Tesla Charging Station Adapter?

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powersurge said:
If you can find a charging station that is not being used, then use it.
Is the EVSE you have at home listed on plugshare, available for unrestricted use by all, anytime ?
Is it your view that EVERY private EVSE must be available to anybody, anytime ? Do you extend that view to all personal property ?

If not, you are just peddling in hypocrisy.
 
SageBrush said:
" I neither condone nor advocate that people should buy a hack adapter."
Good

I could not care less why people buy hack adapters. My simple point is that it is unethical to use them at Tesla destination EVSEs because those installations were paid for by Tesla (and by extension, Tesla owners) for use by Tesla owners. Moreover, Tesla has taken steps to prevent the use of hack adapters. Those actions may be only partially successful but it should leave no doubt about Tesla intent for who uses the EVSE.

Notice in this sign that hack adapters are not invited.

uc

If we assume you are talking about Level 2 charging, then the chargers actually belong to the property owners. It doesn't matter whether Tesla provided the unit free of charge or not. You should ask the owner's permission first, but there's no reason not use the charger if the owner allows it. It's their electricity you're using.
 
johnlocke said:
If we assume you are talking about Level 2 charging, then the chargers actually belong to the property owners. It doesn't matter whether Tesla provided the unit free of charge or not.
.
What makes you so sure ?
E.g., can the business take the provided equipment and put it on Ebay ?
Can the business take the equipment and decide not to use it at all ?
Can the business charge for the electricity ?

I'm just about positive that the business agrees to not charge for electricity so clearly Tesla binds the business to restrictions in return for free equipment (and often free money to cover installation costs.) Rather clearly, the business owner does NOT have free reign to do as they please.
 
I sent an email to Tesla's destination charging dept asking
I am aware that 3rd party vendors of Tesla -> J1772 adapters are available for purchase.
What is Tesla's position regarding use of these adapters at destination chargers provided by Tesla to businesses ?

Tesla responded
Thank you for reaching out. Tesla does not support any 3rd party products that interface with our equipment and if something does not work properly, there’s nothing we can do from a service perspective to assist. Since some non-Tesla EVs to 20kW and the popularly-sold adapter cannot limit the current to 50A (which is its max), there’s a high likelihood that the adapter will melt if used it on a station outputting more than 50A, which is a high percentage of our locations with Wall Connectors, as our stations have an 80A output and most Destination Charging sites have multiple stations sharing 100A breakers.

Beyond this, it’s worth noting that the majority of our Destination Charging locations have some form of J1772 charging available alongside of our Wall Connectors that was provided by our program. These range from GE, Clipper Creek, and even some Tesla-branded J1772 stations. This has been a good faith offering that we’ve made with most host properties to allow them to serve all EVs, not just Tesla vehicles. The property at which these stations are installed are owned by the property and they also pay for the electricity. The stipulation of the program is that charging is to be free for paying customers of said business, though some properties are offering free charging to the public; it’s their choice to make. We recommend utilizing Plugshare to verify sites with J1772 available.

We have also started deploying Wall Connectors that are Tesla-only, meaning if the units do not ‘read’ a Tesla vehicle on the other end, it will not charge, and the adapter would be rendered useless.

If you do choose to visit a Destination Charging location, we strongly urge that you opt to use any available J1772 station(s) that we’ve provided and to leave the Tesla Wall Connectors available for Tesla drivers first and foremost. If the Wall Connectors there are on any breaker higher than 50A (which is the strong majority) and don’t happen to be Tesla-only, it’s likely that these adapters would melt and cause significant damage to the adapter, Wall Connector, and possibly even the vehicle.

Destination Charging Team

I take this answer to mean, amongst other things, that Tony's assertion that his hack adapter is "vetted" by Tesla is hogwash and is false advertising. My next step is to inform Tesla and the owner of this forum of his posts and advertising.
 
SageBrush said:
I sent an email to Tesla's destination charging dept asking
I am aware that 3rd party vendors of Tesla -> J1772 adapters are available for purchase.
What is Tesla's position regarding use of these adapters at destination chargers provided by Tesla to businesses ?

Tesla responded
Thank you for reaching out. Tesla does not support any 3rd party products that interface with our equipment and if something does not work properly, there’s nothing we can do from a service perspective to assist. Since some non-Tesla EVs to 20kW and the popularly-sold adapter cannot limit the current to 50A (which is its max), there’s a high likelihood that the adapter will melt if used it on a station outputting more than 50A, which is a high percentage of our locations with Wall Connectors, as our stations have an 80A output and most Destination Charging sites have multiple stations sharing 100A breakers.

Beyond this, it’s worth noting that the majority of our Destination Charging locations have some form of J1772 charging available alongside of our Wall Connectors that was provided by our program. These range from GE, Clipper Creek, and even some Tesla-branded J1772 stations. This has been a good faith offering that we’ve made with most host properties to allow them to serve all EVs, not just Tesla vehicles. The property at which these stations are installed are owned by the property and they also pay for the electricity. The stipulation of the program is that charging is to be free for paying customers of said business, though some properties are offering free charging to the public; it’s their choice to make. We recommend utilizing Plugshare to verify sites with J1772 available.

We have also started deploying Wall Connectors that are Tesla-only, meaning if the units do not ‘read’ a Tesla vehicle on the other end, it will not charge, and the adapter would be rendered useless.

If you do choose to visit a Destination Charging location, we strongly urge that you opt to use any available J1772 station(s) that we’ve provided and to leave the Tesla Wall Connectors available for Tesla drivers first and foremost. If the Wall Connectors there are on any breaker higher than 50A (which is the strong majority) and don’t happen to be Tesla-only, it’s likely that these adapters would melt and cause significant damage to the adapter, Wall Connector, and possibly even the vehicle.

Destination Charging Team

I take this answer to mean, amongst other things, that Tony's assertion that his hack adapter is "vetted" by Tesla is hogwash and is false advertising. My next step is to inform Tesla and the owner of this forum of his posts and advertising.

I'm not sure I understand the technical explanation Tesla provided. Not an expert here but is there not some communication between the car and the EVSE on max current. Take our smart EV for example. One of our favorite wineries has a Tesla destination charger. He installed it and didn't know that not all EV's have the same charge port. So we visit him from time to time and stock up. Because it is over the halfway point on the battery we usually text him and check to see his station is up and running. (Always is.). Off we go and hook up. No problems with heat etc. Seems to work good.

Off topic, I believe he is replacing the destination charger with a pair of FLO chargers on the same circuit. He'll be able to provide service to two vehicles this way.

26348605619_8b105bd840_c.jpg
 
What is for Tesla cars is for Tesla cars.

Everything else we share. As long as the Tesla cars get more than their share.

I just love the privileged attitude.
 
SageBrush said:
I sent an email to Tesla's destination charging dept asking
I am aware that 3rd party vendors of Tesla -> J1772 adapters are available for purchase.
What is Tesla's position regarding use of these adapters at destination chargers provided by Tesla to businesses ?

Tesla responded
Thank you for reaching out. Tesla does not support any 3rd party products that interface with our equipment and if something does not work properly, there’s nothing we can do from a service perspective to assist. Since some non-Tesla EVs to 20kW and the popularly-sold adapter cannot limit the current to 50A (which is its max), there’s a high likelihood that the adapter will melt if used it on a station outputting more than 50A, which is a high percentage of our locations with Wall Connectors, as our stations have an 80A output and most Destination Charging sites have multiple stations sharing 100A breakers.

Beyond this, it’s worth noting that the majority of our Destination Charging locations have some form of J1772 charging available alongside of our Wall Connectors that was provided by our program. These range from GE, Clipper Creek, and even some Tesla-branded J1772 stations. This has been a good faith offering that we’ve made with most host properties to allow them to serve all EVs, not just Tesla vehicles. The property at which these stations are installed are owned by the property and they also pay for the electricity. The stipulation of the program is that charging is to be free for paying customers of said business, though some properties are offering free charging to the public; it’s their choice to make. We recommend utilizing Plugshare to verify sites with J1772 available.

We have also started deploying Wall Connectors that are Tesla-only, meaning if the units do not ‘read’ a Tesla vehicle on the other end, it will not charge, and the adapter would be rendered useless.

If you do choose to visit a Destination Charging location, we strongly urge that you opt to use any available J1772 station(s) that we’ve provided and to leave the Tesla Wall Connectors available for Tesla drivers first and foremost. If the Wall Connectors there are on any breaker higher than 50A (which is the strong majority) and don’t happen to be Tesla-only, it’s likely that these adapters would melt and cause significant damage to the adapter, Wall Connector, and possibly even the vehicle.

Destination Charging Team

I take this answer to mean, amongst other things, that Tony's assertion that his hack adapter is "vetted" by Tesla is hogwash and is false advertising. My next step is to inform Tesla and the owner of this forum of his posts and advertising.
So Tesla says that their charging stations are capable of supplying more than 50 amps. Leafs are internally limited to 27.5 amps for the 7.2KW charger. They won't support 3rd party products with technical support or service problems. Tesla is now providing new installations with Tesla only chargers that won't service other brands. Tesla requires property owners to allow paying customers to charge for free.

What Tesla didn't say is that you couldn't use their chargers if you have another brand of car. It might not be safe in their opinion but they won't explicitly forbid it either. It would appear to be up to the property owner's discretion whether you could charge a car other than a Tesla there.
 
WetEV said:
What is for Tesla cars is for Tesla cars.

Everything else we share. As long as the Tesla cars get more than their share.

I just love the privileged attitude.

A private company provides hardware to another private company to service their mutual customers.
Somehow you think people that aren't customers should be able to charge using a third party adapter and you think THEY have a privileged attitude???
 
Zythryn said:
WetEV said:
What is for Tesla cars is for Tesla cars.

Everything else we share. As long as the Tesla cars get more than their share.

I just love the privileged attitude.

A private company provides hardware to another private company to service their mutual customers.
Somehow you think people that aren't customers should be able to charge using a third party adapter and you think THEY have a privileged attitude???

Backwards.

If Tesla wants Tesla only charging stations, fine, then Tesla drivers need to use those stations, and not the limited public charging. Especially when they misuse the public charging, for parking spots and unplugging cars that are charging.

"What's mine is mine, what is yours we will share." Doesn't that attitude bother you?

Or think about this. You arrive late at night at a hotel in a non-Tesla electric, and there are two charging stations. A J1772 with a Tesla charging, and a Tesla only station that is vacant.
 
WetEV said:
Zythryn said:
WetEV said:
What is for Tesla cars is for Tesla cars.

Everything else we share. As long as the Tesla cars get more than their share.

I just love the privileged attitude.

A private company provides hardware to another private company to service their mutual customers.
Somehow you think people that aren't customers should be able to charge using a third party adapter and you think THEY have a privileged attitude???

Backwards.

If Tesla wants Tesla only charging stations, fine, then Tesla drivers need to use those stations, and not the limited public charging. Especially when they misuse the public charging, for parking spots and unplugging cars that are charging.

"What's mine is mine, what is yours we will share." Doesn't that attitude bother you?...

That attitude would bother me, if I saw anyone exhibiting it.
The analogy would be more accurate like this: “what’s mine is mine, what’s public property I can use.”


I do agree with you that it is very troubling to see anyone misusing charging spots. Try to separate that from the issue at hand though. Abuse of charging spots is in no way limited to Tesla owners.
 
Zythryn said:
WetEV said:
If Tesla wants Tesla only charging stations, fine, then Tesla drivers need to use those stations, and not the limited public charging. Especially when they misuse the public charging, for parking spots and unplugging cars that are charging.

"What's mine is mine, what is yours we will share." Doesn't that attitude bother you?...

Or think about this. You arrive late at night at a hotel in a non-Tesla electric, and there are two charging stations. A J1772 with a Tesla charging, and a Tesla only station that is vacant.

That attitude would bother me, if I saw anyone exhibiting it.
The analogy would be more accurate like this: “what’s mine is mine, what’s public property I can use.”

Both stations are not truly "public" property. The property is owned by the hotel. The power bill is paid by the hotel. You pay the hotel for a room and a charge.

Except you don't get the charge. You are OK with that, right?
 
WetEV said:
Zythryn said:
WetEV said:
What is for Tesla cars is for Tesla cars.

Everything else we share. As long as the Tesla cars get more than their share.

I just love the privileged attitude.

A private company provides hardware to another private company to service their mutual customers.
Somehow you think people that aren't customers should be able to charge using a third party adapter and you think THEY have a privileged attitude???

Backwards.

If Tesla wants Tesla only charging stations, fine, then Tesla drivers need to use those stations, and not the limited public charging. Especially when they misuse the public charging, for parking spots and unplugging cars that are charging.

"What's mine is mine, what is yours we will share." Doesn't that attitude bother you?

Or think about this. You arrive late at night at a hotel in a non-Tesla electric, and there are two charging stations. A J1772 with a Tesla charging, and a Tesla only station that is vacant.

Happened to us last year at predator ridge.

]
24302024558_c70e11972f_c.jpg
 
Abuse of charging spots is in no way limited to Tesla owners.

True, it's not just Telsa owners. However, up until recently, they have most often been the abusers. Now that other large pack EVs are showing up at chargers, those owners are likewise charging for far too long, keeping other people waiting. For whatever reason, at least in Vancouver, Bolt owners are generally more accommodating.

The real problem is with the attitude that "I'm going to get my 20% to 90% charge in", regardless of the pack size. As we all know, a 100 kWh Tesla pack, using a 50 kWh DC charger, is going to take well over an hour to get a 70% SOC pull, whereas a 24 kWh LEAF is going to do the same thing in 20 mins.

If L3 EVSEs were programmed to cap the charging time to 1hr, that would be ideal. It could also be programmed to allow the same car (VIN tracking) to charge again after a 15 minute wait, so that if there is no lineup then that owner can keep charging.

Fortunately, the early adopters generally have a decent amount of patience, but I worry about when EVs are more the norm and some of the less patient types start to wage war at charging stations. This really needs to be fixed ASAP, it's been a problem for too long already.
 
WetEV said:
Zythryn said:
WetEV said:
If Tesla wants Tesla only charging stations, fine, then Tesla drivers need to use those stations, and not the limited public charging. Especially when they misuse the public charging, for parking spots and unplugging cars that are charging.

"What's mine is mine, what is yours we will share." Doesn't that attitude bother you?...

Or think about this. You arrive late at night at a hotel in a non-Tesla electric, and there are two charging stations. A J1772 with a Tesla charging, and a Tesla only station that is vacant.

That attitude would bother me, if I saw anyone exhibiting it.
The analogy would be more accurate like this: “what’s mine is mine, what’s public property I can use.”

Both stations are not truly "public" property. The property is owned by the hotel. The power bill is paid by the hotel. You pay the hotel for a room and a charge.

Except you don't get the charge. You are OK with that, right?

Public chargers are just that, PUBLIC! Anyone is free to use them including Tesla owners. Do you think Blink or EVGO cares about who charges what. They just want their money for providing a service. It might be rude for a Tesla owner to use a non Tesla charger IF there is a vacant one nearby. Are you going to blame the Bolt owner for charging for over an hour as well? How about the Lyft driver who charges twice a day because he has a NCTC card and gets the power for free? If Tesla installs chargers for the convenience of their customers, that's a Tesla perk and adds value. Did you ever consider that when the Tesla pulled up the Tesla charger could have been occupied? Did that hotel charge you explicitly for charging or was it a convenience feature? Or do you think that the hotel pool is for your exclusive use too?
 
webeleafowners said:
WetEV said:
Zythryn said:
A private company provides hardware to another private company to service their mutual customers.
Somehow you think people that aren't customers should be able to charge using a third party adapter and you think THEY have a privileged attitude???

Backwards.

If Tesla wants Tesla only charging stations, fine, then Tesla drivers need to use those stations, and not the limited public charging. Especially when they misuse the public charging, for parking spots and unplugging cars that are charging.

"What's mine is mine, what is yours we will share." Doesn't that attitude bother you?

Or think about this. You arrive late at night at a hotel in a non-Tesla electric, and there are two charging stations. A J1772 with a Tesla charging, and a Tesla only station that is vacant.

Happened to us last year at predator ridge.

]
24302024558_c70e11972f_c.jpg
There may be more than meets the eye in many of these cases.

I've seen this scenario several times before, but in 2 cases saw it play out from the beginning, and there was no foul play. A Tesla arrived and plugged into a J-1772 when other nearby charging stations were already occupied.

For someone arriving later when other charing parties had already departed, seeing the Tesla charging on a J-1772 and a Tesla destination charger open would convey an inaccurate picture of what transpired.
 
iPlug said:
For someone arriving later when other charing parties had already departed, seeing the Tesla charging on a J-1772 and a Tesla destination charger open would convey an inaccurate picture of what transpired.
It almost goes without saying that the Tesla owner had a fair reason to use the J1772 EVSE since it would be more hassle and probably slower than a well functioning, available Tesla EVSE.

WetEV has issues.
 
johnlocke said:
WetEV said:
Zythryn said:
That attitude would bother me, if I saw anyone exhibiting it.
The analogy would be more accurate like this: “what’s mine is mine, what’s public property I can use.”

Both stations are not truly "public" property. The property is owned by the hotel. The power bill is paid by the hotel. You pay the hotel for a room and a charge.

Except you don't get the charge. You are OK with that, right?

Public chargers are just that, PUBLIC! Anyone is free to use them including Tesla owners. Do you think Blink or EVGO cares about who charges what. They just want their money for providing a service. It might be rude for a Tesla owner to use a non Tesla charger IF there is a vacant one nearby. Are you going to blame the Bolt owner for charging for over an hour as well? How about the Lyft driver who charges twice a day because he has a NCTC card and gets the power for free? If Tesla installs chargers for the convenience of their customers, that's a Tesla perk and adds value. Did you ever consider that when the Tesla pulled up the Tesla charger could have been occupied? Did that hotel charge you explicitly for charging or was it a convenience feature? Or do you think that the hotel pool is for your exclusive use too?

"It might be rude for a Tesla owner to use a non Tesla charger IF there is a vacant one nearby." Yea, you noticed.
 
I think that this whole issue of who owns a charger is ridiculous. Most public charging including chargepoint is free. The end result of using chargers that are not locked behind a gate is that people will use them, and by extension, more EVs will be made and bought.

We gain nothing by arguing who owns the land, the equipment, or the electricity.
 
WetEV said:
johnlocke said:
WetEV said:
Both stations are not truly "public" property. The property is owned by the hotel. The power bill is paid by the hotel. You pay the hotel for a room and a charge.

Except you don't get the charge. You are OK with that, right?

Public chargers are just that, PUBLIC! Anyone is free to use them including Tesla owners. Do you think Blink or EVGO cares about who charges what. They just want their money for providing a service. It might be rude for a Tesla owner to use a non Tesla charger IF there is a vacant one nearby. Are you going to blame the Bolt owner for charging for over an hour as well? How about the Lyft driver who charges twice a day because he has a NCTC card and gets the power for free? If Tesla installs chargers for the convenience of their customers, that's a Tesla perk and adds value. Did you ever consider that when the Tesla pulled up the Tesla charger could have been occupied? Did that hotel charge you explicitly for charging or was it a convenience feature? Or do you think that the hotel pool is for your exclusive use too?

"It might be rude for a Tesla owner to use a non Tesla charger IF there is a vacant one nearby." Yea, you noticed.
You are complaining because Tesla owners have more options than you do. Would you still complain if the Tesla charger didn't exist at all? Tesla was the only company with the foresight to set up a charging network. Now Volkswagen is doing it only under duress. Nissan has done little to nothing to add to the network. If the Tesla chargers can output significantly more current then why would a Tesla owner plug into a lower current charger unless the Tesla charger was occupied? You claim that someone disconnected you at public station. You do realize that there is a lock feature on the charge port. It is not unreasonable for someone to disconnect you after your charge session has ended.
 
powersurge said:
I think that this whole issue of who owns a charger is ridiculous. Most public charging including chargepoint is free. .

Huh,

Not in this area it's the opposite and the city of SF changed all city paid parking garages from free to paid charging a while ago.
 
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