Obviously, green H2 would be preferable, but it would be dumb to limit our options at this point.
Which is why we still burn coal. We just hate to be constrained.
Obviously, green H2 would be preferable, but it would be dumb to limit our options at this point.
GRA said:While I'd prefer not to, if we can burn coal while capturing all the CO2 and other harmful emissions, okay by me. As we're stuck using coal in large quantities for decades yet, as at best we're at the dem-val or early commercialization stages of non-fossil fuel production of steel and cement and we can't do without those, we'd better do as much development and deployment as we can of CCUS.
Considering both the uncaptured carbon dioxide and the large emissions of unburned, so-called “fugitive” methane emissions inherent in using natural gas, the carbon footprint to create blue hydrogen is more than 20% greater than burning either natural gas or coal directly for heat, or about 60% greater than using diesel oil for heat, according to the new paper.
Emissions of blue hydrogen are less than for gray hydrogen, but not greatly so: perhaps surprisingly, only by about 9% to 12%.
WetEV said:GRA said:While I'd prefer not to, if we can burn coal while capturing all the CO2 and other harmful emissions, okay by me. As we're stuck using coal in large quantities for decades yet, as at best we're at the dem-val or early commercialization stages of non-fossil fuel production of steel and cement and we can't do without those, we'd better do as much development and deployment as we can of CCUS.
Hydrogen is mostly worse than coal. Excluding the very tiny and very expensive green hydrogen, of course.
WetEV said:Only a fraction of the CO2 is "captured" in a CCUS system. All isn't realistic. Especially over the entire fuel cycle, not just combustion.
Attempting to capture CO2 and produce "blue hydrogen" releases more net CO2 than just burning the natural gas.
Considering both the uncaptured carbon dioxide and the large emissions of unburned, so-called “fugitive” methane emissions inherent in using natural gas, the carbon footprint to create blue hydrogen is more than 20% greater than burning either natural gas or coal directly for heat, or about 60% greater than using diesel oil for heat, according to the new paper.
Emissions of blue hydrogen are less than for gray hydrogen, but not greatly so: perhaps surprisingly, only by about 9% to 12%.
“No further new developments are planned,” Markus Schäfer, Daimler board member responsible for research and development, told Germany’s Handelsblatt newspaper in Munich. “The investments have been made, to that extent, we are using them.”
Future Toyota Prime plug-in hybrids: How much range and performance?
There will be future Prime plug-in hybrids from Toyota. Just don’t necessarily expect them to raise the bar for the genre quite like the RAV4 Prime.
That’s among the takeaways from a recent check-in on Toyota’s electrification strategy with Cooper Ericksen, Toyota Motor North America VP for product planning and strategy.
But first off, it’s worth considering what Toyota is doing differently with plug-in hybrids. It brought new life—and excitement—to a formula GM led and then abandoned with the Volt, and those who question the place for plug-in hybrids in today’s market need not look further than the RAV4 Prime. As we’ve pointed out in various tests, ranging from a first drive to off-roading, the Prime helps make all-electric daily driving accessible—resulting in a vehicle that doesn’t feel hobbled by extra weight. . . .
Not all of Toyota's plug-in hybrids deliver that level of range and performance though. The Prius Prime offers 25 all-electric miles and gets 54 mpg combined as a hybrid. But it takes about 10.2 seconds to get to 60 mph.
Will we see much more than the RAV4 Prime's range, or even quicker acceleration, from future Prime models? And will future Prime models represent the best performance of any given model line?
Not necessarily. Ericksen explained that firstly, the RAV4 Prime was a special case; and secondly, it’s really not in the interest of efficiency to carry more battery than you need for a daily driving commute.
“Our research indicates the average customer commutes in that 20-to-30-miles-per-day range,” Ericksen explained. “The key to a plug-in is to have the right range to do your daily tasks on EV only, plugging in, in your garage—and then you have the hybrid portion for long trips, so it's one car that in today's world can really do the job of multiple cars.”
Sweet spot: Just enough to cover the commute, year round
“So frankly, from a consumer standpoint, 40 miles is pretty much where it needs to be,” Ericksen continued, perhaps to cover needs like weather. “You start going above that, you have weight, you have cost.”
That aligns closely with the logic behind a cutoff we’ve applied for years to plug-in hybrid contenders for Green Car Reports’ Best Car To Buy—that any qualifying vehicle needs at least the distance of the average daily commute. While in recent years that’s been about 32 miles, according to a semi-annual AAA survey, this year’s Covid patterns dropped that number to 30 miles.
Ericksen added that Toyota wants to continue to improve the plug-in range of future Prime models without adding battery weight.
There is one exception to that, based on the California Advanced Clean Cars II regulation that proposes a 50-mile electric range from plug-in hybrids. Ericksen explained: “Is that something we could achieve to get the credit value? Probably is; we're pretty close right now. Is it something that the customer is demanding? I don't think so.”
Next, Toyota is expected to take the Prime formula up a size, to the Highlander. Although Ericksen wouldn’t confirm that, he hinted that applying it to bigger, heavier vehicles won’t yield the same range.
“The smaller and lighter weight and more aerodynamic a vehicle is, the easier it is to produce range. Yet one of the biggest needs, one of the biggest impacts on the environment, is the ability to address three-row SUVs, trucks—and so we think there's a use case for plug-ins, on larger vehicles. But frankly, the 50 miles would be very difficult on a large vehicle like that.
“So we think there should be a sliding scale of...what from an engineering standpoint is feasible at an affordable price point,” Ericksen explained. For a big SUV that might mean 25 to 30 miles fully electric, while on a car or a RAV4 Prime, 50 miles could make sense. . . .
'Electrified’ means full hybrid or better
In the U.S., Toyota is looking for 70% of its sales to be electrified by 2030, of which the majority will be hybrids but “a significant portion” will be PHEVs. Battery electrics and fuel-cell models, combined, will make up 15% of U.S. sales by then by Toyota's estimate.
That electrified portion won’t include baby steps like mild-hybrid technology; they’ll be full hybrids at the least, Ericksen asserted. This past year, Toyota introduced two models, the Sienna minivan and Venza crossover, that are only offered as hybrids, and Toyota just added hybrid tech to the Tundra pickup.
I'm skeptical that the car does not have a PTC. She might be able to heat up the ICE at home with an engine block heater and then drive EV to work if she keeps the cabin heating/defrost load down.jjeff said:My daughter's Hyundai Ionic PHEV is another story, close to 30 miles in the summer but basically 0 in the winter, well if you want any heat as it doesn't have an electric heater, you turn on the heat and the ICE always fires up. I guess with it's tiny(8kw ish) battery if it did have electric heat the range would probably drop to the low teens.
SageBrush said:I'm skeptical that the car does not have a PTC. She might be able to heat up the ICE at home with an engine block heater and then drive EV to work if she keeps the cabin heating/defrost load down.jjeff said:My daughter's Hyundai Ionic PHEV is another story, close to 30 miles in the summer but basically 0 in the winter, well if you want any heat as it doesn't have an electric heater, you turn on the heat and the ICE always fires up. I guess with it's tiny(8kw ish) battery if it did have electric heat the range would probably drop to the low teens.
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