How do they differ ?
So far as I know, AESC is the source for both LEAF and Ariya
Re: InsideEVs Apr 2023: "We are not too optimistic about the Leaf."
So far as I know, AESC is the source for both LEAF and Ariya
2013 LEAF 'S' Model bought Jan 2017 from N. Cal @ 90% SOH
SOLD 7/2022 @ 83% SOH
SOLD 7/2022 @ 83% SOH
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Flyct
- Forum Supporter
- Posts: 645
- Joined: Tue Nov 03, 2015 12:04 am
- Delivery Date: 08 Dec 2020
- Leaf Number: 310762
- Location: Bradenton, Florida, US
Re: InsideEVs Apr 2023: "We are not too optimistic about the Leaf."
Let me add my 2 cents opinion as a 76 year old fart who has owned 5 Leafs (2015, 2018, 2019, 2020 &. 2023).and now an owner of 2 Tesla Model Ys. My favorite Leaf was our White/White 2019 SL Plus that got totaled.
The egress/ Ingress of the leaf was excellent. The simplicity made the Leaf felt like putting on a pair of old comfortable shoes. The Model Y egress/Ingress is just as easy for my older overweight 6 foot tall body. When demo driving the Model 3 I couldn’t get in/out of it without generating much neck pain because of the roof height at the door so we bought a Model Y instead. The M3 reminded me of my Corvette in my younger days.
When the Leaf was no longer eligible for the tax credit and the long range Model Y price effectively dropped to $42,500 after tax credit, then it was a no brainer for us.
The Tesla Y has gobs of extra cargo space. The seats are SOOO comfortable compared to the Leaf. The included basic autopilot makes driving long distance stress free. The published 313 miles of range is still a good really 250 at highway speeds. The Nav Satellite view is first class. The supercharging charging infrastructure is reliable and die right awesome, making it a true cross country car. The acceleration will blow your mind even set to chill mode. The ability to use your smartphone or Apple Watch as a key is great no longer needing a fob. The handling is a wonderful experience.
The Tesla has some quirks like phantom breaking, windshield wipers coming on for no reason, recent elimination of Ultrasonic sensors in bumper and replacing it with Tesla vision cameras and the fancy door handles aren’t as easy as the Leaf’s. Trying to find the flush door handles at night is a challenge on the Tesla. Also it seems that Tesla owners are more snobby.
As a local grocery getter the Leaf is slightly better choice. My sister bought a Leaf S in December. After federal and CA state tax credit it was a sub $20k purchase. Perfect for local driving but not for trips greater than a radius of 50 miles from home. She regrets not having purchased a SV Plus for the extra range.
The egress/ Ingress of the leaf was excellent. The simplicity made the Leaf felt like putting on a pair of old comfortable shoes. The Model Y egress/Ingress is just as easy for my older overweight 6 foot tall body. When demo driving the Model 3 I couldn’t get in/out of it without generating much neck pain because of the roof height at the door so we bought a Model Y instead. The M3 reminded me of my Corvette in my younger days.
When the Leaf was no longer eligible for the tax credit and the long range Model Y price effectively dropped to $42,500 after tax credit, then it was a no brainer for us.
The Tesla Y has gobs of extra cargo space. The seats are SOOO comfortable compared to the Leaf. The included basic autopilot makes driving long distance stress free. The published 313 miles of range is still a good really 250 at highway speeds. The Nav Satellite view is first class. The supercharging charging infrastructure is reliable and die right awesome, making it a true cross country car. The acceleration will blow your mind even set to chill mode. The ability to use your smartphone or Apple Watch as a key is great no longer needing a fob. The handling is a wonderful experience.
The Tesla has some quirks like phantom breaking, windshield wipers coming on for no reason, recent elimination of Ultrasonic sensors in bumper and replacing it with Tesla vision cameras and the fancy door handles aren’t as easy as the Leaf’s. Trying to find the flush door handles at night is a challenge on the Tesla. Also it seems that Tesla owners are more snobby.
As a local grocery getter the Leaf is slightly better choice. My sister bought a Leaf S in December. After federal and CA state tax credit it was a sub $20k purchase. Perfect for local driving but not for trips greater than a radius of 50 miles from home. She regrets not having purchased a SV Plus for the extra range.
Last edited by Flyct on Fri Jul 07, 2023 7:54 am, edited 2 times in total.
2023 Gray Tesla Model Y Long Range & 2023 White Tesla Model Y Long Range
2023 Leaf SV Plus Sold back to dealer 3 week later bought a Tesla
2020 Leaf SL Plus Traded
2019 Leaf SL Plus. Totaled 11/20
2018 SV Traded
2015 SL Traded
2023 Leaf SV Plus Sold back to dealer 3 week later bought a Tesla
2020 Leaf SL Plus Traded
2019 Leaf SL Plus. Totaled 11/20
2018 SV Traded
2015 SL Traded
Re: InsideEVs Apr 2023: "We are not too optimistic about the Leaf."
Leaf battery materials were sourced from Japan with final assembly in the US. More to the point is that the assembly plant in Tennessee is being retooled for Ariya production. It might be possible to source enough material in the US to qualify but the Ariya uses a different style of battery pack and Nissan doesn't have the facilities here to produce both. Under the new rules the Leaf gets no tax credit at all and neither does an Ariya since it is still built in Japan. When the production line in Tennessee opens up, the Ariya will qualify for $3750 Federal tax rebate unless they can find a US source For the battery.
2022 SV+ 10/22
2016 SL, New battery at 45K mi. Crashed at 95K mi. 9/22
Jamul, CA
San Diego East County
2016 SL, New battery at 45K mi. Crashed at 95K mi. 9/22
Jamul, CA
San Diego East County
Re: InsideEVs Apr 2023: "We are not too optimistic about the Leaf."
Why does the LEAF not qualify ?
I presume Japan is an FTA country, so even if the metals are sourced/refined from e.g China, the assembly into cells is a considerable amount of the supply chain value.
And if not, then why would the Ariya not have the same fate ?
I presume Japan is an FTA country, so even if the metals are sourced/refined from e.g China, the assembly into cells is a considerable amount of the supply chain value.
And if not, then why would the Ariya not have the same fate ?
2013 LEAF 'S' Model bought Jan 2017 from N. Cal @ 90% SOH
SOLD 7/2022 @ 83% SOH
SOLD 7/2022 @ 83% SOH
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knightmb
- Posts: 1976
- Joined: Mon Jan 12, 2015 7:41 pm
- Delivery Date: 26 Feb 2021
- Leaf Number: 306291
- Location: Franklin, TN
Re: InsideEVs Apr 2023: "We are not too optimistic about the Leaf."
The word from Nissan HQ is that it is temporary and now that Japan has been added to the FTA critical minerals, it might return by the end of this year or next. Rumors from VP's at the company of course, so don't bet money on it, but Nissan is a company in the business to make money and already have a lot of R&D invested into their line of EVs.SageBrush wrote: ↑Thu May 04, 2023 5:15 pm Why does the LEAF not qualify ?
I presume Japan is an FTA country, so even if the metals are sourced/refined from e.g China, the assembly into cells is a considerable amount of the supply chain value.
And if not, then why would the Ariya not have the same fate ?
https://ustr.gov/sites/default/files/20 ... 3%2028.pdf
2020 Leaf SL Plus - (Manufacture Date March 2020)
2018 Leaf SL - (Manufacture Date February 2018)
2013 Leaf SV - (8 faithful years of service before trade in at 75,679 miles LeafSpy-Data)
Timekoin - The World's Most Energy Efficient Encrypted Digital Currency
2018 Leaf SL - (Manufacture Date February 2018)
2013 Leaf SV - (8 faithful years of service before trade in at 75,679 miles LeafSpy-Data)
Timekoin - The World's Most Energy Efficient Encrypted Digital Currency
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DougWantsALeaf
- Posts: 3705
- Joined: Fri May 10, 2013 8:21 pm
- Delivery Date: 18 May 2013
- Leaf Number: 407811
- Location: Chicago North Side
Re: InsideEVs Apr 2023: "We are not too optimistic about the Leaf."
FlyCT
I agree with the MY reduction in price and loss of tax credit on the Leaf, only a few discounted lease scenarios make sense for the Leaf now. That said I have had couple friends buy a Leaf S recently, so a few Leafs are still getting into the wild. If you are dead set not to get Tesla, and shopping in the budget space, the Leaf might be the only sub 30K EV you can get.
I agree with the MY reduction in price and loss of tax credit on the Leaf, only a few discounted lease scenarios make sense for the Leaf now. That said I have had couple friends buy a Leaf S recently, so a few Leafs are still getting into the wild. If you are dead set not to get Tesla, and shopping in the budget space, the Leaf might be the only sub 30K EV you can get.
2019 S Plus (92.8% SOH) & 2019 SV Plus (88% SOH) Both Silver
2013 Leaf SV sold 2019
100 Mile Club Member (Number 87)
Max Miles on 13 Leaf: 120 miles
Max Miles on 19 SV+: 242 Highway miles @ 4.5 miles/kWh
2013 Leaf SV sold 2019
100 Mile Club Member (Number 87)
Max Miles on 13 Leaf: 120 miles
Max Miles on 19 SV+: 242 Highway miles @ 4.5 miles/kWh
Re: InsideEVs Apr 2023: "We are not too optimistic about the Leaf."
I gather the Bolt has a full tax credit. No idea why that is true, other than GM has a lot of political muscle.DougWantsALeaf wrote: ↑Thu May 04, 2023 7:15 pm FlyCT
I agree with the MY reduction in price and loss of tax credit on the Leaf, only a few discounted lease scenarios make sense for the Leaf now. That said I have had couple friends buy a Leaf S recently, so a few Leafs are still getting into the wild. If you are dead set not to get Tesla, and shopping in the budget space, the Leaf might be the only sub 30K EV you can get.
Dealers are piling on garbage fees but the final cost is still way below $30k
Car preferences aside, I think the biggest question for the Bolt is whether it is reasonable to buy an EOL car.
Of course that can happen any day to the LEAF too, and CHAdeMO is almost formally dead
2013 LEAF 'S' Model bought Jan 2017 from N. Cal @ 90% SOH
SOLD 7/2022 @ 83% SOH
SOLD 7/2022 @ 83% SOH
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DougWantsALeaf
- Posts: 3705
- Joined: Fri May 10, 2013 8:21 pm
- Delivery Date: 18 May 2013
- Leaf Number: 407811
- Location: Chicago North Side
Re: InsideEVs Apr 2023: "We are not too optimistic about the Leaf."
The Bolt I think is a fine budget EV, they are just in short supply, so not always east to get or if you can, at sticker.
I am hoping Leaf sales extend into 24 as the longer the Leaf is officially sold, the longer evgo, shell, and others will continue to maintain those installations..which are still going in thankfully. Once the Leaf stops, I do think we will within 24 months start to see a decline of total locations. We are thankfully still going up, but it is slowing.
I need to get my S+ to/from Kansas for 3 more years. That's my ask for continued chademo support.
I am hoping Leaf sales extend into 24 as the longer the Leaf is officially sold, the longer evgo, shell, and others will continue to maintain those installations..which are still going in thankfully. Once the Leaf stops, I do think we will within 24 months start to see a decline of total locations. We are thankfully still going up, but it is slowing.
I need to get my S+ to/from Kansas for 3 more years. That's my ask for continued chademo support.
2019 S Plus (92.8% SOH) & 2019 SV Plus (88% SOH) Both Silver
2013 Leaf SV sold 2019
100 Mile Club Member (Number 87)
Max Miles on 13 Leaf: 120 miles
Max Miles on 19 SV+: 242 Highway miles @ 4.5 miles/kWh
2013 Leaf SV sold 2019
100 Mile Club Member (Number 87)
Max Miles on 13 Leaf: 120 miles
Max Miles on 19 SV+: 242 Highway miles @ 4.5 miles/kWh
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DaveinOlyWA
- Posts: 16249
- Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 7:43 pm
- Delivery Date: 16 Nov 2019
- Leaf Number: 319862
- Location: Olympia, WA
- Contact: Website
Re: InsideEVs Apr 2023: "We are not too optimistic about the Leaf."
Wasn't this the same source that was all in on the Bolt's future? 
2011 SL; 44,598 mi, 87% SOH. 2013 S; 44,840 mi, 91% SOH. 2016 S30; 29,413 mi, 99% SOH. 2018 S; 25,185 mi, SOH 92.23%. 2019 S Plus; 46,415 mi, 90.94% SOH
My Blog; http://daveinolywa.blogspot.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
My Blog; http://daveinolywa.blogspot.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;