Is the Leaf right for my lifestyle, opinion POV

[Herm]

Maybe my temperature concerns were overblown, it does get into the mid 90s at noon time in Central Florida's asphalt jungle, but then it rains like clockwork at 3pm and it cools off nicely..

The Volt wont handle 3 kids, but you do have other cars. How much are you spending on gas now?

 

[BrainDonor]

Another point to consider is how much you'll have to pay for the juice at the public L2 stations. While some of them may be free now, they won't be for long. Here in South Florida we have a few Chargepoint stations and they cost about $3/hr.

Having said that, the savings for your long commutes would be significant. Your 350Z costs around $0.15/mile to operate (assuming average gas cost of $3.50). My LEAF costs about $0.03/mile in electricity from FP&L at home. So if you can achieve a similar cost for electricity, then you'll be saving about $3,000 per year (just in gas, not to mention lower maintenance costs) for 25,000 miles!

 

[rblover69]

Agreed, I love the different views

We currently have a 07 Sentra 34mpg
My current car is a 06 350z I average 20mpg maybe 23 if I'm lucky.

I checked the back of my job, and it doesn't seem to have a 120v ...the savings would be there but there are what ifs.

- charge point station down on the wingate location or busy then I would have to go to international drive ; how long would I be waiting there for some juice? Lol

- deviation from the commute will be a serious issue because of my distance living in poinciana : Kissimmee

I'm still going to test drive both, but the Volt may indeed be a better just in case EV... I can't stand American cars but all in the sense of efficiency

I love the Leaf because the low Maintance ...that would be my main focus....but not being able to use to the car to let's say go to cocoa beach is the stickler. ....can't take it to drill at Melbourne either because there are no charge stations there damn....it's hard to project when these things will be avaiable or else I would jump on the leaf in a heart beat. I prefer a nissan over a Chevy because of reliability and refinement .

 

[coqui]

I'd jump on the Leaf if I were you. Especially with as mild a climate as you have. Talk about cheap to drive, I am averaging about 1/4 the cost of a Prius (already a gas saver).

 

[kovalb]

The main sticking point is having a charging station where you work that you can depend upon 100% of the time. If you had that you would be in great shape. However, the times you can't charge at work mean you would need to have close to 100 mile autonomous range. Generally speaking at 55mph you could do that - but it would be close. There are two exceptions:

Exception 1: Cold weather with heater use will lower your range considerably.
Exception 2: As the battery ages it will lose energy capacity. My guess is to expect about 20% reduction after about five years.

Since you say you would be relying on public charging I would have to recommend against getting a LEAF. By the way, I live in Phoenix drive about 33 miles each way commuting, and charge at work (100% of the time). It works out great for me.

 

[smkettner]

92 miles round trip is doable but I would not buy LEAF unless I could charge at work. Even L1 120v would be fine. For me and that commute charging would need to be guaranteed available at work every day.

 

[GaslessInSeattle]

you live in an ideal climate for the Leaf and your commute is not a big deal, I really don't understand what all the nay saying is about, it's kind of unbelievable, IMHO. with even an hour or two of L2 charging you'd be fine driving at the speeds you are talking about. If you had L1 at work, you'd be fine. Chargepoint is my favorite type of charging station so far, well accept for an Eaton QC, having those all over the place will be game over for foreign oil. without having to try very hard, you should be able to get over 80 miles with a 100% charge even using AC. like has been said, the AC is not a big drain, it's that resistive heater and the effect of cold on the battery that's had us biting our nails up north.

I don't know how much the cost of electricity is where you are but if it's near the national average around 14 cents kWh, you will be seeing amazing savings over gas. At around 10 cents a kWh, we've put over 11,000 miles on our car for around $300 in electricity!

I'd say go for it, you'll figure out the details in the process!

If you don't have a second car and need a long distance runner, the volt is a better option, but for simplicities sake, the Leaf is hard to beat!!

 

[rblover69]

What i may do is a two phase EV transition. Since we need a family car regaurdless because the Sentra and my 350z isnt ideal. So i may get the Volt for a transitional vehicle , and then eventually trade her sentra in for the Leaf for my commute use. That way we both save, its hard for me to jump right now considering my job doesnt have a 120V option and the ChargePoint will be my only option ( i already seen ICE trucks parking in the spots ).

By then i can get used to the EV transition her into it and be savings alot ...although the intial VOLT price is rather uphauling. I am getting the leaf eventually for myself reguardless, i love the car, but i have to be smart with my needs, especially to drive to melboune which i drill for the AF doesnt have no Chargers. But thats the plan....i cant stand american cars and wish there was another nissan alternative but i think its the best bet?

 

[walterbays]

I checked the back of my job, and it doesn't seem to have a 120v ...the savings would be there but there are what ifs.

Ask if they'd be willing to install an outdoor 120v outlet if you pay for the installation and the electricity. Since we're talking pennies an hour, there's no need for complicated expensive meters and billing systems; just counting the hours and dropping quarters in a cardboard box would be fine. Bonus for them: they get a free outlet for maintenance work.

I'm still going to test drive both, but the Volt may indeed be a better just in case EV... I can't stand American cars but all in the sense of efficiency

I think Leaf would work for most people, but you might not be one of them. I wouldn't worry about the Volt. By all reports GM is taking special care of fit and finish and it's a solidly built car. Besides, starting next year Leaf will be built in America too, and exported. A Volt would let you greatly reduce your gasoline use and driving cost from your Z. But if Leaf would work for you, you'd have significantly lower operating costs than the Volt and would avoid all the maintenance costs of carrying around the extra gasoline engine and the complex power train.

I love the Leaf because the low Maintance ...that would be my main focus....but not being able to use to the car to let's say go to cocoa beach is the stickler. ....can't take it to drill at Melbourne either because there are no charge stations there

Check http://www.plugshare.com/. I see three charging stations in Kissimmee, three in Melbourne, one in Cocoa Beach, and of course many in Orlando.

You might try talking to the folks at Chargepoint who seem to be putting in most of the stations there. I-95 and 528 looks like a great spot to put a quick charge station to sell to drivers traveling between Orlando and the coast. If they had plans for such a station and if they were willing to tell you about it, that could change your situation dramatically for the better.

You might also carry a log book for a few weeks to "simulate" future driving experience. Record odometer readings to see each day: when the Volt's battery would be depleted and how much (premium) fuel you'd burn; whether the Leaf would go the entire distance without recharging; how long you could conveniently stop at charging stations and how much range would be replenished.

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

in 18 months most of us wont even recognize the area we live in. EVs are set to explode. for the OP; right now its a tough stretch. you say you "could" charge "near" work. how do you plan to shuttle back and forth or is it in walking distance?

if so, you need to have a minimum of 2-3 options. as EVs come in, they will be vying for charge time as well. i could easily see you finding a station taken where your best option would be to plug in at lunch and pick up in the evening.

as far as the distance. it could be done. you have the weather for it. i routinely was able to get 90 miles in summer on the freeway. you might have to slow it down a bit.

now, keep in mind; right now there are a very few EV options out there that are in our price range. in 2 years, that will have changed and it will be cars that have not even been announced yet. i feel like there will be a rush to EVs as more support comes out of the woodwork for them

 

[evnow]

So in essense if i where to own a Leaf i would be charging when i get to work for the drive home probably leave it there and pic it up on my lunch break.

If you have chargers within walking distance of your work - and willing to walk to-from work to the charger everyday, you can pull it off. There is a forum member who drives 70 miles (one way) to work every day.

At over 25k miles per year, you will run out of warranty within 4 years. Any miles you get after 100k on the battery should be considered a bonus. So, do include a new battery (or a new EV) in your TCO.

If you can afford it, you can buy the base Model S - that will easily handle your required RT range - but will have the same battery logevity concerns.

 

[GaslessInSeattle]

seems like the folks who are racking up the miles on the leaf have not reported capacity loss, and certainly nothing to indicate that at the end of a 100,000 miles, it could be toast... is there something I've missed? Last I heard, Nissan was quick charging a Leaf "to death" and after 100,000 miles on the bench with something like 5 quick charges a day, it's still working to original specs.

... Any miles you get after 100k on the battery should be considered a bonus. So, do include a new battery (or a new EV) in your TCO. ...

 

[evnow]

seems like the folks who are racking up the miles on the leaf have not reported capacity loss, and certainly nothing to indicate that at the end of a 100,000 miles, it could be toast... is there something I've missed?

But nobody has hit 100k miles.

Last I heard, Nissan was quick charging a Leaf "to death" and after 100,000 miles on the bench with something like 5 quick charges a day, it's still working to original specs.

Original specs ? You mean zero capacity loss ? First I've heard about it.

Just to clarify,
- I do expect battery to last after 100k miles. But I also expect 20 to 30% degradation by then. Could be less, could be more - who knows ?
- Once Li battery hits its "usable" life (i.e. about 80% capacity), the degradation is uneven. We should not expect a slow capacity loss after that - we could have fairly quick degradations and failures. May be some cells need to be replaced or in worst case we need a new battery.

 

[GaslessInSeattle]

One Roadster owner I talked with said we should expect the first 5-10 drop in capacity to happen quickly, like within a year or two (which is not being reported by even the high mileage owners yet, what are they at now, 40-50K?) and then it would level out from there for a gradual decline of 20-30% over 100K. then again, we've got different batteries. I'm not expecting miracles, it just sounded from your previous post that you felt that anything over 100K was gravy and that maybe you were aware of some new finding that I had not run across. I expect this battery to go much further than a 100K and am optimistic that it could outperform any other we've seen so far... we'll see, fingers crossed.

seems like the folks who are racking up the miles on the leaf have not reported capacity loss, and certainly nothing to indicate that at the end of a 100,000 miles, it could be toast... is there something I've missed?

But nobody has hit 100k miles.

Last I heard, Nissan was quick charging a Leaf "to death" and after 100,000 miles on the bench with something like 5 quick charges a day, it's still working to original specs.

Original specs ? You mean zero capacity loss ? First I've heard about it.

Just to clarify,
- I do expect battery to last after 100k miles. But I also expect 20 to 30% degradation by then. Could be less, could be more - who knows ?
- Once Li battery hits its "usable" life (i.e. about 80% capacity), the degradation is uneven. We should not expect a slow capacity loss after that - we could have fairly quick degradations and failures. May be some cells need to be replaced or in worst case we need a new battery.

 

[kovalb]

One suggestion to make the LEAF work for you. ECOtality is working hard to give away their charging stations to commercial locations. You could see if your place of work would be willing to talk with them. Then your commute with the LEAF would be a cake-walk.

 

[scottwilcox]

I am wondering if the LEAF would work for me as well. I drive less then 10 miles at about 35- 40 mph on most days There would be up to 3-4 stops during that trip so it would not be ideal. There are some days that I will drive as much as 20 miles and about 5 of those will be highway (up to 60 mph). There are 2 days a year that I would love to drive it but would be pushing the range I am afraid. I would be driving up to 40 miles in a single day and 20 miles would be highway speeds at about 55 MPH. After 20 miles I will be able to charge for about 7 hours but it will be only at the 110 volt level. I know Nissan is not wanting me to buy a LEAF because my area does not have public charging. I have a total of 5 cars counting my kids cars that I can use, so on the two days with the long round trips of 40 miles I could always use a ICE car. But who would not want to drive the LEAF as much as possible.

If anyone have any real world information that would help with the fears that Nissan is creating about range I would be greatful.

 

[91040]

It helps to know where you live, how hilly your routes are and if you need to use the heater a lot. First impression is that the LEAF can easily handle your longest round trip trip without charging!

Tony's range chart is here- http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?p=101293#p101293" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;. It gives the range at various speeds and covers conditions that will reduce range such as elevation, temperature, etc.

I am wondering if the LEAF would work for me as well. I drive less then 10 miles at about 35- 40 mph on most days There would be up to 3-4 stops during that trip so it would not be ideal. There are some days that I will drive as much as 20 miles and about 5 of those will be highway (up to 60 mph). There are 2 days a year that I would love to drive it but would be pushing the range I am afraid. I would be driving up to 40 miles in a single day and 20 miles would be highway speeds at about 55 MPH. After 20 miles I will be able to charge for about 7 hours but it will be only at the 110 volt level. I know Nissan is not wanting me to buy a LEAF because my area does not have public charging. I have a total of 5 cars counting my kids cars that I can use, so on the two days with the long round trips of 40 miles I could always use a ICE car. But who would not want to drive the LEAF as much as possible.

If anyone have any real world information that would help with the fears that Nissan is creating about range I would be greatful.

 

[Caracalover]

I am wondering if the LEAF would work for me as well. I drive less then 10 miles at about 35- 40 mph on most days There would be up to 3-4 stops during that trip so it would not be ideal. There are some days that I will drive as much as 20 miles and about 5 of those will be highway (up to 60 mph). There are 2 days a year that I would love to drive it but would be pushing the range I am afraid. I would be driving up to 40 miles in a single day and 20 miles would be highway speeds at about 55 MPH. After 20 miles I will be able to charge for about 7 hours but it will be only at the 110 volt level. I know Nissan is not wanting me to buy a LEAF because my area does not have public charging. I have a total of 5 cars counting my kids cars that I can use, so on the two days with the long round trips of 40 miles I could always use a ICE car. But who would not want to drive the LEAF as much as possible.

If anyone have any real world information that would help with the fears that Nissan is creating about range I would be greatful.

You are a perfect candidate for this car. Lots of stops are fine, they take energy just like with any car (Reduce MPG or KW/M), but they are not as hard on the car as one that has a starter, oil, crankcase, belts, etc. etc. Don't worry about charging infrastructure with your use, it will be charged up every day (Unless you forget to plug it in) at home while you sleep, and you won't need to charge it while out and about. If the RT is only 40 miles you will have no worries at all. If it was a total of 80 miles you would need to hypermile a bit to make it, and understanding the car will make even this possible. WIth 7 hours of charging at one end, you should be able to stay in the 80% club all year round which should give you a trouble free experience for many years, possibly decades (Even if you do forget to plug it in you will have plenty of charge to go several days with your description of use). I travel 70 miles one way every Sunday with an elevation change of 3000 feet. About 30 miles of it is at 65 mph, and the mountain inclines I take at around 35 MPH. I now have 12,000 miles and a lot of confidence that you will love this car with what you have described as your use.

To the Original Poster of this thread - the Leaf is all about efficient use of energy. On flat ground you should be able to get great M/KWH, as long as you try. It is a fun car to drive though, and the urge to use all 80KW of power to take off and go will tempt you often, so a confirmed charger at both ends would make a lot of sense. Questions to ask are what is the price of power where you live, and if you need to foot the bill, how much will it cost at work. With those numbers in hand figure 3 miles per KW and see what you would save by going electric. I say 3 M/KW because you may be charging at 120 which is not as effiecient as 240, and want you to get a worst case scenario, rather than a best case. I and many here average 4M/KW in the car, without the resistance losses factored in. You would likely get better than that, since I drive 70+ mph quite often and have mountains to deal with. I figure that I save about $20 every sunday when I use the Leaf on a 140 mile RT commute instead of a 25 mpg ICE. For you, that might be $20 a day, since electricity here is some of the highest in the country. By the end of the month I pay 24 cents a KWH with a residential tiered plan. Many people go to a time of use plan where they charge at less than a dime per KWH. After you figure that out, decide if the cost saving is worth the inconviences you will encounter, which may be minimal if you can get 120 at work, or are willing to add ten or twenty minutes to your daily commute each way. You sound like someone that will really enjoy the Leaf if you make the leap.

 

[abasile]

I would be driving up to 40 miles in a single day and 20 miles would be highway speeds at about 55 MPH.

Sounds like a piece of cake, unless perhaps you're dealing with super cold, perhaps sub-zero temperatures. At a constant 55 mph on flat ground in pleasant temperatures, your total range should be at least 80 miles. More than once, I've driven 50 miles with 5000 feet of net elevation gain on a single charge, with over 30 of those miles on the freeway at 55 mph, and didn't get much below the first "low battery" warning, meaning that I still had more charge left.

 

[TonyWilliams]

If anyone have any real world information that would help with the fears that Nissan is creating about range I would be greatful.

You are a perfect candidate for this car.

What he said. Easy peasy.