Chevrolet Bolt & Bolt EUV

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Looks like the Bolt is on it's way out, which isn't surprising given the press around the recall - looks like they want to move on to the Ultium battery packs.

https://www.cnet.com/google-amp/news/chevy-bolt-ev-euv-gm-end-production/
 
Indeed, there are a bunch of murmurings on chevybolt.org about this. It's possible and if so, its early demise would've been because of the battery recall. Otherwise, there'd have been no reason to the design and engineering work to refresh the Bolt EV and come out with the Bolt EUV to not even have it sell for an entire model year.

It really was a shame that they didn't improve the DC FC speed. 55 kW max on a ~65 kWh battery is simply not competitive for model year '22. If they were able to up to ~70ish kW, at least it'd be competitive w/Kona EV and Niro EV.

When Orion plant went online briefly in Nov 2021 to produce what GM claimed were "courtesy" vehicles, which we thought were loaners (https://www.freep.com/story/money/cars/general-motors/2021/10/26/chevy-bolt-ev-euv-recall-gm-production-loaner-cars/8549367002/), apparently, some (all?) of those cars (which are supposed to have "defect-free" of fire batteries) are being offered to folks to swap into (e.g. https://www.chevybolt.org/threads/just-got-the-call-being-offered-a-swap-for-a-2022-bolt-euv.42024/ and https://www.chevybolt.org/threads/msrp-swap-just-picked-out-a-bolt-2lt.41955/).
 
Honestly, i still see it as a decent competitor to am extent - other than the leaf it's got among the lower starting prices with a decent amount of range.

If the expanded EV tax credit manages to pass in some form during the current administration (which I'm still pretty pessimistic about), it would be highly considerable as long as I can fit my greyhound in the back the way i do with the Leaf - it looks like it would be a tighter fit for him though.

Lack of tax credit is a bit of a deal breaker for me though because as long as I could afford monthly payments, i could make pretty good use of $7500 of my tax money back. That's probably my biggest tension point for next vehicle since I'm worried about how many manufacturers are going to hit the limit before I'm ready to purchase around 2025/26 and a general expectation my 30kw battery will probably manage to gracefully degrade right along Nissan's expectations. I'll have it paid of in 2023 but I could really go for a couple of years with no car payments.
 
cwerdna said:
Indeed, there are a bunch of murmurings on chevybolt.org about this. It's possible and if so, its early demise would've been because of the battery recall. Otherwise, there'd have been no reason to the design and engineering work to refresh the Bolt EV and come out with the Bolt EUV to not even have it sell for an entire model year.

It really was a shame that they didn't improve the DC FC speed. 55 kW max on a ~65 kWh battery is simply not competitive for model year '22. If they were able to up to ~70ish kW, at least it'd be competitive w/Kona EV and Niro EV. <snip>


Agreed. Going forward, I think any new BEV with a max. charge rate under 1.5C and 1C for the average rate simply isn't going to cut it, and more is better. Still, I think the Bolt's fine for a daily use and occasional shorter weekend trip car for most people. Personally, I'd prefer an AWD wagon/CUV between the length of the EUV and the Equinox. The new Niro is the car that really should offer AWD, and I'm also hoping Kia will use an 800V pack in it. I think 260 miles EPA is the minimum going forward for newly introduced all-around BEVs (given the Bolt/Kona's 259/258), and the sooner someone offers 300 (better yet 300 HWY) EPA or more for under $40k MSRP+dest., the better.
 
https://www.freep.com/story/money/cars/general-motors/2022/02/15/chevrolet-bolt-orion-assembly-production-restarts-spring/6794987001/ says "On Tuesday, GM said it will restart production of its Chevrolet Bolt and Bolt EUV April 4 as it continues to fix defective batteries as part of a global recall on the cars."
 
Chevy Bolt EV, EUV Resume Production after Battery Recall
https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a39638798/chevy-bolt-ev-and-euv-resume-production/
 
IEVS:
62% Of 2017 To 2019 Chevrolet Bolts Have Had Their Battery Replaced
The information comes from an NHTSA document that shows replacement rates among newer Bolts are far lower, though.

https://insideevs.com/news/582844/report-chevrolet-bolt-battery-replacement/


. . . According to this report from the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA), discovered by one of our new forum members, Lee Lightfoot, Chevrolet has already replaced the battery pack in 62 percent of affected Bolts built under the 2017 through 2019 model years. Chevy says that last quarter it changed 26,952 battery packs.

If it keeps it up at the same rate, all Bolts built through the 2019 model year will have been fixed (some 50,413 examples are affected). Another document issued for 2021 through 2022 model year affected Chevy Bolts shows that these newer cars haven’t received new batteries yet - just 701 swaps were performed out of a total 52,414 pool of affected vehicles.

Most of the cost of the replacement batteries (around $1.9-billion out of a total estimated cost of $2-billion) will be supported by LG Chem, the company that supplied the packs to General Motors. It also worked with the manufacturer to discover the problems that cause the fires, which were eventually narrowed down to possible broken anode tab or a folded separator.

Owners of Bolt EVs equipped with the new battery are also reporting a range increase with the fresh pack. When our own Tom Moloughney took part in a range test of a Bolt with a newly replaced battery, he found that post swap it was able to travel for around 13.5 percent longer than before.

As it previously announced, Chevrolet restarted Bolt EV and Bolt EUV production at the start of April and all new vehicles feature the fixed battery pack, the one that is now being installed in older Bolts.
 
Yeah, the below are for US cars only.
https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/rcl/2021/RCLQRT-21V560-6381.PDF - 880 is for '17 to '19
https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/rcl/2021/RCLQRT-21V650-2776.PDF - 940 is for '20 to '22

There is some ambiguity about the latter. New dealer unsold '20 to '22 Bolts when their VINs are eligible are being flipped to 943 instead of 941 (for customer cars). I would think that the above 940 report should include repaired 941 and 943 cars but we're not 100% certain.

Someone decided to start https://www.chevybolt.org/threads/gm-report-of-battery-replacement-progress-to-nhtsa-q12022.43435/ instead of adding to https://www.chevybolt.org/threads/recall-quarterly-report-2021-3.41181/.
 
GM slashes prices of Chevy Bolt electric vehicles despite rising commodity costs
https://www.cnbc.com/2022/06/01/gm-slashes-prices-of-chevy-bolt-evs-despite-rising-commodity-costs.html
General Motors on Wednesday slashed the price of its 2023 Chevrolet Bolt EV, likely making it the least expensive electric vehicle on sale in the U.S.
The Detroit automaker cut the price of the Bolt EV by $5,900 and of the larger Bolt EUV by $6,300.
The reductions come as automakers, especially pure EV companies, hike prices on their electric vehicles amid changing market conditions and rising commodity costs.
...
The Detroit automaker cut the cost of the Bolt EV to a starting price of $26,595, down $5,900 from the 2022 model year. GM also reduced the price of its larger Bolt EUV by $6,300 to start at $28,195. All pricing includes a mandatory $995 destination charge.
 
cwerdna said:
GM slashes prices of Chevy Bolt electric vehicles despite rising commodity costs
https://www.cnbc.com/2022/06/01/gm-slashes-prices-of-chevy-bolt-evs-despite-rising-commodity-costs.html
General Motors on Wednesday slashed the price of its 2023 Chevrolet Bolt EV, likely making it the least expensive electric vehicle on sale in the U.S.
The Detroit automaker cut the price of the Bolt EV by $5,900 and of the larger Bolt EUV by $6,300.
The reductions come as automakers, especially pure EV companies, hike prices on their electric vehicles amid changing market conditions and rising commodity costs.
...
The Detroit automaker cut the cost of the Bolt EV to a starting price of $26,595, down $5,900 from the 2022 model year. GM also reduced the price of its larger Bolt EUV by $6,300 to start at $28,195. All pricing includes a mandatory $995 destination charge.

Those are some hefty price cuts, especially given their recent battery woes and the inflation.

The Bolt would be a fantastic entry level EV now for many people, starting well under 30k! But how many units will be on sale, and will the dealers gouge people?

For the bolt experts here, is this GM saying goodbye to the Bolt? A Firesale, no pun intended?
 
danrjones said:
For the bolt experts here, is this GM saying goodbye to the Bolt? A Firesale, no pun intended?
That's been speculated about for awhile on Bolt forums and FB groups. Folks aren't expecting substantial improvements esp. when it comes to DC FC speeds. People are pointing to Ultium as to where their efforts are going and are making assertions that those newer BEVs will be cheaper for GM to make.

'22 Bolt EUV was new and '22 Bolt EV was somewhat substantial refresh. Since we got this '23 announcement, I do wonder how many more model years are left and whether GM will do a redesign or just kill it after model year '23 or '24...
 
My take is the Bolt is a good value especially with the price cut. In 2020 you could get a Bolt for that price. We did. You had to do your homework and we did.

As to the future of the Bolt? That's a fools errand. No one can predict what goes on in those corporate towers.

We need good entry level EVs with respectable range. The Bolt fills that role. All the other stuff coming out are gold-plated monsters.

We have a new battery, mid range is hovering around 300 miles. ;)

Paul
 
This price cut is a big deal, especially with current gas prices - the station a block from me is currently $6.40/gal. and they're by no means the most expensive in town. <$30k MSRP + dest. puts them in the affordable range for most new car buyers.*

While the Bolt and EUV remain ill-suited for extended road trips due to their lowest extant FC rates, I consider them perfectly adequate for local use and acceptable for the occasional weekend trip, as well as being suited for a much wider variety of climates than the LEAF due to their TMS (adding a heat pump would make them even better). If the dealers can be kept from gouging**, this has the potential to finally make a reasonable capable BEV available to the masses, and at current gas prices they have ample incentive to switch, especially if they have access to (or are willing to rent) a car suited for extended road trips.



*I consider <$40k semi-affordable, <$25k very affordable and <$20k extremely affordable. Over $40k is entry-level premium on up.

**Last November (I think) someone posted a photo on the RAV4 Prime forum of a RAV4 Prime Monroney sticker at a Toyota dealer in Oakland, who'd added a $40k ADM to the $56k MSRP :eek: I've got to wonder if they found anyone dumb/desperate enough to go for that, especially before the serious gas price hikes started.
 
Agreed that with the price cut, the Bolt now outshines the venerable S+ in terms of value. The larger 66 kWh usable battery is significantly more than the Leaf Plus with tax credit. I even find the EUV almost passable from a design perspective.

The DC charge curve is pretty weak, not just peak rate but the overall curve. At 11 battery temp bars, I think the Leaf Plus might still give it a run for its money. Ton Malougney recently taped the curve on his state of charge you tube channel.
 
Yeah, I find the Bolt's charging times totally unacceptable for me. On my Oct. 2020 Bolt trip from the Bay Area to 395 east of Yosemite and back, on the return it took me 45 minutes to charge from 45-80%, with ambient temps of 84 at the start of charging and 83 at the end, with the battery having enjoyed a 60 mile descent (ambient 76 deg. at high point) followed by 40 miles of flat.
 
The 45% to 80% was your problem. Full speed is only from achievable up to about 50%. After that, it starts tapering unless you're using a very low powered (e.g. ~25 kW) charger.

Video at https://electricrevs.com/2018/07/17/watch-a-bolt-ev-at-a-chargepoint-express-250-charge-at-up-to-55-kw/ is about the best can Bolt do prior to updates. With IIRC, '20+ Bolts and I believe older Bolts with updates that would be installed as part of 80% temp limiter or replacement pack, I hear the drops are smoother and not sharp any longer.
 
cwerdna said:
The 45% to 80% was your problem. Full speed is only from achievable up to about 50%. After that, it starts tapering unless you're using a very low powered (e.g. ~25 kW) charger.

Video at https://electricrevs.com/2018/07/17/watch-a-bolt-ev-at-a-chargepoint-express-250-charge-at-up-to-55-kw/ is about the best can Bolt do prior to updates. With IIRC, '20+ Bolts and I believe older Bolts with updates that would be installed as part of 80% temp limiter or replacement pack, I hear the drops are smoother and not sharp any longer.


If it takes 45 minutes (checking my notes I see it was actually 47 minutes, from 7:18 - 8:05 p.m.) to charge from 45-80%, it's going to take considerably longer to charge from 20-80%, which is what I'd be typically trying to do on a road trip given adequately-spaced chargers. As it was, at 45% it was charging at 44kW, so not that far down from the 55kW peak. Assuming it could charge from 20-45% @ 55kW the whole time it would take another 18 minutes, and in real life with taper somewhat longer. Thus, even the best case would take 1:05 from 20-80%, and as the car can only drive about 2 hours using that charge range, that means 2 hours driving/1:05 charging, and repeat. That simply doesn't cut it for road trips requiring multiple charging stops, if you actually need to get somewhere with minimum downtime.

BTW, this was a brand new (54 miles on the odometer when I picked it up from the owner, 559 when I started the charge described) 2020 Bolt.
 
GRA said:
If it takes 45 minutes (checking my notes I see it was actually 47 minutes, from 7:18 - 8:05 p.m.) to charge from 45-80%, it's going to take considerably longer to charge from 20-80%, which is what I'd be typically trying to do on a road trip given adequately-spaced chargers. As it was, at 45% it was charging at 44kW, so not that far down from the 55kW peak. Assuming it could charge from 20-45% @ 55kW the whole time it would take another 18 minutes, and in real life with taper somewhat longer. Thus, even the best case would take 1:05 from 20-80%, and as the car can only drive about 2 hours using that charge range, that means 2 hours driving/1:05 charging, and repeat. That simply doesn't cut it for road trips requiring multiple charging stops, if you actually need to get somewhere with minimum downtime.

BTW, this was a brand new (54 miles on the odometer when I picked it up from the owner, 559 when I started the charge described) 2020 Bolt.
I can't speak to the DC FCs you used. If it wasn't sufficiently powerful or there was something wrong with it, you won't hit 54 or 55k W.

As for 20% to 80%, again, not going low enough and terminating at too high SoC, is of course not going to be fast. If you watch the video I pointed to (which still had the sharp drops), at about 71% is a sharp drop in charging speed. Skip to about 2:18 in the video.

As for the bolded part, I don't disagree. Bolt's DC FC rate now is not competitive vs. many other non-Tesla BEVs with similar battery capacity introduced after it originally came out in Dec 2016.

That said, I did take my former 80% capped via software Bolt to So Cal in Dec 2021. With that limiter, it becomes super slow once you get close to 80%, even slower than if you DC FCed a Bolt to 100%. Was a bit over 370 miles one way, since I took highway 99 (far more DC FC choices there including free ones: https://dot.ca.gov/news-releases/news-release-2021-001 + plenty of backups).
 
I went and checked my last charging stop coming from Kansas to Chicagoland. In Davenport I pulled in with battery at 108F and ~10% SoH. It took 75 min to charge to 85% so I could do the 180ish miles home. End temp was 123F. This was my 3rd consecutive DC charge for the trip. I was rapidgating during 2nd half of the charge. My average charging speed was 29KW. (Started in mid 40s and tapered to 19 at the end)

It doesn't seem like the Bolt would have done much better, though I would certainly welcome an extra 8-10kWh of battery capacity.
 
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