Requesting Hx values for all 40/62 kwh LEAFers

Yes, no quick charges yet. Low activity in part due to pandemic restrictions.
However never seen anybody else report such a signficant drop in SOH on 1st major adjustment. I am quite concerned, especially since it does not appear
to be finished yet.

I agree its a big drop. Please continue to report your data.

Quick chargers, heat, miles, ... none of it seems to matter for these drops. GerryAZ has seen the smallest drops, and he's in Phoenix with many miles on his car.

most of us are in the 94-95% range....but after a year of having the car. I have my 1 year battery check tomorrow at Nissan and will ask them some questions (though guessing they won't have any answers).

(though guessing they won't have any answers).

Click to expand...

Sure they will! "That's normal."

Adjustments have been every 90 days since manufacture (July 2019) so far for my car. As noted previously, the first two adjustments (October 2019 and January 2020) were upward (for AHr and SOH) and the third adjustment (April 2020) was downward. The main difference in use/charge patterns has been teleworking since March 6 (last round trip commute was March 5) so daily mileage is much less and freeway miles are much less. My normal commute was 26 miles each way with about 20 of those on the freeway (52 miles, 40 freeway miles for each round trip). I typically had some errands in the evening in addition to the commuting miles. Daily miles dropped starting March 6 and most of those miles have been on local streets. I have driven across town on the freeways a few times since then, but freeway miles have been inconsistent and overall much less than my normal use. I have done four discharge tests by running climate control in driveway until shutdown (main contactor opens). Charging was at home (voltage normally runs a little over 240) with the 30-ampere AeroVironment EVSE I have used since 2011. Energy use was recorded by the EKM revenue accuracy meter I have connected ahead of the EVSE. Here are those data points:

September 7, 2019
1,149 miles
65.95 kWh
721 Gids
173.35 AHr
98.27% SOH
102.94% Hx
399.51 Volts

November 10, 2019
5,656 miles
66.64 kWh
736 Gids
173.07 AHr
98.11% SOH
113.96% Hx
402.24 Volts

February 8, 2020
11,167 miles
65.51 kWh
735 Gids
173.07 AHr
98.11% SOH
114.54% Hx
402.20 Volts

May 10, 2020
15,167 miles
64.27 kWh
719 Gids
171.46 AHr
97.20% SOH
111.88% Hx
400.73 Volts

Blueflex2 said:

Yes, no quick charges yet. Low activity in part due to pandemic restrictions.
However never seen anybody else report such a signficant drop in SOH on 1st major adjustment. I am quite concerned, especially since it does not appear
to be finished yet.

Click to expand...

My first drop was ove 2½% and it took 9 days. The 2nd less than 1½% over 4 days. The first period was relatively light driving, 20-40 miles per day averaging under 1,000 miles a month. Over 90% DC charging including a 3 month period of exclusive DC charging. The 2nd period, I had a 6 week labor share (working at different facility) which was 47 miles one way, 90% freeway 4 days a week. The 2nd adjustment started during week 2. The first 4 weeks of labor share, I DC'd every work day. After that, it was AC charging at home 24 amps to no more than 75% SOC.

I intend to stick to mostly AC charging (expect maybe a road trip here and there) until the end of July when my 3rd adjustment is due to see what if any changes that might cause

GerryAZ said:

May 10, 2020
15,167 miles
64.27 kWh
719 Gids
171.46 AHr
97.20% SOH
111.88% Hx
400.73 Volts

Click to expand...

That's crazy how your numbers are holding up so well.


Is there a way to see what version of BMS software each person is running?

I feel like I have treated my car very well, low miles, almost no fast charging and I'm down in the 89% range after just over a year.

This AM:
Ahr: 103.75
SOH: 89.87%
Hx: 108.81
5942 Miles

I have my 1 year battery check this Friday, if the dealer will ever call me back to confirm. I've called them four times to confirm the work and every time they ask if I need an oil change, when i say no, they transfer to someone else to leave a message. Supposedly I have an appointment. I really hate my Nissan dealer. My Subaru dealer is so much better... if only Subaru had EVs. It is like polar opposite of dealer experience.

GerryAZ

Your May Numbers Struck me:

May 10, 2020
15,167 miles
64.27 kWh
719 Gids
171.46 AHr
97.20% SOH
111.88% Hx
400.73 Volts

My car with 94.5X% SoH charges to 720 GIDS. SoH and GIDS should tightly align, no? Historically they were lock step. When I had 98.7% SOC, I was still above 750 GIDS. My first GID reading when I had re-enabled LeafSpy on the car was 770 GIDs (triple the highest reading on my 2013 Leaf. So either LeafSpy doesn't align fully to this battery, or SoH is representing something else. I feel like this is further evidence that the BMS is managing down usable capacity to hold down long terms degradation. The mystery deepens.

I had my battery check this morning. My battery is in perfect health according to the report. I have yet to get a battery report show anything else in the 2 (and soon to be 3...details tonight) Leafs we have owned. I asked the tech if they trained him on anything due to the BMS, or these quarterly cycles we have been seeing.... Pretty blank stare in return. I know that will be shocking for this board.


Danjones, do you have a Leaf or Leaf Plus. How many GIDS does you car show with a full battery?

DougWantsALeaf said:

I had my battery check this morning. My battery is in perfect health according to the report. I have yet to get a battery report show anything else in the 2 (and soon to be 3...details tonight) Leafs we have owned.

Click to expand...

Did you expect something different from a Nissan dealer, i.e. all Leaf batteries experience relatively high degradation?

lorenfb said:

DougWantsALeaf said:

I had my battery check this morning. My battery is in perfect health according to the report. I have yet to get a battery report show anything else in the 2 (and soon to be 3...details tonight) Leafs we have owned.

Click to expand...

Did you expect something different from a Nissan dealer, i.e. all Leaf batteries experience relatively high degradation?

Click to expand...

Really? Seattle Facebook page has a 150,000 mile Leaf with 10 capacity bars.

WetEV said:

lorenfb said:

DougWantsALeaf said:

I had my battery check this morning. My battery is in perfect health according to the report. I have yet to get a battery report show anything else in the 2 (and soon to be 3...details tonight) Leafs we have owned.

Click to expand...

Did you expect something different from a Nissan dealer, i.e. all Leaf batteries experience relatively high degradation?

Click to expand...

Really? Seattle Facebook page has a 150,000 mile Leaf with 10 capacity bars.

Click to expand...

An outlier! Your having bought an eTron verses a Leaf2 speaks to your real view.

LorenFB

Your tagline overall efficiency is fantastic if that is for all 10K miles. Can I assume you are in a warm climate. Getting 5.2 is easily achievable here in Chicago May - October, but challenging in the other months when it gets cold.

DougWantsALeaf said:

Danjones, do you have a Leaf or Leaf Plus. How many GIDS does you car show with a full battery?

Click to expand...

2018 40 kWh

I use the free version of LeafSpy, and I don't believe it shows GIDs?

DougWantsALeaf said:

LorenFB

Your tagline overall efficiency is fantastic if that is for all 10K miles. Can I assume you are in a warm climate. Getting 5.2 is easily achievable here in Chicago May - October, but challenging in the other months when it gets cold.

Click to expand...

I rarely drive over 60 MPH and I am generally in the far right lane on the freeways. If climbing a long grade, my speed may be as low as 45.
I rarely use the A/C even when as hot as 80, i.e. with low humidity. I frequently monitor the battery temp and avoid allowing the temp
over 85-90, which is the max temp where I live in the summer. I attempt to not contribute to increasing the battery temp over ambient
as much as possible.

lorenfb said:

WetEV said:

lorenfb said:

Did you expect something different from a Nissan dealer, i.e. all Leaf batteries experience relatively high degradation?

Click to expand...

Really? Seattle Facebook page has a 150,000 mile Leaf with 10 capacity bars.

Click to expand...

An outlier! Your having bought an eTron verses a Leaf2 speaks to your real view.

Click to expand...

I still own the LEAF, still being driven almost daily. Past 60k miles and 88% SOC.
Main reason for the eTron is non-electrical. Wife has knee and back problems, and the Leaf is too low.

WetEV said:

lorenfb said:

WetEV said:

Really? Seattle Facebook page has a 150,000 mile Leaf with 10 capacity bars.

Click to expand...

An outlier! Your having bought an eTron verses a Leaf2 speaks to your real view.

Click to expand...

I still own the LEAF, still being driven almost daily. Past 60k miles and 88% SOC.
Main reason for the eTron is non-electrical. Wife has knee and back problems, and the Leaf is too low.

Click to expand...

You're forgiven!

Do you find the eTron gets the EPA range? I feel like stories are mixed.

LorenFB, I drive very similar to you, which is how I was able to get 220 and 240 mile runs on the highway without anxiety. I drive to the efficiency and power levels, not speed. If I get a tail wind and can do 65-70 for a bit with some traffic, great. If not, I will manage patiently at 50-55 if needed.

DougWantsALeaf said:

Do you find the eTron gets the EPA range? I feel like stories are mixed.

Click to expand...

Yes, with the same sort of conditions that you expect to give you reasonable range. Less in cold, rain and less at higher speeds.

DougWantsALeaf said:

GerryAZ

Your May Numbers Struck me:

May 10, 2020
15,167 miles
64.27 kWh
719 Gids
171.46 AHr
97.20% SOH
111.88% Hx
400.73 Volts

My car with 94.5X% SoH charges to 720 GIDS. SoH and GIDS should tightly align, no? Historically they were lock step. When I had 98.7% SOC, I was still above 750 GIDS. My first GID reading when I had re-enabled LeafSpy on the car was 770 GIDs (triple the highest reading on my 2013 Leaf. So either LeafSpy doesn't align fully to this battery, or SoH is representing something else. I feel like this is further evidence that the BMS is managing down usable capacity to hold down long terms degradation. The mystery deepens.

I had my battery check this morning. My battery is in perfect health according to the report. I have yet to get a battery report show anything else in the 2 (and soon to be 3...details tonight) Leafs we have owned. I asked the tech if they trained him on anything due to the BMS, or these quarterly cycles we have been seeing.... Pretty blank stare in return. I know that will be shocking for this board.


Danjones, do you have a Leaf or Leaf Plus. How many GIDS does you car show with a full battery?

Click to expand...

I am beginning to be convinced that the BMS programming is artificially adjusting useable capacity based on use/charge patterns. Gids on my car at full charge have varied. The highest recorded was 737 and the lowest so far has been 714. Here are some key numbers with comments to consider:

730 8/11/2019 189 miles (first full charge)
722 9/02/2019 683 miles (first charge after sitting at airport for over 2 weeks)
737 9/21/2019 2,153 miles (highest reading)
737 10/27/2019 4,630 miles (after first 90-day adjustment)
736 3/06/2020 13,152 miles (start of reduced driving/charging)
735 4/19/2020 14,923 miles (before last 90-day adjustment)
720 4/29/2020 15,383 miles (after last 90-day adjustment completed)
714 6/10/2020 17,200 miles (last full charge)

The numbers were in the 720's and 730's until a downward trend started after the last 90-day adjustment. There were about 6 weeks of reduced daily driving and reduced freeway driving before the last adjustment. As you can see, the number dropped for a while after the car was parked for 2 weeks, but recovered when daily driving resumed.

lorenfb said:

WetEV said:

lorenfb said:

Did you expect something different from a Nissan dealer, i.e. all Leaf batteries experience relatively high degradation?

Click to expand...

Really? Seattle Facebook page has a 150,000 mile Leaf with 10 capacity bars.

Click to expand...

An outlier! Your having bought an eTron verses a Leaf2 speaks to your real view.

Click to expand...

Ummm, "actually" We had a 156,000 mile LEAF with "12" bars so...

DougWantsALeaf said:

GerryAZ

Your May Numbers Struck me:

May 10, 2020
15,167 miles
64.27 kWh
719 Gids
171.46 AHr
97.20% SOH
111.88% Hx
400.73 Volts

My car with 94.5X% SoH charges to 720 GIDS. SoH and GIDS should tightly align, no? Historically they were lock step. When I had 98.7% SOC, I was still above 750 GIDS. My first GID reading when I had re-enabled LeafSpy on the car was 770 GIDs (triple the highest reading on my 2013 Leaf. So either LeafSpy doesn't align fully to this battery, or SoH is representing something else. I feel like this is further evidence that the BMS is managing down usable capacity to hold down long terms degradation. The mystery deepens.

I had my battery check this morning. My battery is in perfect health according to the report. I have yet to get a battery report show anything else in the 2 (and soon to be 3...details tonight) Leafs we have owned. I asked the tech if they trained him on anything due to the BMS, or these quarterly cycles we have been seeing.... Pretty blank stare in return. I know that will be shocking for this board.


Danjones, do you have a Leaf or Leaf Plus. How many GIDS does you car show with a full battery?

Click to expand...

Yeah, I thought that was a bit strange as well. I just did my 2nd full charge last week (first was done by dealer) and had 731 GIDs. But GIDs is a measure of charge so it would be more in step with ahr.

Now, GID is what is supposed to be in the pack but ahr on your voltage screen is only your "predicted maximum ahr at full capacity" What I failed to do was compare numbers on the screen that shows current "actual" ahr.

SOH is only an overall evaluation of the pack's well, health.

To look at it another way;

Two people both in good health or... are equal in SOH.

One can bench press 300 lbs. the other can only bench press 200 lbs. Now we know that strength is only one part of health so the stronger person isn't necessarily healthier which is why both people have an equal SOH.