE, there are many more Tesla owners charging far too long at public EVSEs. Those jerks are starting to tarnish the reputation of all Tesla owners, fair or not.

In other words, there are jerks in both camps and the jerks are starting to make everyone else jaded - it becomes a vicious cycle.

I'm not excusing the behavior, but I guarantee some of those people who bought the hack adapters were at least partly motivated by frustrations with Tesla owners and feel they are giving them a taste of their own medicine.
I don't practice or excuse poor charging etiquette, so you can put away your straw man and 'two wrongs make a right' arguments.

Dredging that up again, are you? See here: https://mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=27&t=26623&start=40#p537719, where I said:

People are buying these hack adapters because other charging options are unavailable, due to the jerks that are camping out at non Tesla EVSEs, and they see the hack adapter as a way of accessing more charging options.

There are only two fixes for this - more charging infrastructure and better etiquette from all EV owners.

With more big battery EVs on the road now, and more EVs in general, the lineups at public EVSEs have recently gotten much worse and often last all day long. Patience is in short supply in this world, so it's inevitable that people will look for a way to cheat the lineups.

However, you seem to think that the most plausible explanation why people would spend hundreds for a hack adapter is so they can steal electricity from Tesla. Anyone who is that spend thrift would most certainly do the payback period math and realize it's not worth it!

So, I'm not interested in an irrelevant ethical debate with you - I neither condone nor advocate that people should buy a hack adapter. You keep trying to make me feel guilty, like I'm somehow complicit:

That is your justification for using a hack adapter ? Really ?!
You are trying to say that two wrongs make a right
I don't practice or excuse poor charging etiquette, so you can put away your straw man and 'two wrongs make a right' arguments

Get off your high horse!

If public EVSEs were as ubiquitous at gas stations, the only people who would buy hack adapters would be irrational Telsa haters, just looking to stick it to Tesla regardless of the cost.
 
Why do so many conversations on this site devolve into moral /ownership justification battles. This is yours/ mine stupidity reminds me of the "possession" games we used to play as kids. "Don't step on MY grass in front of my house!", "That is MY ball, and you cannot touch it!"

The reality is that adapters for different systems are here. They are not illegal. If you can find a charging station that is not being used, then use it. End of story!!!! After all, what good is a charging station that is not being used? There are too many of those around, and using them will be the only way to get more.
 
" I neither condone nor advocate that people should buy a hack adapter."
Good

I could not care less why people buy hack adapters. My simple point is that it is unethical to use them at Tesla destination EVSEs because those installations were paid for by Tesla (and by extension, Tesla owners) for use by Tesla owners. Moreover, Tesla has taken steps to prevent the use of hack adapters. Those actions may be only partially successful but it should leave no doubt about Tesla intent for who uses the EVSE.

Notice in this sign that hack adapters are not invited.

uc
 
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