Lowest charge wattage possible?

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Kaktor

Member
Joined
Aug 26, 2018
Messages
12
Hello dear Humans and Robots!

Q:
What is the lowest power that the Leaf ZE0 will charge at and how to get it there?

Background:
I am thinking about getting a solar-generator (basically a mega-powerbank) which comes with a 500W inverter. And it occurred to me, that a portable 0.5kwh battery could mean the difference between reaching the next charger or a tow truck. But how to get the juice from the box into the car without blowing the poor little thing up?

Research:
The EVSE controlls the maximum power available to the EV via PWM in the charge-cable. But the lowest amount is 6A (is that true?). At 230v (I live in Europe), that is almost 1400w. But would that mean, that I can feed 110v through the granny lead? 110v x 6a is a mere 660W, which slowly comes into the area we can handle. A step-down transformer could do that, eh? I saw someone on youtube putting up some solar panels around their car, to catch some free power during the day. I wonder how they did it? Trickle-charge an external battery and then dump it in through a big inverter?

Any help is appreciated!
Cheers,
chris :)
 
I don't have first-hand experience with European Leafs but I'd "think" you could feed compatible EVSEs 120v @ 6a, all our Leafs in N. America will take either 120v or 240v nominal so I'd think?? yours might be the same. I really wouldn't suggest a step-down transformer as that would incur more losses, you'll already be incurring quite a bit of losses feeding your Leaf such low wattage as any charging has a minimum of losses which if you are charging higher wattages will be a smaller percentage of the base. It's my guess charging at 6a @ 120v that you might only get half the wattage into the battery and the rest could be losses.
Would you have access to a primary source of 120v, without using a somewhat heavy, expensive, lossy step-down transformer? That would be a better option in my opinion but if you weren't deterred by that then I'd say it should be possible to do what you proposed.
We don't have a lot of non-N. Americans here on MNL but we do have a few Europeans, Dala from Scandanavia would know your question for sure but I personally would be surprised if you had a different built-in charger than 120v countries, of course the EVSE you had would have to be capable if 120v operation. Most of the Chinese EVSE operate on both but in our case some EVSEs only work on 120v and maybe in your case they could possibly only work on 220?
 
Why not something off the shelf instead?

https://www.bluettipower.com/products/eb70s-716wh-800w-portable-power-station-best-solar-generator-for-camping

Has a built-in solar charge controller (MPPT) too.
 
Hello and thank you both!

Yes! Dala. He reads messages. I should try reaching him.

Yes! Bluetti. Hah, that is exactly why I was asking.
But they only deliver 1 type of voltage, so I'd have to decide between (possible) car-charger at 110 or home-use at 230.

For solar-re-charging, I need a specific one, because I have a big 24V panel. Only the AC200MAX (for 2000+ moneys) and the affordable AC50S will charge from panels with that voltage.
The big one delivers 2kw+, so that would be really nice and work okay with 230x6A- but expensive and heavy. But the small one will only deliver 300W on 230V - interestingly also on 110V, so double the Amps!

Hm. I might just shell out for the 2kw / 2kwh Bluetti for a proper home-backup and proper reserve-battery for the road. However 2200€ vs 450€ is quite an investment.

Thanks for thinking with me and cheers!
chris :)
 
I left Dala a message through the website.

Also, Klicking around, I found the Ecoflow Delta Mini, which has almost the highest cost-per-kwh, but comes with 48v solar charging and a 1400W inverter for 800 buckaroos less than the Bluetti AC200max. Jackery's products all have too low wattage.

I also found that I could not find a proper comparison between all those things and I had to each individual spec sheet :/
 
Zendure has some pretty cool products:

https://zendure.com/collections/power-station/products/zendure-superbase-m-portable-power-station

Realize though that not long ago they were a start-up, so their products might not be as mature as Ecoflow or Bluetti products.

I have no personal experience with Zendure products, but many people on solar forums and such rave about them.

Check out Will Prowse's YouTube channel too, he does lots of product reviews and he's very knowledgeable and brutally honest in his reviews.
 
Kaktor said:
...
The EVSE controlls the maximum power available to the EV via PWM in the charge-cable. But the lowest amount is 6A (is that true?). At 230v (I live in Europe), that is almost 1400w. But would that mean, that I can feed 110v through the granny lead? 110v x 6a is a mere 660W, which slowly comes into the area we can handle. A step-down transformer could do that, eh? ...

Keep in mind that the vehicle consumes power while charging; something on the order of 300 watts or more, to power the electronics and coolant circulation pumps. Factor in conversion losses (DC to 230v to 120v, and then 120v to 500vdc), and very little of your stored .5 kWH is going to end up in the LEAF's traction pack. All said and done, I'd expect maybe 1km of range. I think in order for this to have practical application you'd need a significantly higher capacity storage battery which would also allow for a more powerful inverter and less conversion loss.
 
Hello and thanks for more ideas.

I just found this:
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1284659132/bigblue-cellpowa2500-all-in-one-emergenccy-power-source/description

Which is either a scam or epicly cheap! Super early bird for 10 more hours. Currently half the price compared to other brands.
It does 2500w, has nice handles for carrying and can even do UPS. PV inputs are in my voltage range.

Fingers crossed.
cheers :D
 
500W charging is possible. Install a CAN-bridge with this code, modify it to restrict PDM to 500W max https://github.com/dalathegreat/Nissan-Leaf-ChargeCurrent . Then you can use whatever 230V 8A charger, and it will charge at 500W max.

However, it is a terrible idea. You will loose 300W to simply run the modules and coolant pumps, so only 200W will make it into the battery. Better to build something capable of 1000W, less losses that way!
 
Hi Dala,

of course you are a member of this forum :lol:

Thanks for the detailed answer.
Ya, this is nothing for a daily commute. Rather to limp to the next charger when everything else goes wrong. Good to know how big the basic consumption of the car is.

I ordered (kickstarted) a bigger battery-box now.

Is there a way to charge while driving? Or just offset the power used? I know that Muxan installs extra batteries. Maybe a small "detachable extra battery"?
Just curious.

Cheers!
chris :)
 
Just trickle charge using the stock EVSE and the 120V or 240V receptacle of the portable power bank you've just bought. The extender pack that Muxsan sells looks like a well designed product, but there's no way you can DIY anything close to that good of a range extender.

Save your money and be content with the solution you've already purchased. Honestly, it's really unlikely you'll ever use it for charging your LEAF as the car gives plenty of warning before you reach turtle mode.
 
This product seems very capable and reasonably priced too, based on all that it can do:

https://youtu.be/b38d19KlhDQ

The TT30 receptacle is rated for 25A, so a 120V adjustable EVSE could safely demand 20A, which would provide 2.4 kW EV charging. With a 4.5 kWh capacity, that would be almost 2 hours of charging at that rate.

3000W inverter (continuous) is pretty sweet too, as is the built-in 1500W MPPT PV controller.
 
Ya, right 4000 monies for 4.5kwh is a good price. I hope the kickstarter turns out a useable product ^^

Thanks :)
 
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