Is the evse upgrade ul approved ?

[gkalexdc]

i understand, so anyone without any certification and or legal electrical ...

I suggest you NOT buy one. Problem solved.

I seconds this opinion, to Not Buy it if you're so UL'd out about this . I bought it, it worked great, sold my Leaf to my sis , who never bought a permanently installed ESVE and uses the Ingineer genius upgrade, and saved THAT money.
You can lawyer up on any issue if you want to keep digging!!!

 

[MikeD]

Ingineer: 2011 NEC Article 625.19 (Automatic De-Energization of Cable) "The electric vehicle supply equipment or the cable-connector combination of the equipment shall be provided with an automatic means to de-energize the cable conductors and electric vehicle connector upon exposure to strain that could result in either cable rupture or separation of the cable from the electric connector and exposure of live parts. Automatic means to de-energize the cable conductors and electric vehicle connector shall not be required for portable cord-and-plug-connected electric vehicle supply equipment intended for connection to receptacle outlets rated at 125 volts, single phase, 15 and 20 amperes."

I do not know if any of the portable Nissan 120v EVSEs that have come with the Leaf have the "Automatic De-Energization of Cable" functionality (I have inquired, but not yet gotten in touch with someone who knows) -- and the NEC appears not to require it since these Nissan EVSEs are intended for 15/20a 120v receptacles.

If they do not have this functionality, then it would appear that your 120/240v EVSE Update EVSE violates this article. This would be especially problematic since you have modified the original NEMA 5-15p plug (which can easily pull out of its receptacle w/o damage -- probably why the article does not apply to EVSEs with such plugs) with a locking type plug (either NEMA L6-20p or L6-30p) which is designed NOT to easily pull out if inserted into a corresponding receptacle that is firmly mounted on a wall. Hence an accident resulting in a substantial pulling force on the EVSE's cable while charging could result in pulling apart the receptacle, plug, cord, or cable possibly resulting in the exposure of electrically live wires -- a shock/fire hazard.

However, if these EVSEs do have the "Automatic De-Energization of Cable" functionality, then the EVSE Update does seem to meet this section of the current NEC.

 

[LTLFTcomposite]

It sure looks to me like the schneider evlink doesn't meet that cable breakaway requirement either.

 

[TonyWilliams]

I don't have a horse in this race. Electric vehicle owners should be informed and make their own decisions.

Which makes your "admonishments" all the more odd.

 

[QueenBee]

It sure looks to me like the schneider evlink doesn't meet that cable breakaway requirement either.

What have manufacturers been doing to implement this? On our OpenEVSEs we've just been trying to make the pilot wire the shortest wire but that only helps if the J1772 side is what rips out first. If it rips off the wall and the power source side breaks way first then not much help that is. Personally I'm curious what the scenario they are concerned about is. Not to say that it's not a possibility that the cable could be ripped off the EVSE AND be energized at the time but it seems like it would require a cascade of failures.

 

[KillaWhat]

Wow, I can't believe so many legitimate Leafers let this go on for 11 pages.

I guess its like a car wreck, you just can't look away or something.

Love my EVSE upgrade.
Trust it more than the original.

 

[TonyWilliams]

It sure looks to me like the schneider evlink doesn't meet that cable breakaway requirement either.

If that just means that it will deenergize should the cable become disconnected in some way. That's easy enough to add, as I did to my home unit.

EV's can roll quite easily, and should they be plugged in, something will give. Mostly likely, the unit will be ripped off the wall (if mounted) and expose live wires (which has no standard to power off if disconnected).

 

[RobertC]

Ingineer: 2011 NEC Article 625.19 (Automatic De-Energization of Cable) "The electric vehicle supply equipment or the cable-connector combination of the equipment shall be provided with an automatic means to de-energize the cable conductors and electric vehicle connector upon exposure to strain that could result in either cable rupture or separation of the cable from the electric connector and exposure of live parts. Automatic means to de-energize the cable conductors and electric vehicle connector shall not be required for portable cord-and-plug-connected electric vehicle supply equipment intended for connection to receptacle outlets rated at 125 volts, single phase, 15 and 20 amperes."

I do not know if any of the portable Nissan 120v EVSEs that have come with the Leaf have the "Automatic De-Energization of Cable" functionality (I have inquired, but not yet gotten in touch with someone who knows) -- and the NEC appears not to require it since these Nissan EVSEs are intended for 15/20a 120v receptacles.

If they do not have this functionality, then it would appear that your 120/240v EVSE Update EVSE violates this article. This would be especially problematic since you have modified the original NEMA 5-15p plug (which can easily pull out of its receptacle w/o damage -- probably why the article does not apply to EVSEs with such plugs) with a locking type plug (either NEMA L6-20p or L6-30p) which is designed NOT to easily pull out if inserted into a corresponding receptacle that is firmly mounted on a wall. Hence an accident resulting in a substantial pulling force on the EVSE's cable while charging could result in pulling apart the receptacle, plug, cord, or cable possibly resulting in the exposure of electrically live wires -- a shock/fire hazard.

However, if these EVSEs do have the "Automatic De-Energization of Cable" functionality, then the EVSE Update does seem to meet this section of the current NEC.

The SAE J1772 handle connector is designed to come apart under heavy strain and trip the contractor inside the EVSE for permanently mounted chargers. Since the portable cords that come with electric vehicles have straight blade or pin connectors (even those sold in Japan and Europe), the plug will pull out of the outlet before the SAE J1772 handle connector comes apart. I'm not sure why EVSE Upgrade decided on a twist lock.

 

[Ingineer]

Ingineer: 2011 NEC Article 625.19 (Automatic De-Energization of Cable) "The electric vehicle supply equipment or the cable-connector combination of the equipment shall be provided with an automatic means to de-energize the cable conductors and electric vehicle connector upon exposure to strain that could result in either cable rupture or separation of the cable from the electric connector and exposure of live parts. Automatic means to de-energize the cable conductors and electric vehicle connector shall not be required for portable cord-and-plug-connected electric vehicle supply equipment intended for connection to receptacle outlets rated at 125 volts, single phase, 15 and 20 amperes."

I do not know if any of the portable Nissan 120v EVSEs that have come with the Leaf have the "Automatic De-Energization of Cable" functionality (I have inquired, but not yet gotten in touch with someone who knows) -- and the NEC appears not to require it since these Nissan EVSEs are intended for 15/20a 120v receptacles.

If they do not have this functionality, then it would appear that your 120/240v EVSE Update EVSE violates this article. This would be especially problematic since you have modified the original NEMA 5-15p plug (which can easily pull out of its receptacle w/o damage -- probably why the article does not apply to EVSEs with such plugs) with a locking type plug (either NEMA L6-20p or L6-30p) which is designed NOT to easily pull out if inserted into a corresponding receptacle that is firmly mounted on a wall. Hence an accident resulting in a substantial pulling force on the EVSE's cable while charging could result in pulling apart the receptacle, plug, cord, or cable possibly resulting in the exposure of electrically live wires -- a shock/fire hazard.

However, if these EVSEs do have the "Automatic De-Energization of Cable" functionality, then the EVSE Update does seem to meet this section of the current NEC.

The SAE J1772 handle connector is designed to come apart under heavy strain and trip the contractor inside the EVSE for permanently mounted chargers. Since the portable cords that come with electric vehicles have straight blade or pin connectors (even those sold in Japan and Europe), the plug will pull out of the outlet before the SAE J1772 handle connector comes apart. I'm not sure why EVSE Upgrade decided on a twist lock.

The twist lock prevents the portable EVSE from unplugging itself when used with an adapter cable, where it may be hanging from said adapter.

I have MikeD on my ignore list, so I never see his posts unless someone quotes them. I'll take this one though: The Automatic De-Energization only applies to the EVSE to EV cable. It is exempted for Level 1, but most EVSE's properly implement it anyway, including the EVSE Upgrade. If you subject the EVSE cable to sufficient strain, the tiny pilot signal wire will fail long before the the power handling wires which are many times thicker and heavier. In addition, if the cable is pulled out of it's clamp on either the EVSE side or the J1772 handle side, the pilot signal will be interrupted long before there is any possible exposure of current-carrying conductors.

If you doubt my claims, feel free to experiment on your own EVSE, or I'll be happy to film it if you want to send your unit in.

The intent of this protection is mainly to prevent electrocutions and/or fires in public Level 2 installations where EVSE cables are subject to much more abuse and damage. If you pull an EVSE off the wall in your own garage (whether one of my upgrades or another brand) and there are a couple of hot wires sticking out where it was connected, and you are stupid enough to go touch (or lick) them, there is likely no safety system possible that will save you from (hopefully) earning a Darwin award.

If you are worried about the twist-lock causing a dangerous safety issue, simply don't lock it. You have the option.

Hopefully most of the people here also have MikeD now on ignore so there will be less chance someone will quote him. He's a FUD spewing troll, and I'm not sure why I'm wasting my time. There are thousands of upgraded EVSE's out there in daily use all over the world, and we have a perfect safety record. Go away now!

-Phil

 

[TomT]

Because that is a standard for 240... It also prevents the EVSE from becoming unplugged when used with the adapter cable, and is safer from shock than the old style flat pin dryer-style connector.

I'm not sure why EVSE Upgrade decided on a twist lock.

 

[Ingineer]

Because that is a standard for 240... It also prevents the EVSE from becoming unplugged when used with the adapter cable

I'm not sure why EVSE Upgrade decided on a twist lock.

There are numerous reasons. For starters, for anyone who's actually bothered to USE all the various 240V plugs out there, you'll quickly realize the century-old flat-blade designs such as 10-x, 6-x, 14-x are not finger-safe. It's really easy to find your fingers wrapped around the plug body touching the 2 hot blades which are conveniently located to expose you to 240v.

The newer designs of the twist-locks are much safer, more compact, more reliable, and the locking feature in many cases actually prevents a plug from working itself out of the receptacle which could lead to arcing and subsequent fire.

-Phil

 

[MikeD]

Here are some (recently produced, I think) documents I found that may help people better understand current NEC requirement for EVSEs:

http://honda.leviton.com/infocenter/evse-fact-sheet" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://www.afdc.energy.gov/pdfs/EV_charging_template.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

 

[KillaWhat]

you'll quickly realize the century-old flat-blade designs such as 10-x, 6-x, 14-x are not finger-safe. It's really easy to find your fingers wrapped around the plug body touching the 2 hot blades which are conveniently located to expose you to 240v.

Thank you Soooo much!
You described MY concern perfectly

Everybody thinks I'm an idiot because I believe putting a 32 Amp EVSE on dryer plugs where any little kid can mess with it is a BAD idea.
I may still be an idiot, but not because of this particular belief :roll:

Child Safety thread:
http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=13091&p=298441&hilit=paranoid#p298441" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

 

[MikeD]

KillaWhat: An even safer plug/receptacle than the Twist-Locks to consider is the Safety-Shroud TWIST-LOCK® System (available from Hubble, who invented the Twist-Lock) to prevent anyone from touching live prongs while inserting/removing plug from receptacle:

http://www.hubbellcatalog.com/wiring/catalogpages/section-b.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; (Starts on page 17)

 

[TonyWilliams]

KillaWhat: An even safer plug/receptacle than the Twist-Locks to consider is the Safety-Shroud TWIST-LOCK® System (available from Hubble, who invented the Twist-Lock) to prevent anyone from touching live prongs while inserting/removing plug from receptacle:

http://www.hubbellcatalog.com/wiring/catalogpages/section-b.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; (Starts on page 17)

I don't know if I recommend a whole new series of plugs. It's hard enough finding places to plug into.
Most small home use generators are going to have L14-20amp or -30amp locking plugs.

A different link for guys doing "future proof" 50 amp service, I recommend these Hubbell "safety" plugs which will fit things already in use, like commercial generator sets. The Tesla Roadster EVSE uses these connectors, and the Tesla Model S and Rav4 EV Gen II can both operate at their full 40 amps on a single onboard charger:

3-POLE 4-WIRE 50 AMP 125/250V AC
CS6369A
CS6365
CS6364
CS6375A

Hubbell catalog

 

[RobertC]

The Tesla Roadster EVSE uses these connectors, and the Tesla Model S ...

I'm not sure why EVSE Upgrade decided on a twist lock.

There are numerous reasons. For starters, for anyone who's actually bothered to USE all the various 240V plugs out there, you'll quickly realize the century-old flat-blade designs such as 10-x, 6-x, 14-x are not finger-safe. It's really easy to find your fingers wrapped around the plug body touching the 2 hot blades which are conveniently located to expose you to 240v.

The Tesla portable charging cord that can draw up to 40 amps was submitted for UL certification and is NEC compliant comes with two adapters and can be connected with 5 different adapters (not extension cords) that are all straight blade plugs. It can charge at 120-240 volts. A licensed or qualified electrician is required to only connect equipment that conforms to the National Electrical Code.

http://www.teslamotors.com/sites/default/files/downloads/universalmobileconnector_nema_14-50.pdf

 

[MikeD]

RobertC: Just to emphasize what it says in your Tesla link (and which you alluded to): "Do NOT use an extension cord". This safety advice is just as wise for any cord-and-plug-connected EVSE, IMO.

Now I know that in an emergency situation most people will resort to using an extension cord, especially if they deem the conditions not too dangerous (like no rain, thunderstorms, the occasional tornado, etc). But risks add up quickly if one uses extension cords too often -- especially on a regular basis. As that great American J.R. Ewing (now departed) once said: "Once you lose your integrity, the rest is a piece of cake!". No truer words were ever spoken.

 

[davewill]

... A licensed or qualified electrician is required to only connect equipment that conforms to the National Electrical Code. ...

Your concern is duly noted.

 

[MikeD]

I received a phone call from Nissan Leaf Customer Service responding to my Chat inquiry (from about a week ago) about whether or not the portable 120v Nissan-labelled EVSE that comes with all new Leafs had the current NEC functionality for Article 615.18 (Interlock) and 625-19 (Automatic De-Energization of Cable) even though they were not required for "portable cord-and-plug-connected EVSEs intended for connection to receptacle outlets rated at 125 volts, single phase, 15 and 20 amperes" like those Nissan EVSEs.

I was told that according to their Technical Support group, the EVSE in question DID have this functionality -- which is important for readers of this OP to have confirmed.

On the other hand, I wonder if UL will test a device for some functionality not required by NEC, like for example the 2013 version of this EVSE which has thermal monitoring of its NEMA input plug -- i.e. it will discontinue charging if it detects too high a temperature at that plug (due to, for example, a loosely connecting receptacle which results in arcing between it and the plug).

 

[davidh]

I actually would like to hear the scenario where you think the EVSE catches your house on fire.

I've seen numerous pictures on various EV websites showing outlets and/or EVSE plugs that were clearly discolored/melted due to excessive heat. Hope you're not discounting this as a completely impossible scenario.

Certainly happens, but what I'm curious about is how it goes from that to a house fire. I guess it would help if I had a better understanding of the temperatures required to catch household items like carpet, rugs, drapes, fabrics, drywall, wood, etc. on fire.

Fahrenheit 451.