Any V2G or V2H charger available yet for US?

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Tandemrider

Member
Joined
Jul 9, 2016
Messages
18
Location
Seattle, WA; Big Island, HI
I am waiting to buy or lease a Leaf eplus until I can buy a V2G or V2H charger at a reasonable price.
Nissan says that they are using theirs in Japan but only seems to be trialing it elsewhere.
https://insideevs.com/news/363304/nissan-teases-v2g-criticizes-tesla/

As DougWantsaLeaf pointed out, Wallbox says that they are coming out with V2G EVSE including a DC powered unit:
https://cleantechnica.com/2019/07/26/wallbox-launches-in-us-china-adds-residential-bi-directional-dc-fast-charger/

Nuvve says that they have one but they don't answer email or voice mail:
https://nuvve.com/v2g-chargers/

Ovo Energy has been testing their V2G charger but still not available for sale to the public:
https://www.ovoenergy.com/electric-cars/vehicle-to-grid-charger

Coritech seems to have one available but it is too big to put in my garage. I would prefer one like Nuvve's:
https://coritech.com/ev-chargers
 
I emailed the engineer for the bidirectional inverter rectifier and they currently have no plans for the US at this point. It's not that simple as you need an automatic switch. I already installed a 16kw pv system that allows a second ac input. Will need a 3rd party option. If thinking about PV, the leaf in 240v mode will take 82% of an 8k system. So glad I did the extra work for 16 (2 outback radians paired up)
 
KeithBriggs said:
I emailed the engineer for the bidirectional inverter rectifier and they currently have no plans for the US at this point. It's not that simple as you need an automatic switch. I already installed a 16kw pv system that allows a second ac input. Will need a 3rd party option. If thinking about PV, the leaf in 240v mode will take 82% of an 8k system. So glad I did the extra work for 16 (2 outback radians paired up)

Not sure how you compute Keith, depends on how many miles, but.... we also have an 8KW solar array and use no where near 82% of the power... Approx. 1000 miles/month/4miles/KWH=250 KWH/month needed, or about 1/4 of the power we produce here even in the darkest months. If you drive 3500 miles/month this changes, of course.....
 
Appears Quasar is on the right track. Power is OK - not "quick" by any measure, but a reasonable start. I'd like to see at least a 10kw unit - which would work in most home (US) systems. The question is how robust will be the control programming, can it (sort of) be "AC coupled" with existing solar inverters to make the best use of solar generation (robust controls?). Being European - are they going to actually build a 240 VAC split phase unit - without adding a autotransformer?

The price is high, but certain energy contracts might be able to pay it out (sell back at actual energy value at the energy interval - ERCOT/Griddy).

A major issue is - can it be used to supply backup/emergency energy when the grid is down? - doesn't appear so.
 
Thanks for the reply Doug. I did find 2 on alibaba.

At first I was not excited because the one from SETEC ~ $2k usd was only 3kw rms but then I figured 10 hours at 3kw and I've gone thru 75% of my battery. My way of looking at it is that I'm adding storage to my 6 simpliphi batteries. This mini-inverter can handle most loads light and microwave or hair dryer. It can peak at 6kw so it should easily handle lights, microwave and a hair dryer but its unlikely to be able to handle a an electric range or an electric water heater.

1. for a non-PV system, this is a nice option to have power from the car when the grid is down. It seems you'd still need to install a double throw switch from your main panel to disconnect the grid and connect to the car and a 30a dryer vent plug-in. There does not not seem to be an issue with load balancing.

2. for a PV system It could be use as a grid simulator if plugged into the AC grid-in area of the inverter. My outback system has two AC inputs so this would be in the generator input. This seems esp useful for an off-grid setup. I thought about running the 370v dc straight into a schneider Conext MPPT 80 600 charge controller but I'm pretty sure this could only be used to discharge the LEAF and there's fewer ways to control it.

I could see charging your car at work or at a free charging station and draining it at home. Free "gas" and free electricity at home.

I can also see that its nice if you had your car, you also have a 3 to 6k watt power supply wherever you are.
 
Marktm said:
A major issue is - can it be used to supply backup/emergency energy when the grid is down? - doesn't appear so.

The biggest issue with supplying backup/emergency energy when the grid is down is the the legal requirement of disconnecting your service from the grid when on backup power. This needs to be done by a separate piece of equipment, not the V2G/V2H box. That equipment will usually have a way of making your local system think that the grid is not down and thus operate normally.

This requirement is for the safety of Hydro workers working on repairing the line. You don't want lines that they think are dead to be energized by your system. You also don't want to be feeding power to your entire neigbourhood. ;)
 
Agreed. My inverters are electric company approved. That is they run when the grid is up or down but wont connect to the grid to sell if they don't see a sin wave coming from the grid.

Simple approach without a PV inverter is to have a double throw switch connecting the grid or the LEAF as power supply to the home. The concept is call "islanding" as you are an island generator. Anti-islanding is the ability to not fry the guy or gal at the pole. Everyone is happier that way! Ideally an automatic switch that flips the grid off when it sees current from the car source and flips it back when when you drive off to get some groceries.

SETEC got back with me and wants more than a reseller is posting them for. 2249 plus 249 to fedex to USA. at 2500, that's equivalent to my 26 monthly meter costs for 8 years! Off grid its another story. They said the output is 220v but the specs give an output voltage range so I'm a bit confused on that. It is pure sin wave which is what I expected and that's what outback inverter wants.

Prices will come down when the world starts taking advantage of the huge storage in EVs. Its also a lot more messing around. You have the normal "car needs charging" event but then you have "house needs plugged in" every day???. What do you do when both need plugging in?

Nissan's integrated approach that they are using in Japan is ideal. I'll probably wait for something similar.
 
Marktm said:
Appears Quasar is on the right track.
...
A major issue is - can it be used to supply backup/emergency energy when the grid is down? - doesn't appear so.
I posted this in "TMC"

I'm in Vegas for CES. I spoke to these guys at their booth yesterday.

It's not shipping in the US yet. They told me that it still requires a connection to the grid. It won't help in an outage in its current form. I mentioned I'm PG&E-land and already experienced two "PSPS". The guy told me the reason is that if you have no grid power and let's say you turn on an oven. Suddenly, there's a huge jump in demand and CHAdeMO doesn't let you do have that sudden sharp increase. I don't recall if the words he used were that it has to be a ramp up or in steps.

It's something they want to work on addressing. I recall him saying that many folks either wanted the outage protection or mention PG&E PSPS.

So, for now, it's only useful cases where you might want to store power from the grid at cheaper rates or use during more expensive periods. Or, (IIRC), it can be useful for those who want to store excess solar energy.
 
Oilpan4 said:
Looks like a faster way to lose soh bars.
:)

Indeed. As I think I've posted this before, someone on a Leaf FB group in Japan had lost enough bars to take advantage of his capacity warranty on his 24 kWh Leaf. When I asked how, he mentioned had the V2H system.
 
cwerdna said:
The guy told me the reason is that if you have no grid power and let's say you turn on an oven. Suddenly, there's a huge jump in demand and CHAdeMO doesn't let you do have that sudden sharp increase. I don't recall if the words he used were that it has to be a ramp up or in steps.

That would make sense if the CHAdeMO (or CCS) cannot respond fast enough and result in a serious voltage drop in the AC side - even though the EV battery is plenty big enough to supply the DC current. There is also the issue of syncing up with the grid when the utility power comes back. The hybrid solar inverters that have battery storage for backup have figured all this out, but their storage batteries don't have the CHAdeMO/CCS protocols to deal with.
 
Demo'ed at the recent CES...Ex-Tesla Supercharge team member Doug Alfaro debuts the "Quasar" bi-directional EVSE. Priced at $4K. V2H system using Chademo connector. Sounds like it runs from a 40 amp circuit...Only works now on LEAFs and Outlanders...

https://ww.electrek.co/2020/01/06/wallbox-quasar-tesla-nissan/#
 
Greetings everyone, I find this thread doing some searches on bi-directional EV charging/V2H using a Nissan Leaf instead of buying an expensive/sizable external battery. So my first post here and bringing this thread alive again :)

Last week I signed my contract to install solar panels in our house (SE Texas area). Now I have an opportunity to do the install in a way to 'future proof' it for V2H set up. iIn about a year I would like to get an EV for city driving (second vehicle). At the moment, for a used EV, a Nissan Leaf is the game in town to be able to do bi-directional charging and I am ok with that. If it works out it will be our first ever EV.

To my research here are some options for bi-directional charging now or in the near future:

1) Hoping Solaredge latest HD Wave inverter/hub will support bi-directional charging with a firmware update in the near future. This is not for sure but something to find out more about through my solar panel installer. Cost: $2K to $3K range
2) dcbel r16 solar inverted/bi-directional charger combo. This would be my ideal choice but not available in my area yet and no timeline to my knowledge. Cost: $5K
3) Wallbox Quasar bidirectional home DC charger. Available now but the priciest of all so far at $4K just for the charger!
4) Nuvve upcoming residential bi-directional EV charger. Cost: ?. I have sent them an email to find out more.
5) Fermata Energy’s V2X systems. Cost: ?. I have sent them an email to find out more.

If anyone has more information to add to this list or more on the topic of how it will work with a Nissan Leaf and a PV system it would be appreciated.
 
Is your PV system grid-tie or stand alone? A grid-tie system will not generate any power if the grid is down regardless of whether it is connected to a house or a Leaf. If this is intended for disaster preparedness then some type of hybrid system that is grid-tied but can be run off-grid will be needed. The Leaf could be the 'battery' assuming you have a capable V2H setup. I'd imagine you would need to use a L2 EVSE to charge the car off the PV and then switch to V2H for the night time.
 
My 16kw outback radians allows up to 2 AC inputs. I had considered hooking the leaf to a charge controller but I was told that wont work by a midnite solar tech. A V2H inverter would have been my second AC input (usually a generator). I upgraded my simpliphi batteries to 8 100aH chinese rack batteries. At 48v using 80% capacity, these new rack batteries give me over 32kwH of storage. I'm set so I'm not going to invest in a v2h charger when available. 26usd meter fee is still way cheaper and convenient than a 3000usd 3kw inverter from alibaba.

I did install a 30a level 2 charger but do try to limit L2 charging as its slightly harder on the leaf bats. I put the circuit on a digital intermatic timer so its only available to charge from 8am to 4pm. I also piggybacked a 110v off the same timer box and use it primarily.

Speaking of intermatic timers, I put another one on my hottub. It comes on at 11am and does its filter cycle, then I shut it off at noon and turn it back on at 12:05pm and does its second filter cycle and runs normally until 11pm when I shut it off for the night (an hour before it would want to do another filter cycle). That way it does all its heavy lifting during the peak solar harvest and rarely taxes the batteries. This works because its balboa / waterway? brained tub. My old calspa in Colorado runs for about 5 hours when the power goes out and comes back on (which is nuts).
 
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