Nissan's published Range vs Real life (was EPA)

I was just looking back at the official EPA figures for the Leaf's range and was wondering how it compares to what people are getting in the real world. I wonder if people would like to share their experiences compared to the EPA table below. Some seem a bit low to me (highway and stop-and-go especially).


Cruising (ideal condition)
Speed: 38mph/61kmh
Temp: 68F/20C
Range:138m/222km
Air con:Off

City traffic
Speed: 24mph/39kmh
Temp: 77F/25C
Range:105m/169km
Air con:Off

Highway
Speed: 55mph/89kmh
Temp: 95F/24C
Range:70m/110km
Air con: In use

Winter, stop-and-go traffic
Speed: 15mph/24kmh
Temp: 14F/-10C
Range: 62m/100km
Air con: Heater on

Heavy stop-and-go traffic
Speed: 6mph/10kmh
Temp: 86F/30C
Range: 47m/76km
Air con: In use

This is not EPA - it is what Nissan published.

Ah. Sorry. But even so, how do they shape up against real world usage?

Quick edit mow that I am not on my phone: basically, from what i have read here, these seem very low. 55mph with air con, I would be expecting more than 70 miles. That seems to correlate with what others on his forum are getting. Or am I reading something wrong?

Nufkin said:

Ah. Sorry. But even so, how do they shape up against real world usage?

Quick edit mow that I am not on my phone: basically, from what i have read here, these seem very low. 55mph with air con, I would be expecting more than 70 miles. That seems to correlate with what others on his forum are getting. Or am I reading something wrong?

Click to expand...

I run 63 miles at 60-65mph, climate control on only as necessary, and pull into my driveway with anywhere from 19-27 miles available showing on my dash.

FYI.

Today I drove 96 miles. No passengers, no climate control (ambient started at 60 and reached 72), only audio almost continuously. In the later part of the drive cracked windows a little for cooling.

I never exceeded 56mph, except about 7 freeway miles (all else backroads) during the last third of the tour (63mph). Drove "gingerly" on the accelerator, but had some fun on a twisty road. Many 45mph stretches (total 10 miles?). Almost the entire tour in ECO mode. Included a climb to 1,400 feet (from 0). Some residential miles (total 5?) at 25mph and partly in hilly terrain.

Started with 100% charge and 105 mile range (ECO) ... but that quickly faded (no regen)

At 36 miles (driven) had 50mile range and 4.1 mpk (miles/kWh).

At 55 miles and the top elevation (1,400 feet) range had dropped to 25miles and 3.9mpk and I charged for exactly one hour at a Nissan Dealer (Level 2, assume 3.3kWh added) and the range display added 16 miles (I expected 12). Was able to average 4.1 mpk until just before the climb.

Ended back at home with the "low battery" warning half-mile from home, range 15miles, 4.3mpk. Elapsed time 3:01 (which includes about 15minutes "ON" but parked), avg speed 31.8mph. Total 95.7miles.

Not bad ... but consider the slow "Sunday drving speed" which made it possible.

If I hadn't charged I would have been deep into turtle mode ... and would have had to slow from 55 to 45 on the last 10 or 15 miles.

LEAFer said:

At 55 miles and the top elevation (1,400 feet) range had dropped to 25miles and 3.9mpk and I charged for exactly one hour at a Nissan Dealer (Level 2, assume 3.3kWh added) and the range display added 16 miles (I expected 12). Was able to average 4.1 mpk until just before the climb.

Click to expand...

Hey LEAFer,

I'm curious how your actual route matches up with this Google Maps Elevation Profile site I found?

http://help.arcgis.com/en/webapi/javascript/gmaps/samples/geoprocessor/gp_profile.html

I've plotted a few of my most common trips and they usually vary going from 50 meters to about 125 meters, so not much elevation changes for me...

DarkStar said:

LEAFer said:

At 55 miles and the top elevation (1,400 feet) range had dropped to 25miles and 3.9mpk and I charged for exactly one hour at a Nissan Dealer (Level 2, assume 3.3kWh added) and the range display added 16 miles (I expected 12). Was able to average 4.1 mpk until just before the climb.

Click to expand...

Hey LEAFer,

I'm curious how your actual route matches up with this Google Maps Elevation Profile site I found?

http://help.arcgis.com/en/webapi/javascript/gmaps/samples/geoprocessor/gp_profile.html

I've plotted a few of my most common trips and they usually vary going from 50 meters to about 125 meters, so not much elevation changes for me...

Click to expand...

How do I get this in miles/ft?

jcesare said:

How do I get this in miles/ft?

Click to expand...

Unfortunately, it looks like we have to use math...

It appears the page I found is technically just a "tech-demo" for using the Google Maps API to calculate the elevation along a given path. If I knew more about it I would probably make my own!

Just a side note: An access point at the wireless broadband tower I use with my ISP went out on Saturday morning. I have been on dial-up for two days now :shock: So ... apologies, but I have very limited bandwidth at the moment. The equipment is to be fixed this afternoon. Once I am back to "normal" I'll be able to respond and check more into this stuff, and give you an actual route I took Sunday (even google maps is "rough" to use on dial-up even with "html-only" option :x )

(And kudos to this website: it's somewhat usable (!) on dial-up ... except threads that contain a lot of photos )

DarkStar said:

Hey LEAFer,
I'm curious how your actual route matches up with this Google Maps Elevation Profile site I found?

Click to expand...

Ok ... here's the "approximate" route I took yesterday. I say "approximate", because points A/B/D are not properly reflecting actual locations to "protect the innocent" (residents). The route, however, is completely representative, as are the distances (very close), speeds and elevations.

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=d&source=s_d&saddr=Twin+Cities+Rd+at+marengo+rd,+galt,+ca&daddr=38.38655,-121.24212+to:folsom,+ca+to:38.70678,-120.97339+to:4045+Wild+Chaparral+Drive,+Shingle+Springs,+CA+to:38.63086,-121.0806+to:38.557,-121.11839+to:38.42867,-121.20499+to:38.368043,-121.2237636+to:Twin+Cities+Rd+at+marengo+rd,+galt,+ca&hl=en&geocode=FWhHSAIdCl_F-Cn9OvqAbL2agDFsu5XUT91N-w%3BFXa7SQId-P3F-ClPtQlJmJWagDF2mtxFI0_wIw%3BFcctTgIdBgDH-Cl_etmJG-GagDEqzuExLkxO1A%3BFVyeTgIdshfK-Ck54I-VcPmagDH9Bc5tVydXAQ%3BFVz1TQIde5rK-Ck_iQTMgveagDF95qsD6cERrw%3BFcx1TQId6HTI-CkhPLNTVeWagDErtH3tfl110g%3BFUhVTAIdSuHH-CkfBA6rYe6agDFP1rANhHVRgw%3BFf5fSgIdAo_G-CmxajipxJSagDFtVtsHQO24MA%3BFStzSQIdrUXG-CmlOdjh0ZWagDEYTbvIuXAPgA%3BFWhHSAIdCl_F-Cn9OvqAbL2agDFsu5XUT91N-w&mra=dpe&mrcr=0&mrsp=1&sz=11&via=1,3,5,6,7,8&sll=38.427236,-121.185379&sspn=0.286172,0.701065&ie=UTF8&ll=38.52883,-121.089935&spn=0.571537,1.40213&z=10

My car has had 700 miles to learn how I drive. Mostly highway, 55 mph, ECO mode on, but quite a bit of heater in the morning. I charged to 100% for only the second time since I bought the car. It showed about 84 miles estimated range. Charging to 80%, it shows around 67 to 70 miles estimated. I think those numbers are pretty close. Average speed probably 45, heater on in the morning. High beams on for about half the morning drive. I expect to do considerably better soon; shouldn't need heat much longer. Still, 55 mph seems to yield right around 4 mi/kWh.

I did 85 miles on the way home from the dealer, but that was with climate control and lights off. Estimated range 12 miles when I got home. Had low battery alert, which I have gotten used to.

-Karl

since we have ALL gone thru a part of one season, how could you expect us to answer this?

i can say that the highway range with no A/C would appear to be a bit low. i drive 60-63 mph more or less. i am relatively sure that even in colder climates (temps running from mid 40's to low 50's on good days) with very limited use of defrost, i should get at least 80 miles.

once again, we need to look at the average speeds here. many are assuming pretty heavy traffic and congestion. a 6 mph average is not normal around here even in heavy traffic and we have heavy traffic.

i will say that performance drops off very fast when speeds exceed about 50 mph. on my trip to Renton, the total performance was logged at 4.2 DMPK from the cars trip computer. that is a good mile below the average i see when trips average 35-40 mph with multiple stops. and i pretty much had it at 60 mph the whole freeway trip. of the 122 miles about 95 of it was freeway.

DaveinOlyWA said:

since we have ALL gone thru a part of one season, how could you expect us to answer this?

i can say that the highway range with no A/C would appear to be a bit low. i drive 60-63 mph more or less. i am relatively sure that even in colder climates (temps running from mid 40's to low 50's on good days) with very limited use of defrost, i should get at least 80 miles.

once again, we need to look at the average speeds here. many are assuming pretty heavy traffic and congestion. a 6 mph average is not normal around here even in heavy traffic and we have heavy traffic.

i will say that performance drops off very fast when speeds exceed about 50 mph. on my trip to Renton, the total performance was logged at 4.2 DMPK from the cars trip computer. that is a good mile below the average i see when trips average 35-40 mph with multiple stops. and i pretty much had it at 60 mph the whole freeway trip. of the 122 miles about 95 of it was freeway.

Click to expand...

You stopped and charge up right? How long did you say 1 hr at a dealer right?

DaveinOlyWA said:

I will say that performance drops off very fast when speeds exceed about 50 mph. on my trip to Renton, the total performance was logged at 4.2 DMPK from the cars trip computer. that is a good mile below the average i see when trips average 35-40 mph with multiple stops. and i pretty much had it at 60 mph the whole freeway trip. of the 122 miles about 95 of it was freeway.

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I really dont think Nissan designed this car as a hwy cruiser.. perhaps future versions with 2 speed gearing and larger batteries. We like to fool ourselves with the idea of 80 mile hwy trips everyday, but I think the battery will suffer long term from this.

Gonewild said:

You stopped and charge up right? How long did you say 1 hr at a dealer right?

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actually charged just over an hour at Younkers and just under an hour at Rairdons so pretty close to two hours total

DaveinOlyWA said:

Gonewild said:

You stopped and charge up right? How long did you say 1 hr at a dealer right?

Click to expand...

actually charged just over an hour at Younkers and just under an hour at Rairdons so pretty close to two hours total

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With the size of the coffe cup I saw you carrying around Saturday afternoon, I don't think the stop on the way home was so much to charge up the Leaf but for relief of Dave

DaveinOlyWA said:

since we have ALL gone thru a part of one season, how could you expect us to answer this?

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Correct me if I am wrong, but I always thought that the US had a fairly wide range of weather? I do understand how one person will have only experienced one small range, but this forum has a wider membership and thus varied LEAF experience.

DaveinOlyWA said:

i can say that the highway range with no A/C would appear to be a bit low. i drive 60-63 mph more or less. i am relatively sure that even in colder climates (temps running from mid 40's to low 50's on good days) with very limited use of defrost, i should get at least 80 miles.

Click to expand...

Yep. This seems to be on par with what I would expect reading this forum. Then why are the official figures so low? Is Nissan lowballing them to ensure that no one has unrealistic expectations? If so, won't this put some people off?