2019 "60 kWh" Leaf e-Plus

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DougWantsALeaf said:
Ok,

Here is my latest thought on the quarterly adjustments. Safe Harbor warning, no science or methodology sits behinds this hypothesis.

My guess is that Nissan is quarterly tuning the amount of buffer, and with it bringing down the SoH reported to reduce the speed of degradation of the battery. In doing so, the battery post tuning is under reporting true remaining SoH. Then as the battery ages, if the battery underneath stays flatter, it can give back a little of the capacity in line with their internal model. In this way, it can help de-risk its potential battery replacements (under the 8 year / 70% warranty...same as Tesla) as well as help consumers maintain the best battery possible given their usage habits. Almost like how Tesla will throttle back supercharing on cars if its done too much to protect the brand, this is Nissan's way of doing it.

All anecdotal. We are coming up on the 1 year anniversary of our car, and it is doing well. Battery is at 95.67% and I should know in a few days if that is pre or post the last adjustment.

I am thinking the same but the real question becomes what actions cause the adjustment to be more favorable?

I just had my 2nd adjustment on the Plus but had several on the 40 kwh pack and no real conclusions presented here, only observations.

My biggest adjustments came with lighter driving needs including 4 times when charging was more than ¾ DC but only charging 2-3 times a week. This was same for both packs.

Smaller adjustments happens when I drove more.

Increases happened when I drove the most and DC'd a lot frequently 2-3 times in a day. BUT this was a mix as I had one go up, one was a medium down and two adjustments simply didn't happen.

So on my Plus;

First 90 days, relatively light driving (got car mid Nov) nearly all DC charging (did plug into Volta a few hours every time I went to see a movie so maybe 8-10 of those sessions) but the rest was DC (still had NCTC) and those sessions only happened 2-3 times a week. Pack temps spent most of their time in 40's and 50's. A 30-40 minute charge session at 120-124 amps (no knee) would yield temps that sometimes hit the mid 70's.

But that gentleness yielded my largest ever adjustment; 4.15 ahr drop, 2.45% SOH.

2nd 90 days; Pretty much same as above with less movies (obviously) and a lot more driving in last 30 days with DC events bumping to 4 or 5 times per week (one a day for 4 day workweek and occasionally once during 3 day weekend)

Adjustment was "high normal" losing 2.38 ahr, 1.29% SOH.

In the current quarter; I will be doing mostly AC charging at home with target SOC of 75% (I actually hit 76% 3 days in a row...)

I am hoping the pattern holds up after my current work project ends (which is accounting for all the extra driving) the assignments are offered weekly so no real idea how long they will continue but based on our Governor's latest announcements of a tiered "back to the new normal" life, I am guessing at least another 2-4 weeks?

So we shall see.
 
Just got my quarterly adjustment as well, SoH and AHr increases :eek: 92.23% --> 93.13%, 162.694 --> 164.281 respectfully.

I continue to predominantly used DC charging.

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Ok, I just went through my last 90 day adjustment.

The step down was from 95.63% to 95.37%.

While not happy to lose the quarter percent, it’s better than the last two where I lost more than a full % each time. My car was manufactured in May 2019, so it makes sense that this is the 4th 90 day adjustment.

Now the question is, will 95% be the settling down zone for the likely slow decline? This quarter, I haven’t done as many miles (lockdown) as prior quarters, so not sure if that figures into the Nissan algorithm.
 
DougWantsALeaf said:
Ok, I just went through my last 90 day adjustment.

The step down was from 95.63% to 95.37%.

While not happy to lose the quarter percent, it’s better than the last two where I lost more than a full % each time. My car was manufactured in May 2019, so it makes sense that this is the 4th 90 day adjustment.

Now the question is, will 95% be the settling down zone for the likely slow decline? This quarter, I haven’t done as many miles (lockdown) as prior quarters, so not sure if that figures into the Nissan algorithm.

Are you checking daily? Cause your adjustment could simply be the normal drop between adjustments if you aren't. As far as how many adjustments? I don't think there is much of a consensus on that. Some only 3, I had 5 (bad ones) a lot had 4 but all these were 40 kwh packs. I don't see any reason to think the 62 kwh packs will act differently so I have to say... I'll get back you in about 91 days ;)
 
Yes, I have been checking daily for the last 30+ days as I knew within a couple weeks when my last adjustment (of 1.3%) happened. In the week seen 2 days where I lost .01 which was a bit higher then the few weeks prior when I was losing .01 ever 10 days or so.
 
DougWantsALeaf said:
Yes, I have been checking daily for the last 30+ days as I knew within a couple weeks when my last adjustment (of 1.3%) happened. In the week seen 2 days where I lost .01 which was a bit higher then the few weeks prior when I was losing .01 ever 10 days or so.

Well, that is very encouraging. My first adjustment was over 3½% but the 2nd one was only a smidge above 1¼%. If the next adjustment follows the trend and is similar to yours, that would be "acceptable"
 
About 3 weeks ago, I saw a .07 loss over the course of a week, and was hopeful that was the adjustment. The good news is that I now have the exact day to track for watching for the step changes.

The .26% was an overnight change....but I checked today, and it dropped another .14%, so total adjustment is now .4% Still not horrible, but "less good".I will give it another couple days to see if the adjustment is complete.
 
My fifth adjustment finished recently, and was by far the smallest yet. I've had my Leaf+ for a little over a year now and have just under 15K miles on the odometer, and am at 95.5% SOH according to LeafSpy.

Adjustments and weeks from ownership:
8 week 1 aHr
20 week 1.3 aHr
33 week 1.37 aHr (I probably just didn't catch this one exactly when it happened)
44 week 0.25 aHr
56 week 0.05 aHr
 
Astros said:
My fifth adjustment finished recently, and was by far the smallest yet. I've had my Leaf+ for a little over a year now and have just under 15K miles on the odometer, and am at 95.5% SOH according to LeafSpy.

Adjustments and weeks from ownership:
8 week 1 aHr
20 week 1.3 aHr
33 week 1.37 aHr (I probably just didn't catch this one exactly when it happened)
44 week 0.25 aHr
56 week 0.05 aHr

This does indicate some considerable progress from the 40 kwh pack.
 
DaveinOlyWA said:
Astros said:
My fifth adjustment finished recently, and was by far the smallest yet. I've had my Leaf+ for a little over a year now and have just under 15K miles on the odometer, and am at 95.5% SOH according to LeafSpy.

Adjustments and weeks from ownership:
8 week 1 aHr
20 week 1.3 aHr
33 week 1.37 aHr (I probably just didn't catch this one exactly when it happened)
44 week 0.25 aHr
56 week 0.05 aHr

This does indicate some considerable progress from the 40 kwh pack.

For comparison, here were the stats for my 40kWh Leaf when I traded it in:
13,500 miles with 95.69% SOH, driven on roughly the same trips/commute, though the battery pack at times got MUCH hotter.
5 weeks 0.85 aHr
17 week 0.4 aHr
29 week 1.0 aHr
41 week 0.0 aHr

So in my case, at least, the two batteries have had very similar degradation. The 40kWh battery was just a bit worse, but our longer trips were harder on it than on the larger battery since it heated up so much more with repeated fast charging.
 
DougWantsALeaf said:
It doesn’t seem like heat is nearly as bad on the newer chemistry.

Well it won't because the Plus pack has more cells. Its like taking a space heater used for heating a room and trying to heat the house. The house will get warmer but not very much and not very fast. The reality is we are charging 2019 batteries with 2010 technology in most cases.

If you are lucky enough to be near the faster EA stations, you get a break. The rest get 120 amps...
 
DougWantsALeaf said:
It doesn’t seem like heat is nearly as bad on the newer chemistry.
Are you talking about apparent capacity loss?

If so, Leaf Plus hasn't been out nearly long enough. It took (IIRC), two summers in hot clients for '11 and '12 Leafs to show capacity loss in the form of capacity bars gone. Back then, Leaf Spy didn't exist.

Leaf Plus has been shipping not much more than a year and Leaf in the US has been getting its butt kicked by Tesla in terms of EV sales. And, many more EV/PHEV choices are on the market now than back then.
 
cwerdna said:
DougWantsALeaf said:
It doesn’t seem like heat is nearly as bad on the newer chemistry.
Are you talking about apparent capacity loss?

If so, Leaf Plus hasn't been out nearly long enough. It took (IIRC), two summers in hot clients for '11 and '12 Leafs to show capacity loss in the form of capacity bars gone. Back then, Leaf Spy didn't exist.

Leaf Plus has been shipping not much more than a year and Leaf in the US has been getting its butt kicked by Tesla in terms of EV sales. And, many more EV/PHEV choices are on the market now than back then.

think he is referring to how hot the pack gets when quick charging
 
cwerdna said:
DougWantsALeaf said:
It doesn’t seem like heat is nearly as bad on the newer chemistry.
Are you talking about apparent capacity loss?

If so, Leaf Plus hasn't been out nearly long enough. It took (IIRC), two summers in hot clients for '11 and '12 Leafs to show capacity loss in the form of capacity bars gone. Back then, Leaf Spy didn't exist.

Leaf Plus has been shipping not much more than a year and Leaf in the US has been getting its butt kicked by Tesla in terms of EV sales. And, many more EV/PHEV choices are on the market now than back then.

My 2011 dropped down to 10 capacity bars after about 12 months and down to 8 bars after a little over 2 years. The 2015 was MUCH better, but was at 8 bars with several weak cells when I traded it in after 4-1/2 years and 82,436 miles. It is too soon to tell for the 2019, but initial indications for the 62 kWh battery look fairly good based on Leaf Spy readings after 9 months and 16,185 miles: AHr=171.35, SOH=97.15%, HX=111.52% (initial readings on 8/11/2019 at 64 miles were 175.15, 99.29%, and 98.19% respectively). (171.35/175.15)*100=97.8% of original capacity. The first two 90-day adjustments were small increases, but the last one was a decrease in April. That decrease may be due to fewer miles per day with less freeway driving and more days between charges since I started teleworking in early March.
 
Well this is not the adjustment I had hoped for. Battery has been stable for 2 days now, at 94.66%, which is 1 full percent lower..ouch.

The battery took 3 days for the adjustment.

Pre adjustment: 95.63%

5/14 95.37%
5/15 95.27%
5/16 94.66%
5/17. 94.66%

I had no charges to 100%, 0 fast charges and maybe 1000 miles since the last adjustment due to lockdown.

So confounded to say the least. Let’s see how the summer goes.
 
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